'Normal' Cinema? at DVinfo.net

Hugh Raggett · August 31st, 2010, 01:59 AM

So, I go to 'Gamma' and set it to CINEMA. Then I go to 'Col. Matrix' and have the choice of OFF, STND, CINEMA VIVID, CINEMA SUBDUED. But what if I just want CINEMA NORMAL ? How can I get that?!

Also please, whats the advantage to setting 'Knee' to 85% rather than leaving it at Auto? Thanks for any help here.

David Elsea · September 2nd, 2010, 03:47 PM

I kind of see what you're saying... the way the gamma cinema settings are named, you'd think there would be an intermediary setting, such as "normal." That said, I'm finding that cinema subdued really IS the normal setting you are looking for, only because it seems that ungraded film in general has more subdued colors. To me, the subdued colors allow the most freedom for color-correcting in post. For me, subdued cinema is certainly the preferred gamma setting, especially over the vivid setting. Seems like color bleeding (especially with reds) would be a problem with the vivid. Hope that helps.

David E.

Alex Humphrey · September 8th, 2010, 12:18 PM

Hmmm what is your workflow? Shoot to ball park what you might want it to look like color corrected or to shoot for the maximum flexabiity in color correction?

Assuming the HM100 performs like the HD100/200 series cameras, this might make sense: Basically I'm making the case to shoot factory non cine anything:

Shooting for final look. CineGama and maybe Cine Color: Sounds good? Well it also gives you the least wiggle room in post. Your blacks are already crushed, for me usually beyond saving if you suddenly have something in shadow that I didn't notice.... it might be too late. (like peopel's faces in sunlight at 2:00pm. dark holes where their eyes are with cinegama without a reflector. so if you use cine gama, make sure you've got a GOOD HD monitor and can see what it looks like so you don't crush your darks too much.

Shooting for color correcting in post: (the way I'm back to shooting) I might be the only one saying this, but I've started listening to the JVC engineers, and I'm back to shooting standard color and gama, occasionaly using black stretch and exposing to keep the highlights barely withing norms. My shadows have data so if I need to brighten them up in post I can, or I can crush them in post. If I used cinegama, they are usually lost forever. Sometimes when I think I want to I'll shoot Cine-Color Matrix... but I think a desaturation filter of 20% in post does about the same thing.

Did that help or did I just annoy everyone?

August 31st, 2010, 01:59 AM	#1
Hugh Raggett New Boot Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Montpellier (France) Posts: 22	'Normal' Cinema? So, I go to 'Gamma' and set it to CINEMA. Then I go to 'Col. Matrix' and have the choice of OFF, STND, CINEMA VIVID, CINEMA SUBDUED. But what if I just want CINEMA NORMAL ? How can I get that?! Also please, whats the advantage to setting 'Knee' to 85% rather than leaving it at Auto? Thanks for any help here.

September 2nd, 2010, 03:47 PM	#2
David Elsea New Boot Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Texas Posts: 17	I kind of see what you're saying... the way the gamma cinema settings are named, you'd think there would be an intermediary setting, such as "normal." That said, I'm finding that cinema subdued really IS the normal setting you are looking for, only because it seems that ungraded film in general has more subdued colors. To me, the subdued colors allow the most freedom for color-correcting in post. For me, subdued cinema is certainly the preferred gamma setting, especially over the vivid setting. Seems like color bleeding (especially with reds) would be a problem with the vivid. Hope that helps. David E.

September 8th, 2010, 12:18 PM	#3
Alex Humphrey Major Player Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: california North and South Posts: 642	Hmmm what is your workflow? Shoot to ball park what you might want it to look like color corrected or to shoot for the maximum flexabiity in color correction? Assuming the HM100 performs like the HD100/200 series cameras, this might make sense: Basically I'm making the case to shoot factory non cine anything: Shooting for final look. CineGama and maybe Cine Color: Sounds good? Well it also gives you the least wiggle room in post. Your blacks are already crushed, for me usually beyond saving if you suddenly have something in shadow that I didn't notice.... it might be too late. (like peopel's faces in sunlight at 2:00pm. dark holes where their eyes are with cinegama without a reflector. so if you use cine gama, make sure you've got a GOOD HD monitor and can see what it looks like so you don't crush your darks too much. Shooting for color correcting in post: (the way I'm back to shooting) I might be the only one saying this, but I've started listening to the JVC engineers, and I'm back to shooting standard color and gama, occasionaly using black stretch and exposing to keep the highlights barely withing norms. My shadows have data so if I need to brighten them up in post I can, or I can crush them in post. If I used cinegama, they are usually lost forever. Sometimes when I think I want to I'll shoot Cine-Color Matrix... but I think a desaturation filter of 20% in post does about the same thing. Did that help or did I just annoy everyone?