Another lens question....a little different application. at DVinfo.net

Calvin Bellows · August 2nd, 2010, 08:41 PM

Hello everyone. I know there is a lot of talk on here about lenses and wide angles. I'm going to go the other way and want to get a good long zoom. I am working on putting a mobile together and need to get tighter shots for sporting events. I am wondering what the forum here things I should do. I am using the HM 700 with plans to purchase the 790. Now Canon and Fujinon both make studio lenses that they showed off at NAB they are 2/3 which are good since that will help with the magnification. Canon and Fujinon both make normal ENG lenses that are 2/3 as well. We also have 1/3 lenses that have extenders. The big question. What do you do? Here are some links.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/669606-REG/Canon_HJ22X76BIASEA_HJ22x7_6B_IASE_A_e_HDxs_Compact_High.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/489936-REG/Fujinon_XA17x7_6BERM_M58B_XA17x7_6BERM_17x_2_3_Panasonic.html

JVC Professional Features page

JVC Professional Features page

The main use for these lenses will be for hockey but there is a chance for football, lacrosse etc. Also is there a difference between lenses that say HD and ones that don't.

Thanks.

Ben Lynn · August 5th, 2010, 08:43 PM

Calvin,

What type of application will the lenses be used for? Specifically, are you talking about shooting handheld or is this for a build up where the camera is on a tripod for the event? If it's on a tripod, are you using it as a game camera (the main camera that gets all the action) or an iso camera (a camera that is tight on a single player)?

There is a quality difference between the HD and SD lenses but you may or may not notice it. A lot of it depends on how picky you are about the image quality. There might be a very slight bit of CA on an sd lens while an HD lens will have a higher clarity and should have little to no CA, especially the broadcast lenses. If you have have access to a 2/3" SD lens you should try it and run some tests to determine if an sd lens would work or not.

The lenses you linked to may or may not work because of the magnification factor of the 2/3" adapter for the JVC's. I don't think you'll have to worry about the tight side of the lens. 33x's with extenders would be good for most sports iso applications. But on the wide side, those lenses are only at a 7.6. With the adapter, that translates into lets say a 14x at full wide. If you're using the camera as a game camera, that may or may not be wide enough. You can test this by taking your stock Canon 14x and zooming in all the way (if your using a Fuji 16 or 17x then zoom it in to the 450mm mark roughly). At that point, that's as wide as those broadcast lenses will get on your jvc. If the zoomed in Canon is wide enough to serve as a game camera then you'll be ok. I guess if you keep the old lenses you could always switch it out based on the venue needs and camera assignments.

Let me know more about those camera assignments.

Calvin Bellows · August 5th, 2010, 10:01 PM

I would use the stock lens for the game camera and whatever I decide as an iso. They would be on sticks. I'm just tying to justify the cost of a box lens right out of the gate. Thanks for the input so far, I'll try and track down a 2/3 that I could try out and see how that works for me.

Ben Lynn · August 6th, 2010, 04:11 PM

Justifying the cost is always the tricky part. Multi-year contracts are becoming a rarity and sponsor advertising is low. If you have a big contract and can pay for the lens within the first season then it might be worth the investment. But it may not be a good purchase if you're planning on paying for it through a multi-sport, multi-year deal that you is based on potential and not a written contract. The broadcast industry is volatile right now and even a great season of coverage might not result in a second year contract for you. Productions are based on advertising revenue as much as quality coverage and a low advertising year may affect you as much as anything you do with the camera.

I would think that a quality 2/3" SD broadcast lens would work fine on the jvc for iso purposes. Shoot some sample footage with the stock lens and with the 2/3" lens and see how they compare on a production monitor. The glass in the stock lens isn't as high quality as the glass in the lenses you were looking at and the 2/3" SD lens might actually match up well. Again, testing will be the best way to confirm that. And test the lens at the full range. You're most likely to notice CA at the end of the lens, which is where the iso camera would be shooting a lot of the time. So really look at the shots with the camera full tight, outdoors, and in bright sunlight.

Are you planning to purchase a full live event build-up for the 790? That would mean that in addition to the sled you also get the lens controllers for the zoom and focus as well as the top mount viewfinder. The lens is important but those other items are just as critical. And I would assume you'll use a good tripod to not only handle the weight but provide the smooth control you want for an assignment like that. I'm sure you won't forget those things but it's worth mentioning again because they have such an effect on the overall production quality.

Calvin Bellows · August 6th, 2010, 09:39 PM

Thanks for the input Ben. I agree about how the industry is right now and I would be working year to year sport to sport. The lens I listed were just the first ones I saw and copied them in here. If you have an idea of a good 2/3 lens I could try by all means send your suggestions my way. I am not planning on a full studio build up due to the nature of the economy right now but it is my goal to eventually have a full studio set up for each camera.

