BBC test of 890

[Scott Berrington]

Not sure if this has been posted in the forum, but here is the BBC test of the 890.

https://tech.ebu.ch/docs/tech/tech3335_s14.pdf

[Mike Bailey]

Thanks Scott--it's good to get an engineer suggestions on setup for the 890 and presumably the 850.

[Simon Denny]

The 850 is really the best JVC camera they have produced in my opinion and also the 600/650
I'm about to add these into my kit.

[Scott Berrington]

I agree, the new cameras are a definite improvement over the 700 series. I'm thinking about an 850 to replace my 700...but the trend towards large sensor and 4k has me thinking twice. Maybe I need both;)

The test of the 890 by Mr. Roberts is encouraging. I was impressed by the dynamic range and low noise results, and the fact that the 800 series cameras are 2 stops faster than my 700...that would be handy.

My only worry is going from CCD to CMOS and the associated issues. I shoot with CMOS cameras all the time without issue, so I need to get over this.

Thoughts?

[Paul Anderegg]

2 stops faster? So the 890 my station is getting me soon will see at night at 0db what it takes my current 790 12db to see? f10@2000 vs f11@2000 isn't that big of a difference. My Panasonic SPX800 was f13@2000, and had about a 9db advantage side by side with my 790 in testing.

Paul

[Scott Berrington]

I rate my 700 at about f5.6 or around ISO 200-250(1080 30p @ 1/60th). I found 9db was the maximum gain I would use, anymore is too noisy.

[Phil Goetz]

BBC needs 50mb/sec minimum right?

[Glen Vandermolen]

Originally Posted by Phil Goetz

BBC needs 50mb/sec minimum right?

It depends on the "tier." For journalism, "tier 2," which is under 50mbps, is accepted.
For bigger productions, like documentaries and narrative shows, 50mbps is the minimum requirement. Of course, if it's like in the US, there's always exceptions.
And BBC now conforms to EBU's standards.

[David Heath]

Originally Posted by Phil Goetz

BBC needs 50mb/sec minimum right?

And as long as a long-GOP codec - if I-frame only it's 100Mbs.

Otherwise it's as Glen says - 50Mbs for main stream programming, 35Mbs for news.

(If the programme requirements are generally for 50Mbs, lower category material can be used for a limited amount - but is classed the same as Standard Def and archive. A case has to be made if the total amount of these is more than a certain percentage.)

[Mark Hanlen]

We purchased the 890 earlier this year for in house video recording of events. It's a nice camera but the stock 20x lens we exchanged through our dealer for a 17x. The low light performance of the 20x isn't great, and I'd rather sacrifice OIS and get better low light performance. Although the OIS of the 20x did work well, but most of the time the camera was fully zoomed and 3.0f is unacceptable inside a dimly lit hotel ballroom. I'm still trying to get the noise under control in the blacks though- so maybe I need to shoot in standard instead of cinema gamma?

[Scott Berrington]

The kit lens is a good lens I'm sure, but loosing 2 stops at the tele end is too much. As for gamma settings, try the standard gamma with a bit of black toe compress, it should give you more contrast and lower noise.

[Mark Hanlen]

I'll try that. I'm a bit unhappy with the noise I see in dark clothing- but skin tones and lighter clothing are always nice and clean. Yeah, losing two full stops at zoom was a killer for us. The 20x was nice, but I prefer a faster lens, with just a touch less zoom.

[Paul Anderegg]

If the cine gamma is the same as the 790, then you will probably see blacks get very deep compared to standard. Obviously this is meant to bring down the whole image to decrease noise, but it seems to require a LOT of light.

Also, on my 790, as you slow down the shutter speed (1/30 vs 1/60) or gain up considerably, the 790 (890 too?) the blacks are brought up a bit. I find level 1 black compress button puts them back in their place nicely.

Paul

[Scott Berrington]

I'm surprised that you're seeing that much noise, the EBU test report seems to suggest it's a clean image for 1/3" sensors. Mr. Johnston at HD Warrior raved about how clean the camera is.

Mark, can you post a sample?

[Mark Hanlen]

Yeah I'll see what I can do. Most of the stuff is at work on a Hard Drive. I have a few streaming samples I can link, but it doesn't show the noise I get sometimes in lower light. Mind you, we are primarily a hotel AV company, and because we have only basic source 4/ leko lights to work with, and low ceilings in our ballrooms, we often have to compromise by setting the lights on 10 foot poles- and we are often forced to use un-diffused lekos as our lighting- because we often use projection (light can't bleed onto the screen). That and we have to comply with those who say the lights are too bright and turn them down. I'll need to upload a sample tomorrow that hasn't been compressed by FMLE like this example was from streaming.

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