New GY-HM700 Camcorder

Shaun Roemich · January 23rd, 2009, 03:42 PM

Thanks Tim. The new cameras are going to take some getting used to, from a point of nomenclature.

PS. Does the HD1xx series have analog component out, as you have appended my previous statement? I thought they only had composite.

Tim Dashwood · January 23rd, 2009, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun Roemich

PS. Does the HD1xx series have analog component out, as you have appended my previous statement? I thought they only had composite.

Yep. Component YRB as well.

Glen Vandermolen · January 24th, 2009, 08:36 AM

What happened to the pic of the camera? And the posts that talked about it?
The pic is gone from the Australian JVC website.

Marc Colemont · January 24th, 2009, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Phillipps

I suppose that was one bit of short-sightedness from JVC not putting an HD out of some sort on the HD100/200. I remeber when the Canon XL-H1 came out, folks were raving about the HDSDI out more than just about anything else - and with the advent of the likes of the Flash XDR etc., you can really see why now.
Steve

Yes but it made the camera more expensive then the HD100 at that time.
Now there are more levels to choose out at JVC including HD-SDI options.
Which gives you exactly what you pay for.

Chris Hurd · January 24th, 2009, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glen Vandermolen

What happened to the pic of the camera?

Removed per request of JVC. Apparently it was *not* representative of the camera's final design. Of course we'll have plenty of pics on hand immediately upon its official unveiling.

Shaun Roemich · January 24th, 2009, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Colemont

Now there are more levels to choose out at JVC including HD-SDI options.
Which gives you exactly what you pay for.

Exactly why I chose the 200 instead of the 250 when I purchased. In my case, the addition of HD-SDI on the 250 would have cost a $3000 premium over what I paid for each of my 200's. I felt it wasn't worth THAT much to me but that the 200 was enough of an improvement (60P, BNC connectors and the Anton Bauer plate) over the 110 to make that decision a no-brainer. Each of us has to decide on our own cost/benefit analysis. Would I love to have HD-SDI? Heck yeah. Did I make the right financial decision? I think so. Am I excited about HD-SDI on the 700? Yup!

Johnny Clark · January 26th, 2009, 10:09 AM

Craig,
What kind of program (exchange offer) will JVC offer to current HD200/HD250 owners towards the new HM700? I am expecting that the deal will be nice. Have you seen what RED is offering to do for their current RED ONE owners?.... full compensation towards their new line. Just wondering what JVC's ready to do for it's loyal customer base.

Johnny Clark · January 26th, 2009, 10:10 AM

Just wondering.

Stuart Nimmo · January 27th, 2009, 09:35 AM

Stunned silence Johnny.....

All the top broadcasters stipulate top broadcast cameras. The reality is very different, depending on the content of course they will all accept very well shot, high quality HDV on a great story. They may well want you to deliver on top end HD, as they want YOU to get it there successfully.

This stipulation/ reality disparity has been going on for years. Back in the days of Beta SP I used to shoot a top end BBC Network program(me) called "Tomorrow's World" (it's gone now), eventually they told me that all BBC progs' were switching to Digital Betacam and they would be among the first. I checked with my other BBC clients and heard much the same story, so I gulped, put my perfectly good Beta SP camera in the cupboard (still had clients for it who didn't want Digi beta of course) and spent a very great deal of money on a Digital Betacam.

With my hand on my heart I promise that this is true: on the very first shoot I did for "Tomorrow's World" as soon as I'd lit the first scene and was ready to shoot the Director pulled out a Sony 100 DV camera and started to shoot. I asked him what it was for and he said, "the cut aways, we're all being trained to shoot as much as we can on DV, this is the future... Digi Betacams and cameramen are a thing of the past mate."

I didn't say much, just gulped again got on with the shoot wondering whom at the BBC, I should send my new camera bill to, the worst of it was that this director kept "crabbing" artistically into my frame! He just kept doing it, so eventually I let the camera run while I told him that it was just as well that he was shooting "cutaways". "Why?" he asked, "because some 'berk' keeps wandering into my shot”. I went home at the end of the day and was literally sick.

