HM100 and smaller cameras? at DVinfo.net

John McDonald · July 21st, 2009, 04:18 AM

My HM100 will be my main camera for my upcoming overland African trip (it ticks all of the boxes apart from a cheap overall cost). However I don't want to leave the HM100 in a pile of dust whilst I drive over it, hand it to a bunch of kids to take some shots or strap it to the back door when driving off road etc. In other words I need some smaller cheaper cameras for the cutaways/riskier shots.

However I can't see any obvious answers as no other cameras share the same shooting format, so any other footage would need to be converted before editing and I'm very unsure of what would convert well into my FCP timeline (I'll shoot in 1080 .mov and use in FCP - I haven't decided if it will be progressive or not yet).

I am trying a couple of Toshiba Camileo S10 for the very risky shots, as at 100 pounds ($160) they are potentially good for the very risky shots:
Options and Accessories individual page - Toshiba

However I'd like a better quality camera in case the HM100 fails for a while and so not all of my riskier shooting looks like it was shot on a mobile phone.

Any potential camera must shoot to SDHC cards and be able to take an ND filter (for the better quality camera only). Ideal if it shared batteries with the HM100 ;-)

Any suggestions for either tiny disposal type cameras or a better consumer level camera?

Tom Hardwick · July 21st, 2009, 04:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John McDonald

I am trying a couple of Toshiba Camileo S10 for the very risky shots, as at 100 pounds ($160) they are potentially good for the very risky shots

I'm looking at the spec sheet and see it's a fixed 7.2 mm f/3.2. They don't give the CMOS chip size but I bet it's a 1"/6 or thereabouts, so the focal length will mean it's portrait-length telephoto - and I guess what you're after is a nice wide shot that shows the situation you're in.

There's also no manual exposure control (what can you expect for the intended market) but you'll be cussin' at the sun making silhouettes out of everything. You won't need an ND for it (apart from protection) as I'm guessing there won't be a diaphragm at all - the auto exposure will all be dione with internal grad ND.

You'll also have to take another charger, and has it got a tripod socket or is this a gaffer tape to the A pillar job?

Good luck on the voyage of Discovery - er, I mean Land Rover.

tom.

John McDonald · July 21st, 2009, 05:16 AM

Thanks Tom, testing shows that strapped to the chassis under the vehicle it does a good job in good light for a 100 quid camera - and being nice and flat it can be attached with Velcro to any flat surface which is handy.

Importing into FCP on a timeline with HM100 footage does take a while however (it prompts to convert the footage to the timeline settings)

But I'd like to know what other options are available for this smaller type of camera and a better consumer level camera that would integrate with the HM100 footage with the least hassle (as I'll be editing in my vehicle in Africa etc).

Maybe the JVC GZ-HM200BEK or GZ-X900EK etc etc

Elvis Ripley · July 21st, 2009, 10:19 AM

I use the Canon Vixia cameras quite a bit and have 2 I used for side cameras on a lot of shoots. They are very high quality and clean looking in bright light until dusk. Canon also updates their line twice a year with almost no change so you can easily find the last model from a couple months ago heavily discounted. In the Canon line cameras that star with HF are High definition Flash recorders which is what you probably want.

John Markert · July 22nd, 2009, 07:00 AM

Canon HV20 used on Ebay should do ya.

John McDonald · July 24th, 2009, 02:59 AM

Thanks - but having bought 12 times 32gig sdhc cards I'm not going to lump 100 minidv tapes around Africa as well ;-)

My questions is really what format full 1080 HD will be the least problamatic to convert to working on a FCP timeline with HM100 footage shot in .mov?

Kaushik Parmar · July 24th, 2009, 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John McDonald

Thanks - but having bought 12 times 32gig sdhc cards I'm not going to lump 100 minidvd tapes around Africa as well ;-)

My questions is really what format full 1080 HD will be the least problamatic to convert to working on a FCP timline with HM100 footage shot in .mov?

Yes, no more tapes, indeed!

Tony Tibbetts · July 29th, 2009, 05:57 PM

The Panasonic TM300 look like it would serve your purpose. Even cheaper the Canon HF200 looks like it would work as well.

An older Panasonic SD100 would be less problematic in regards to conveversion if you are shooting progressive as there is no pulldown required. You could probably pick one of those up for around $500.