August 2nd, 2010, 08:41 PM	#1
Calvin Bellows Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Red Deer, Alberta Posts: 215	Another lens question....a little different application. Hello everyone. I know there is a lot of talk on here about lenses and wide angles. I'm going to go the other way and want to get a good long zoom. I am working on putting a mobile together and need to get tighter shots for sporting events. I am wondering what the forum here things I should do. I am using the HM 700 with plans to purchase the 790. Now Canon and Fujinon both make studio lenses that they showed off at NAB they are 2/3 which are good since that will help with the magnification. Canon and Fujinon both make normal ENG lenses that are 2/3 as well. We also have 1/3 lenses that have extenders. The big question. What do you do? Here are some links. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/669606-REG/Canon_HJ22X76BIASEA_HJ22x7_6B_IASE_A_e_HDxs_Compact_High.html http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/489936-REG/Fujinon_XA17x7_6BERM_M58B_XA17x7_6BERM_17x_2_3_Panasonic.html JVC Professional Features page JVC Professional Features page The main use for these lenses will be for hockey but there is a chance for football, lacrosse etc. Also is there a difference between lenses that say HD and ones that don't. Thanks. __________________ Calvin Bellows www.exposureproductions.ca

August 5th, 2010, 10:01 PM	#3
Calvin Bellows Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Red Deer, Alberta Posts: 215	I would use the stock lens for the game camera and whatever I decide as an iso. They would be on sticks. I'm just tying to justify the cost of a box lens right out of the gate. Thanks for the input so far, I'll try and track down a 2/3 that I could try out and see how that works for me. __________________ Calvin Bellows www.exposureproductions.ca

August 6th, 2010, 09:39 PM	#5
Calvin Bellows Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Red Deer, Alberta Posts: 215	Thanks for the input Ben. I agree about how the industry is right now and I would be working year to year sport to sport. The lens I listed were just the first ones I saw and copied them in here. If you have an idea of a good 2/3 lens I could try by all means send your suggestions my way. I am not planning on a full studio build up due to the nature of the economy right now but it is my goal to eventually have a full studio set up for each camera. __________________ Calvin Bellows www.exposureproductions.ca

August 5th, 2010, 08:43 PM	#2
Ben Lynn Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bloomington, IL Posts: 636	Calvin, What type of application will the lenses be used for? Specifically, are you talking about shooting handheld or is this for a build up where the camera is on a tripod for the event? If it's on a tripod, are you using it as a game camera (the main camera that gets all the action) or an iso camera (a camera that is tight on a single player)? There is a quality difference between the HD and SD lenses but you may or may not notice it. A lot of it depends on how picky you are about the image quality. There might be a very slight bit of CA on an sd lens while an HD lens will have a higher clarity and should have little to no CA, especially the broadcast lenses. If you have have access to a 2/3" SD lens you should try it and run some tests to determine if an sd lens would work or not. The lenses you linked to may or may not work because of the magnification factor of the 2/3" adapter for the JVC's. I don't think you'll have to worry about the tight side of the lens. 33x's with extenders would be good for most sports iso applications. But on the wide side, those lenses are only at a 7.6. With the adapter, that translates into lets say a 14x at full wide. If you're using the camera as a game camera, that may or may not be wide enough. You can test this by taking your stock Canon 14x and zooming in all the way (if your using a Fuji 16 or 17x then zoom it in to the 450mm mark roughly). At that point, that's as wide as those broadcast lenses will get on your jvc. If the zoomed in Canon is wide enough to serve as a game camera then you'll be ok. I guess if you keep the old lenses you could always switch it out based on the venue needs and camera assignments. Let me know more about those camera assignments.

August 6th, 2010, 04:11 PM	#4
Ben Lynn Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bloomington, IL Posts: 636	Justifying the cost is always the tricky part. Multi-year contracts are becoming a rarity and sponsor advertising is low. If you have a big contract and can pay for the lens within the first season then it might be worth the investment. But it may not be a good purchase if you're planning on paying for it through a multi-sport, multi-year deal that you is based on potential and not a written contract. The broadcast industry is volatile right now and even a great season of coverage might not result in a second year contract for you. Productions are based on advertising revenue as much as quality coverage and a low advertising year may affect you as much as anything you do with the camera. I would think that a quality 2/3" SD broadcast lens would work fine on the jvc for iso purposes. Shoot some sample footage with the stock lens and with the 2/3" lens and see how they compare on a production monitor. The glass in the stock lens isn't as high quality as the glass in the lenses you were looking at and the 2/3" SD lens might actually match up well. Again, testing will be the best way to confirm that. And test the lens at the full range. You're most likely to notice CA at the end of the lens, which is where the iso camera would be shooting a lot of the time. So really look at the shots with the camera full tight, outdoors, and in bright sunlight. Are you planning to purchase a full live event build-up for the 790? That would mean that in addition to the sled you also get the lens controllers for the zoom and focus as well as the top mount viewfinder. The lens is important but those other items are just as critical. And I would assume you'll use a good tripod to not only handle the weight but provide the smooth control you want for an assignment like that. I'm sure you won't forget those things but it's worth mentioning again because they have such an effect on the overall production quality.