As an ex-long term member of BBC and ITV staff I can tell you that this sort of dangerous information is still par for the course. Never trust any of them to stick with the format they last thought of, they're all extra keen to get "the best" of course and to get you to buy it. The sad truth is that most of them don't have the budgets to hire it from you so look out!

David Parks · January 27th, 2009, 10:08 AM

Stuart,

That's a great story and the voice of experience. And now I'm having issues with my clients on whether they want 720p or 1080i/p and what frame rate. Early last year i had a similar experience where I was "A" cam and told to shoot 1080/30p and the "B" cam was told to shoot 1080/24. I told the producer that the whoever the editor was on the project that he would probably hunt him down and hang him once he saw the different frame rates. He told me to mind my own business. Of course I heard post was a mess. And the gaffer and loved setting the exposure for 2 different frame rates. it was fun.

I think more choices have made it more confusing for some and I think that over time (at least I hope), that most shoot/post workflows will start to lock in at 1080/30p.

Cheers.

Johnny Clark · January 27th, 2009, 11:24 AM

I hear that Stuart and David. Being spoiled with fully solid state cameras is something I would like very much. Tape is a pain that I wish to dissolve from my workflow.

I just want to know what we can expect to get towards a trade or if I should sell before it's worth nothing...

Will the HM700 have 'Over & Undercrank' abilities (in camera) since the codec is a version of XDCAM EX?

Hopefully we get some more information sooner than later.

Adam Letch · January 27th, 2009, 07:52 PM

about the under and overcranking, now that tape is a thing of the past, though only the higher end XDcams have this, the base model didn't, and that's worth more than the JVC, so I wouldn't hold my breath on that one, but never the less, good point! A great feature to use!

David Heath · January 28th, 2009, 03:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart Nimmo

Back in the days of Beta SP I used to shoot a top end BBC Network program(me) called "Tomorrow's World" (it's gone now), eventually they told me that all BBC progs' were switching to Digital Betacam and they would be among the first.

I believe the change was caused not by wanting a new tape format, but by the switch to widescreen? (Which, of course, would have created even more problems cutting in early 4:3 DV footage, but never mind!) Fifteen or more years ago I seem to recall that if you wnted true 16:9 it had to be a Digibeta, and it was that more than anything that drove the changeover, at least in the UK.

Stuart Nimmo · January 28th, 2009, 04:59 AM

Yes, that's part of the story David, but the floundering about was really something. The BBC decided to move towards Digital Betacam, but the BBC was just a group of Programme departments that basically went their own way on their own budgets so a dictum from a faceless suit didn't mean much. The speed with which technical things changed and the "must have" from bright young things was basically beyond control.

BBC News decided to switch to the fatally flawed Betacam SX format and part equipped various offices around the world with SX before deciding to swap to DVCPro. That lasted a few weeks before they switched to DV. They still used Beta SP players and cameras though most were in dire need of repair. News never did switch to Digital Betacam, though you are right they did switch to 14x9 transmission - this was felt to be the best compromise. So 16x9 protected 14x9 was the format to shoot. That said various programmes still accepted Betacam SP and would Arc it to 14x9. One had to discover the latest thinking for yourself as the one thing we all found was that the BBC seemed to have no system to communicate to its regular freelancers.

In the meantime A major American News broadcaster stuck with Beta SP(NTSC), where I was their own camera was so clapped out that to be reasonably sure of sending a live image without dropping off air you had to strip the cameras doors off and hold various board connectors in with your fingertips and Scotch tape.

It was the same with other big name broadcasters, the state of and the variety of their equipment was shocking, the days of basically one format (Beta SP) were over, so swapping and exchanging was vastly more difficult; as was servicing the gear.

Camera construction moved towards the disposable and from Sony Digi 790 on some wiser hire companies pumped bath sealant into new camera chassis to stop the vibration and keep cards and connectors from falling out. Who knows what that did to air circulation and over heating?

These then are the people who stipulate that you must have an "XXXX" camera.... this week anyway. Next week it will almost certainly be something else. The HD(V) choices and frame rates, and what they can actually handle in post where they happen to be at any given moment simply demonstrating their own 'Circle of Confusion’ - a cynic might say “such is progress”. But hey! who would be in any other business?

