DV Tape Rewinder

Mark A. Foley · June 23rd, 2004, 04:49 AM

Thanks for the response Steve....
I may go ahead and use the rewinder based on low use of the tapes as you mention. My record process is this:

1. FF and Rewind the tape just prior to use.

2. Record once and then rewind for capture

I beginning to believe with this short use the rewinder shouldn't have much effect on the tape...

Thoughts anyone?

Mikko Wilson · July 21st, 2004, 12:56 PM

Sorta off the topic, but a kinda neat trick for anyone out there using Digital8..
As you've probably noticed, a Digi8 camera is RIDICULOUSLY slow at rewinding - i'm sure i coudl hand crank faster.
however it's still a 8mm tape.. got a Hi8 or 8mm camera or deck lying around? stick your Digi8 tape in that and hit Rewind (or FF) presto, nice fast transport! - good luck reading timecode off it tho. :-P

- Mikko

Jody Hadachek · September 30th, 2004, 05:38 PM

Well unfortunately, my XL1s has started to eat my tapes when it re-winds. I did a search and there were other folks that have had the same problem. They all say the same thing, send it in to get it worked on. However, right now I can't be without my camera as I need it for some shoots. Until I can send it in, what would be a quality mini-DV rewinder to buy?? I heard that the cheaper ones give you an even greater risk of having a tape eaten up. I need something that will work ...... can you help me?

Glenn Chan · September 30th, 2004, 05:41 PM

What about getting a cheaper camcorder? It is a cheap way to get a deck for capturing footage. This will save wear and tear on your XL1. If you shoot a lot, it is a good idea to get a deck (or cheap camcorder) for capturing footage. Repairing a XL1 whose heads have worn down costs several hundred dollars.

Jody Hadachek · September 30th, 2004, 05:51 PM

Hey Glenn,

Do you mean buy a cheaper mini dv camcorder to view your footage on, and just use the XL1s for recording purposes? I need the quality of the XL1s for my shoots ....

Glenn Chan · September 30th, 2004, 06:19 PM

You can get a cheap used/second hand mini-DV camcorder to capture DV footage into your computer.

It will give you the exact same quality since it's 1s and 0s being transferred.*

*caveats: There are situations where there are errors in the 1s and 0s being transferred, which causes dropouts.

If you record LP mode in the XL1, it may be that the XL1 that recorded the footage is the best at reading that particular tape. You could/should avoid LP mode and use 80min DV tapes instead of LP mode. Avoid LP mode to avoid these problems.

In other scenarios, the quality of the deck/camcorder will affect how well it reads tape. Head alignment is also a factor. Cheap camcorders might give you problems here- I have a Samsung SCD55 that does this (avoid Samsung). Sony Panasonic and Canon cameras don't have these problems in my experience.

A professional USD$1500+ deck may be more likely to capture DV without dropouts. In practice however, you should find that dropouts are very rare and when they do occur:
A- It's a minor glitch and doesn't really affect final product quality. One dropout is not a big deal.
B- You may be able to re-capture.
C- Visual dropouts are easily fixable with Photoshop magic.
D- Audio dropouts do occur, and they are not easily fixable. However, they are even rarer than video dropouts.

So in conclusion... you should probably get a cheap mini-DV camcorder. I prefer Sony Canon Panasonic just so they have decent deck control and decent quality as a deck (my Samsung does NOT have this). I'd lean towards an old Panasonic camcorder. Old camcorders may have features new ones lack (analog-digital passthrough, bottom loading). Those things don't make a huge difference though.

Jody Hadachek · September 30th, 2004, 06:40 PM

Glen,

I really appreciate your input on this. Let me give you the skinny on my recording needs. When I record hunts, I do so on a freelance basis. I don't do any of my own editing or real capturing. I record the footage, and then send the tapes off and the production company will edit at their own desire. So basically, I need something to rewind the mini DV tapes simply to see what I put down and see what else I need to record as supplemental footage. That's it. I know I need to fix the XL1s - but I start filming hunts tomorrow and can't be without it. Do you still think a cheaper mini-DV would work for just viewing/re-winding footage I've put down? Sorry if I'm being a pain with this!!!

Barry Gribble · September 30th, 2004, 06:46 PM

Jody,

Yes, exactly. I shoot all of my footage on my XL1 and never play or rewind anything back in it. For that I use a Canon ZR40, the lowest end MiniDV camera - it replays the XL1 footage perfectly. It is much cheaper than an actual DV deck (not sure about cost of rewinders) and it gives the secondary advantage of being a fine home video camera for shooting things that I don't want to lug the XL1 out to.

