The Gigantic Mini DV Deck / Camcorder as Deck Thread

Ivan Hedley Enger · February 10th, 2003, 11:54 PM

Hi folks,

One question: Doesn´t it matter what kind of deck/camcorder you use. If it is a DV unit, the import with Firewire/iLink will stay in the same quality as imported directly from the XL1s, for example?

Ivan

Sandy Kaye · February 11th, 2003, 03:06 AM

It's not the deck or cam you're playing the dv off of, it's the capture board you're recording (capturing) into.
The deck or cam should be sending straight digital info with no compression.

I use a Sony dsr-40. Love the various input and output connex- aka S video out, and flawless (knock on wood) machine control via Premiere and my DV500 (onboard capture card.) (the dv500 does change the input 'quality' into it's own codec. Tho they'll tell you it's lossless compression.)

Max Mishler · February 24th, 2003, 07:09 PM

Curious if anyone has used a ZR40 as a deck to save on the heads of their GL2. onecall.com has factory refurbished units for 350 bucks and they are a canon authorized dealer. I know they aren't a board sponsor but I don't think board sponsors are offering these units refurbished so hopefully I'm not breaking the rules. Just looking at options...

Max

Ken Tanaka · February 24th, 2003, 09:48 PM

Max,
I'm not a big fan of using small cams as decks for a variety of reasons, the most prominent of which are as follows.

1. Small, consumer cameras' transports are just not designed for heavy deck use, especially if it involves alot of cueing starts/stops.

2. If you ultimately end up buying a deck, you will have basically paid the price of the deck plus the price of one (or more) inexpensive camcorders for that deck.

On average, how many hours of footage do you capture in a week?

Don Palomaki · February 25th, 2003, 05:14 AM

Some people have used the small cameras as decks with success. While tape handling is not very robust as would be the case with a real deck they are low cost, work for occasional editing, and give a limited backup camera capability as a bonus.

Barrie M. Yacher · March 4th, 2003, 10:10 PM

Is there a recommended robust deck that be can used to play back our little mini tapes? I ask this in follow up to the general discussion of whether you can get by with using a cheaper mini camera to serve as your deck.

Ken Tanaka · March 4th, 2003, 10:19 PM

Hello Barrie,
I really like the Panasonic AG-DV1000 deck for miniDV-only. I've used one for over 2 years and had no troubles. Firewire-equipped, great for captures, very robust, small and lightweight, under $1,000.

Don Palomaki · March 5th, 2003, 04:40 AM

I've been using a Sony DHR-1000 for about 4 years now. Works well, and it does full size tape too, allowing projects up to 3 hours to be dumped to a single tape tape. It supports both FIREWIRE and LANC control.

Bud Kuenzli · March 5th, 2003, 09:38 AM

I've used my camera as a deck in the past but now that I'm getting a GL2 I'd prefer to find an inexpensive deck. I'm not a pro; at least I'm not currently making any money from this so I can only afford an inexpensive deck. Anyone done any research recently on inexpensive decks? I only need the most rudimentary functions. If there are no decks under $500 I'll probably get a refurb camera to use as a deck.

Chris Tuller · March 5th, 2003, 01:05 PM

I've been looking for an affordable solution too. Cheap (less than $800.00 or so) VTR's do not exist. Probably because there is a fairly small market for such a soecialized piece of gear.
The average consumer/pro-sumer of a miniDV cam generally is not in the market for one, and the pro level user wants one that will work for pro level jobs (i.e. lots of hours of play time + with the features demanded by the industry).
So i'm just going to bite the bullet and get a JVC VS30U. It's about $820 from Pro-Tape or Zotz and it gives tha added bonus of being able to dub to S-VHS.

The other options are use the GL2 (if less than a couple hours of tape per week) or buy a basic consumer cam like the ZR40 (about $400)

Hope this helps,
c

Michael Westphal · March 5th, 2003, 07:16 PM

I was thinking of buying a vs30U until I read some of the threads here and on dv.com. The vs30u has a bad rep for its firewire implementation. BUT, I don't own one and have never seen one. Your mileage may vary. You may want to do a bit more research before getting one.