I'm tempted to watch the next very few weeks, as this World Financial crisis bights deep into already battered budgets, my feeling is that well shot, well told, well constructed items, stories and documentaries delivered on a format that end users want and are equipped with at the sharp end, will prove to be key. How you get to that beautiful item's delivery point within budget is your problem.

In the end we're back to the same old problem, how the actual "end- users" re-take control in these format wars and get back to one affordable standard (of no interest to the equipment manufacturers).
Solid state? Yes that’s well possible, but which flavour would you like this week sir... why not take one of each?

David Heath · January 28th, 2009, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart Nimmo

BBC News decided to switch to the fatally flawed Betacam SX format and part equipped various offices around the world with SX before deciding to swap to DVCPro. That lasted a few weeks before they switched to DV.

I understood that for most of this decade in the UK, then of the main news broadcasters Sky have been using SX, ITN DVCPro, and BBC News DVCAM, with DSR500s? Of those, two have recently changed: Sky to P2, and ITN to DVCAM and DSR450s, the latter due to them needing widescreen cameras.

About ten years ago, the general feeling was that SX was the more upmarket format, but those cameras don't seem to have lasted as well as the DSR500s. The other advantage of DVCAM (over DVCPro) is that it's far more compatible with DV, useful when the latter is being used by journalists alongside crews.

January 23rd, 2009, 03:42 PM	#46
Shaun Roemich Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada Posts: 4,088	Thanks Tim. The new cameras are going to take some getting used to, from a point of nomenclature. PS. Does the HD1xx series have analog component out, as you have appended my previous statement? I thought they only had composite. __________________ Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/

January 26th, 2009, 10:09 AM	#52
Johnny Clark New Boot Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 22	Exchange Program Craig, What kind of program (exchange offer) will JVC offer to current HD200/HD250 owners towards the new HM700? I am expecting that the deal will be nice. Have you seen what RED is offering to do for their current RED ONE owners?.... full compensation towards their new line. Just wondering what JVC's ready to do for it's loyal customer base.

January 26th, 2009, 10:10 AM	#53
Johnny Clark New Boot Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 22	What happened to the picture Just wondering.

January 27th, 2009, 09:35 AM	#54
Stuart Nimmo Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Paris France Posts: 89	Who will accept which format? Look out! Stunned silence Johnny..... All the top broadcasters stipulate top broadcast cameras. The reality is very different, depending on the content of course they will all accept very well shot, high quality HDV on a great story. They may well want you to deliver on top end HD, as they want YOU to get it there successfully. This stipulation/ reality disparity has been going on for years. Back in the days of Beta SP I used to shoot a top end BBC Network program(me) called "Tomorrow's World" (it's gone now), eventually they told me that all BBC progs' were switching to Digital Betacam and they would be among the first. I checked with my other BBC clients and heard much the same story, so I gulped, put my perfectly good Beta SP camera in the cupboard (still had clients for it who didn't want Digi beta of course) and spent a very great deal of money on a Digital Betacam. With my hand on my heart I promise that this is true: on the very first shoot I did for "Tomorrow's World" as soon as I'd lit the first scene and was ready to shoot the Director pulled out a Sony 100 DV camera and started to shoot. I asked him what it was for and he said, "the cut aways, we're all being trained to shoot as much as we can on DV, this is the future... Digi Betacams and cameramen are a thing of the past mate." I didn't say much, just gulped again got on with the shoot wondering whom at the BBC, I should send my new camera bill to, the worst of it was that this director kept "crabbing" artistically into my frame! He just kept doing it, so eventually I let the camera run while I told him that it was just as well that he was shooting "cutaways". "Why?" he asked, "because some 'berk' keeps wandering into my shot”. I went home at the end of the day and was literally sick. As an ex-long term member of BBC and ITV staff I can tell you that this sort of dangerous information is still par for the course. Never trust any of them to stick with the format they last thought of, they're all extra keen to get "the best" of course and to get you to buy it. The sad truth is that most of them don't have the budgets to hire it from you so look out! Last edited by Stuart Nimmo; January 27th, 2009 at 12:03 PM.