Best Buy has this level camera starting at just over $300. Other places will be cheaper.

Good luck.

Jody Hadachek · September 30th, 2004, 06:55 PM

Barry ... thank you!!

Wayne Starick · October 2nd, 2004, 11:51 PM

I bought a dedicated rewinder - brand name Kinyo. It cost me about $50 Oz dollars.

http://www.videoguys.com.au/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=242

Ronald Lee · October 3rd, 2004, 06:17 PM

I am selling a dedicated miniDV rewinder. Bought it from B&H in May, it does fast forwarding as well as rewinding. Email me for pics and more info.

Pete Gregar · March 18th, 2005, 10:35 PM

What should I look for in a tape rewinder for my Canon GL-2?

These are mini-DV tapes

Tim Brechlin · March 21st, 2005, 03:56 AM

Generally, I'd advise you to use a cheap MiniDV camcorder as a rewinder/player. The problem with rewinders is that they have no slow-down function, so you slam into the end of the tape hardcore. After a tape goes through four or five runs on that rewinder, you'll have a noticeable degradation in quality.

Pete Gregar · March 21st, 2005, 06:12 AM

Would I also be able to use another miniDV to transfer video to my PC?

Assuming it has stereo sound, will the quality be the same as my GL-2?

Tim Brechlin · March 21st, 2005, 02:18 PM

Assuming that the camcorder has a FireWire-out port, as almost all of them do nowadays, then yep, you can use it to transfer your footage.

As for quality...well, the footage and audio has already been recorded and committed to tape by the GL-2. It's not like the other camcorder is re-recording your audio or anything like that.

July 21st, 2004, 12:56 PM	#32
Mikko Wilson Major Player Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Juneau, Alaska, USA Posts: 624	Sorta off the topic, but a kinda neat trick for anyone out there using Digital8.. As you've probably noticed, a Digi8 camera is RIDICULOUSLY slow at rewinding - i'm sure i coudl hand crank faster. however it's still a 8mm tape.. got a Hi8 or 8mm camera or deck lying around? stick your Digi8 tape in that and hit Rewind (or FF) presto, nice fast transport! - good luck reading timecode off it tho. :-P - Mikko __________________ Mikko Wilson - Steadicam Owner / Operator - Juneau, Alaska, USA +1 (907) 321-8387 - mikkowilson@hotmail.com - www.mikkowilson.com

September 30th, 2004, 05:38 PM	#33
Jody Hadachek New Boot Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 16	What mini-DV rewinder to buy??? Well unfortunately, my XL1s has started to eat my tapes when it re-winds. I did a search and there were other folks that have had the same problem. They all say the same thing, send it in to get it worked on. However, right now I can't be without my camera as I need it for some shoots. Until I can send it in, what would be a quality mini-DV rewinder to buy?? I heard that the cheaper ones give you an even greater risk of having a tape eaten up. I need something that will work ...... can you help me?

September 30th, 2004, 06:46 PM	#38
Barry Gribble Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 817	Jody, Yes, exactly. I shoot all of my footage on my XL1 and never play or rewind anything back in it. For that I use a Canon ZR40, the lowest end MiniDV camera - it replays the XL1 footage perfectly. It is much cheaper than an actual DV deck (not sure about cost of rewinders) and it gives the secondary advantage of being a fine home video camera for shooting things that I don't want to lug the XL1 out to. Best Buy has this level camera starting at just over $300. Other places will be cheaper. Good luck. __________________ Barry Gribble Integral Arts, IMDB

October 2nd, 2004, 11:51 PM	#40
Wayne Starick Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Australia Posts: 66	I bought a dedicated rewinder - brand name Kinyo. It cost me about $50 Oz dollars. http://www.videoguys.com.au/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=242 __________________ Wayne If there's no Internet in Heaven, I'm not going!

March 18th, 2005, 10:35 PM	#42
Pete Gregar New Boot Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Chicago Posts: 12	tape rewinder What should I look for in a tape rewinder for my Canon GL-2? These are mini-DV tapes

June 23rd, 2004, 04:49 AM	#31
Mark A. Foley Major Player Join Date: May 2003 Location: Bonaire, Ga. Posts: 356	Thanks for the response Steve.... I may go ahead and use the rewinder based on low use of the tapes as you mention. My record process is this: 1. FF and Rewind the tape just prior to use. 2. Record once and then rewind for capture I beginning to believe with this short use the rewinder shouldn't have much effect on the tape... Thoughts anyone?