Dylan Couper · March 5th, 2003, 08:01 PM

Bud, the only miniDV deck you are going to get under $500 is a Canon ZR40 or similar camcorder. It's actually fairly ergonomic as a video deck. Sitting normally, you flip the LCD screen to sit flat against the camera, facing out, and have all the VCR buttons sitting right in front of you. The tape loads from the bottom which is so-so, but for the price, most people can live with it.

Plus it's a camcorder! Who couldn't use a second camera?

Keith Luken · March 6th, 2003, 12:50 PM

I use my ZR45 as a deck to save my GL2. But I essentially only import video from tape then edit and then usually export the finished product out to another tape (for archival). I don't use the cam for frequent or rapid tape repositioning, simplyt import a tape then export. IT work great for that and becomes a second bum around cam to use where I woudl not bring the GL2.

Will Fastie · March 6th, 2003, 07:37 PM

buydig.com has ZR40s for $409, ZR60s for $425.

I have a GL2 and am looking very hard at the ZR60 as a deck. Part of this is superstition, my thinking that my tapes will be safer if they are used only on Canon transports. And I do like the notion of having a backup cam.

But see the comments in the "ZR40 as Deck" thread in this forum.

Steve Nunez · March 7th, 2003, 08:07 AM

Take a look at Panasonic Palmcorders- they're inexpensive and produce fairly nice video themselves. I use one and have had zero problems with it. And since many here use/recommend Panasonic Mini-DV tapes- we know their wont be issues with tape types......good luck.

February 11th, 2003, 03:06 AM	#137
Sandy Kaye New Boot Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Silverlake, CA Posts: 16	It's not the deck or cam you're playing the dv off of, it's the capture board you're recording (capturing) into. The deck or cam should be sending straight digital info with no compression. I use a Sony dsr-40. Love the various input and output connex- aka S video out, and flawless (knock on wood) machine control via Premiere and my DV500 (onboard capture card.) (the dv500 does change the input 'quality' into it's own codec. Tho they'll tell you it's lossless compression.) __________________ i've seen evil and it's name is pc

February 24th, 2003, 07:09 PM	#138
Max Mishler Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Myrtle Beach, SC Posts: 53	ZR-40 as a deck? Curious if anyone has used a ZR40 as a deck to save on the heads of their GL2. onecall.com has factory refurbished units for 350 bucks and they are a canon authorized dealer. I know they aren't a board sponsor but I don't think board sponsors are offering these units refurbished so hopefully I'm not breaking the rules. Just looking at options... Max

February 24th, 2003, 09:48 PM	#139
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Max, I'm not a big fan of using small cams as decks for a variety of reasons, the most prominent of which are as follows. 1. Small, consumer cameras' transports are just not designed for heavy deck use, especially if it involves alot of cueing starts/stops. 2. If you ultimately end up buying a deck, you will have basically paid the price of the deck plus the price of one (or more) inexpensive camcorders for that deck. On average, how many hours of footage do you capture in a week? __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

March 4th, 2003, 10:19 PM	#142
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Hello Barrie, I really like the Panasonic AG-DV1000 deck for miniDV-only. I've used one for over 2 years and had no troubles. Firewire-equipped, great for captures, very robust, small and lightweight, under $1,000. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

March 5th, 2003, 09:38 AM	#144
Bud Kuenzli Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: North Pole, Alaska Posts: 197	cheapest deck ? I've used my camera as a deck in the past but now that I'm getting a GL2 I'd prefer to find an inexpensive deck. I'm not a pro; at least I'm not currently making any money from this so I can only afford an inexpensive deck. Anyone done any research recently on inexpensive decks? I only need the most rudimentary functions. If there are no decks under $500 I'll probably get a refurb camera to use as a deck.