January 27th, 2009, 10:08 AM	#55
David Parks Major Player Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Houston Posts: 789	Stuart, That's a great story and the voice of experience. And now I'm having issues with my clients on whether they want 720p or 1080i/p and what frame rate. Early last year i had a similar experience where I was "A" cam and told to shoot 1080/30p and the "B" cam was told to shoot 1080/24. I told the producer that the whoever the editor was on the project that he would probably hunt him down and hang him once he saw the different frame rates. He told me to mind my own business. Of course I heard post was a mess. And the gaffer and loved setting the exposure for 2 different frame rates. it was fun. I think more choices have made it more confusing for some and I think that over time (at least I hope), that most shoot/post workflows will start to lock in at 1080/30p. Cheers. __________________ David Parks: DP/Editor: Jacobs Aerospace at NASA Johnson Space Center https://www.youtube.com/user/JacobsESCG

January 24th, 2009, 08:36 AM	#48
Glen Vandermolen Space Hipster Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 1,596	What happened to the pic of the camera? And the posts that talked about it? The pic is gone from the Australian JVC website.

January 27th, 2009, 11:24 AM	#56
Johnny Clark New Boot Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 22	I hear that Stuart and David. Being spoiled with fully solid state cameras is something I would like very much. Tape is a pain that I wish to dissolve from my workflow. I just want to know what we can expect to get towards a trade or if I should sell before it's worth nothing... Will the HM700 have 'Over & Undercrank' abilities (in camera) since the codec is a version of XDCAM EX? Hopefully we get some more information sooner than later.

January 27th, 2009, 07:52 PM	#57
Adam Letch Major Player Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 414	excellent point about the under and overcranking, now that tape is a thing of the past, though only the higher end XDcams have this, the base model didn't, and that's worth more than the JVC, so I wouldn't hold my breath on that one, but never the less, good point! A great feature to use!

January 28th, 2009, 04:59 AM	#59
Stuart Nimmo Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Paris France Posts: 89	Which flavour would you like this week sir... why not take one of each? Yes, that's part of the story David, but the floundering about was really something. The BBC decided to move towards Digital Betacam, but the BBC was just a group of Programme departments that basically went their own way on their own budgets so a dictum from a faceless suit didn't mean much. The speed with which technical things changed and the "must have" from bright young things was basically beyond control. BBC News decided to switch to the fatally flawed Betacam SX format and part equipped various offices around the world with SX before deciding to swap to DVCPro. That lasted a few weeks before they switched to DV. They still used Beta SP players and cameras though most were in dire need of repair. News never did switch to Digital Betacam, though you are right they did switch to 14x9 transmission - this was felt to be the best compromise. So 16x9 protected 14x9 was the format to shoot. That said various programmes still accepted Betacam SP and would Arc it to 14x9. One had to discover the latest thinking for yourself as the one thing we all found was that the BBC seemed to have no system to communicate to its regular freelancers. In the meantime A major American News broadcaster stuck with Beta SP(NTSC), where I was their own camera was so clapped out that to be reasonably sure of sending a live image without dropping off air you had to strip the cameras doors off and hold various board connectors in with your fingertips and Scotch tape. It was the same with other big name broadcasters, the state of and the variety of their equipment was shocking, the days of basically one format (Beta SP) were over, so swapping and exchanging was vastly more difficult; as was servicing the gear. Camera construction moved towards the disposable and from Sony Digi 790 on some wiser hire companies pumped bath sealant into new camera chassis to stop the vibration and keep cards and connectors from falling out. Who knows what that did to air circulation and over heating? These then are the people who stipulate that you must have an "XXXX" camera.... this week anyway. Next week it will almost certainly be something else. The HD(V) choices and frame rates, and what they can actually handle in post where they happen to be at any given moment simply demonstrating their own 'Circle of Confusion’ - a cynic might say “such is progress”. But hey! who would be in any other business? I'm tempted to watch the next very few weeks, as this World Financial crisis bights deep into already battered budgets, my feeling is that well shot, well told, well constructed items, stories and documentaries delivered on a format that end users want and are equipped with at the sharp end, will prove to be key. How you get to that beautiful item's delivery point within budget is your problem. In the end we're back to the same old problem, how the actual "end- users" re-take control in these format wars and get back to one affordable standard (of no interest to the equipment manufacturers). Solid state? Yes that’s well possible, but which flavour would you like this week sir... why not take one of each?