September 30th, 2004, 05:41 PM	#34
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	What about getting a cheaper camcorder? It is a cheap way to get a deck for capturing footage. This will save wear and tear on your XL1. If you shoot a lot, it is a good idea to get a deck (or cheap camcorder) for capturing footage. Repairing a XL1 whose heads have worn down costs several hundred dollars.

September 30th, 2004, 05:51 PM	#35
Jody Hadachek New Boot Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 16	Hey Glenn, Do you mean buy a cheaper mini dv camcorder to view your footage on, and just use the XL1s for recording purposes? I need the quality of the XL1s for my shoots ....

September 30th, 2004, 06:19 PM	#36
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	You can get a cheap used/second hand mini-DV camcorder to capture DV footage into your computer. It will give you the exact same quality since it's 1s and 0s being transferred.* *caveats: There are situations where there are errors in the 1s and 0s being transferred, which causes dropouts. If you record LP mode in the XL1, it may be that the XL1 that recorded the footage is the best at reading that particular tape. You could/should avoid LP mode and use 80min DV tapes instead of LP mode. Avoid LP mode to avoid these problems. In other scenarios, the quality of the deck/camcorder will affect how well it reads tape. Head alignment is also a factor. Cheap camcorders might give you problems here- I have a Samsung SCD55 that does this (avoid Samsung). Sony Panasonic and Canon cameras don't have these problems in my experience. A professional USD$1500+ deck may be more likely to capture DV without dropouts. In practice however, you should find that dropouts are very rare and when they do occur: A- It's a minor glitch and doesn't really affect final product quality. One dropout is not a big deal. B- You may be able to re-capture. C- Visual dropouts are easily fixable with Photoshop magic. D- Audio dropouts do occur, and they are not easily fixable. However, they are even rarer than video dropouts. So in conclusion... you should probably get a cheap mini-DV camcorder. I prefer Sony Canon Panasonic just so they have decent deck control and decent quality as a deck (my Samsung does NOT have this). I'd lean towards an old Panasonic camcorder. Old camcorders may have features new ones lack (analog-digital passthrough, bottom loading). Those things don't make a huge difference though.

September 30th, 2004, 06:40 PM	#37
Jody Hadachek New Boot Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 16	Glen, I really appreciate your input on this. Let me give you the skinny on my recording needs. When I record hunts, I do so on a freelance basis. I don't do any of my own editing or real capturing. I record the footage, and then send the tapes off and the production company will edit at their own desire. So basically, I need something to rewind the mini DV tapes simply to see what I put down and see what else I need to record as supplemental footage. That's it. I know I need to fix the XL1s - but I start filming hunts tomorrow and can't be without it. Do you still think a cheaper mini-DV would work for just viewing/re-winding footage I've put down? Sorry if I'm being a pain with this!!!

September 30th, 2004, 06:55 PM	#39
Jody Hadachek New Boot Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 16	Barry ... thank you!!

October 3rd, 2004, 06:17 PM	#41
Ronald Lee Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 435	I am selling a dedicated miniDV rewinder. Bought it from B&H in May, it does fast forwarding as well as rewinding. Email me for pics and more info.

March 21st, 2005, 03:56 AM	#43
Tim Brechlin Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Dubuque, IA Posts: 39	Generally, I'd advise you to use a cheap MiniDV camcorder as a rewinder/player. The problem with rewinders is that they have no slow-down function, so you slam into the end of the tape hardcore. After a tape goes through four or five runs on that rewinder, you'll have a noticeable degradation in quality.

March 21st, 2005, 06:12 AM	#44
Pete Gregar New Boot Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Chicago Posts: 12	Would I also be able to use another miniDV to transfer video to my PC? Assuming it has stereo sound, will the quality be the same as my GL-2?

March 21st, 2005, 02:18 PM	#45
Tim Brechlin Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Dubuque, IA Posts: 39	Assuming that the camcorder has a FireWire-out port, as almost all of them do nowadays, then yep, you can use it to transfer your footage. As for quality...well, the footage and audio has already been recorded and committed to tape by the GL-2. It's not like the other camcorder is re-recording your audio or anything like that.