February 10th, 2003, 11:54 PM	#136
Ivan Hedley Enger Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Vestfold in Norway Posts: 103	Hi folks, One question: Doesn´t it matter what kind of deck/camcorder you use. If it is a DV unit, the import with Firewire/iLink will stay in the same quality as imported directly from the XL1s, for example? Ivan

February 25th, 2003, 05:14 AM	#140
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,489	Some people have used the small cameras as decks with success. While tape handling is not very robust as would be the case with a real deck they are low cost, work for occasional editing, and give a limited backup camera capability as a bonus.

March 4th, 2003, 10:10 PM	#141
Barrie M. Yacher New Boot Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Chicago, Illinois, 3 blocks from Wrigley Field Posts: 14	Is there a recommended robust deck that be can used to play back our little mini tapes? I ask this in follow up to the general discussion of whether you can get by with using a cheaper mini camera to serve as your deck.

March 5th, 2003, 04:40 AM	#143
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,489	I've been using a Sony DHR-1000 for about 4 years now. Works well, and it does full size tape too, allowing projects up to 3 hours to be dumped to a single tape tape. It supports both FIREWIRE and LANC control.

March 5th, 2003, 01:05 PM	#145
Chris Tuller New Boot Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 9	I've been looking for an affordable solution too. Cheap (less than $800.00 or so) VTR's do not exist. Probably because there is a fairly small market for such a soecialized piece of gear. The average consumer/pro-sumer of a miniDV cam generally is not in the market for one, and the pro level user wants one that will work for pro level jobs (i.e. lots of hours of play time + with the features demanded by the industry). So i'm just going to bite the bullet and get a JVC VS30U. It's about $820 from Pro-Tape or Zotz and it gives tha added bonus of being able to dub to S-VHS. The other options are use the GL2 (if less than a couple hours of tape per week) or buy a basic consumer cam like the ZR40 (about $400) Hope this helps, c

March 5th, 2003, 07:16 PM	#146
Michael Westphal Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Baton Rouge, LA Posts: 166	I was thinking of buying a vs30U until I read some of the threads here and on dv.com. The vs30u has a bad rep for its firewire implementation. BUT, I don't own one and have never seen one. Your mileage may vary. You may want to do a bit more research before getting one. __________________ Michael A Westphal

March 5th, 2003, 08:01 PM	#147
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	Bud, the only miniDV deck you are going to get under $500 is a Canon ZR40 or similar camcorder. It's actually fairly ergonomic as a video deck. Sitting normally, you flip the LCD screen to sit flat against the camera, facing out, and have all the VCR buttons sitting right in front of you. The tape loads from the bottom which is so-so, but for the price, most people can live with it. Plus it's a camcorder! Who couldn't use a second camera? __________________ Need to rent camera gear in Vancouver BC? Check me out at camerarentalsvancouver.com

March 6th, 2003, 12:50 PM	#148
Keith Luken Major Player Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 200	I use my ZR45 as a deck to save my GL2. But I essentially only import video from tape then edit and then usually export the finished product out to another tape (for archival). I don't use the cam for frequent or rapid tape repositioning, simplyt import a tape then export. IT work great for that and becomes a second bum around cam to use where I woudl not bring the GL2.

March 6th, 2003, 07:37 PM	#149
Will Fastie Major Player Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Jarrettsville, MD Posts: 353	buydig.com has ZR40s for $409, ZR60s for $425. I have a GL2 and am looking very hard at the ZR60 as a deck. Part of this is superstition, my thinking that my tapes will be safer if they are used only on Canon transports. And I do like the notion of having a backup cam. But see the comments in the "ZR40 as Deck" thread in this forum.

March 7th, 2003, 08:07 AM	#150
Steve Nunez Trustee Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Pembroke Pines, Florida Posts: 1,418	Take a look at Panasonic Palmcorders- they're inexpensive and produce fairly nice video themselves. I use one and have had zero problems with it. And since many here use/recommend Panasonic Mini-DV tapes- we know their wont be issues with tape types......good luck. __________________ Steve Nunez-New York City www.stevenunez.com