Paulo Teixeira · July 31st, 2009, 09:22 PM

You can get the Sanyo FH1 for as low as around $432 in reputable dealers such as B&H. Since it’s not AVCHD, you should be able to edit the files natively in Final Cut.

Tom Hardwick · August 1st, 2009, 05:22 AM

I'm dying to know what you finaly plonk the dosh for John.

John McDonald · August 3rd, 2009, 07:49 AM

Likewise Tom, I'm very interested in what I buy as well ;-)

I have decided I need another cheap throw away (!) camera like the small Toshiba - but maybe the Sanyo or Samsungs or similar.

And then I need the equivalent of the good old trusty Sony TRV900 or Canon HV30 - a very good consumer camera - and it needs to have some kind of night shot capability.

Ideally these would all share the same batteries somehow ;-)

Does the HM100 share the same batteries with the consumer range of JVC cameras?

(Busy in other areas at the moment but will intensify the hunt next week if not before ;)

John McDonald · August 3rd, 2009, 07:52 AM

PS: I haven't had time to really dig into if I should shoot in 1080 interlaced or progressive with the HM100 so this clouds the smaller camera selection at this stage!!! ;)

John McDonald · September 27th, 2009, 07:14 AM

OK, I need to order something in the next two weeks, so stressing over this a little. It looks like the best mode for me to shoot in with my JVC HM100 is 1024 x 720 in 50p mode?

However I can't find any consumer camcorders that record in this mode.....

Some of the Sanyo Xacti models do 1024 x 720 but in 60p mode. How much effort is it to convert this to 50p with only a Macbook Pro/FCS etc? Does the conversion take hours?

Other than that, any suggestions?

Tom Hardwick · September 27th, 2009, 07:38 AM

I wish I could answer your questions - but I can't. It was so easy in the TRV900 days - it was that or a Panasonic MX350, and all to Mini DV tape. Now the pathway is strewn with boulders to stub your toes on, tributaries and side-roads feed it, lay-byes and dead ends make like mazes. (hey - you like that?)

John McDonald · September 27th, 2009, 01:36 PM

Quite so Tom! I'm more stressed about getting the correct kit and workflow in FCP than I am about driving solo across the Sahara and places like the Congo..... ;-)

Maybe HDV was the way to go after all - the HM100 has a high cost of ownership as cards are expensive (I have 10 * 32GB cards ) and I need 12 * 500GB mini harddrives for the trip - add that up!

Plus there is no easy answer when you need smaller cams (and I need at least 3).

JVC - PLEASE update your consumer line with a mini HM100 that records in .mov with the same resolution options (by Friday please!)

July 21st, 2009, 04:18 AM	#1
John McDonald Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London, UK. Posts: 53	HM100 and smaller cameras? My HM100 will be my main camera for my upcoming overland African trip (it ticks all of the boxes apart from a cheap overall cost). However I don't want to leave the HM100 in a pile of dust whilst I drive over it, hand it to a bunch of kids to take some shots or strap it to the back door when driving off road etc. In other words I need some smaller cheaper cameras for the cutaways/riskier shots. However I can't see any obvious answers as no other cameras share the same shooting format, so any other footage would need to be converted before editing and I'm very unsure of what would convert well into my FCP timeline (I'll shoot in 1080 .mov and use in FCP - I haven't decided if it will be progressive or not yet). I am trying a couple of Toshiba Camileo S10 for the very risky shots, as at 100 pounds ($160) they are potentially good for the very risky shots: Options and Accessories individual page - Toshiba However I'd like a better quality camera in case the HM100 fails for a while and so not all of my riskier shooting looks like it was shot on a mobile phone. Any potential camera must shoot to SDHC cards and be able to take an ND filter (for the better quality camera only). Ideal if it shared batteries with the HM100 ;-) Any suggestions for either tiny disposal type cameras or a better consumer level camera?

July 24th, 2009, 02:59 AM	#6
John McDonald Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London, UK. Posts: 53	Thanks - but having bought 12 times 32gig sdhc cards I'm not going to lump 100 minidv tapes around Africa as well ;-) My questions is really what format full 1080 HD will be the least problamatic to convert to working on a FCP timeline with HM100 footage shot in .mov? Last edited by John McDonald; July 24th, 2009 at 06:01 AM.

July 31st, 2009, 09:22 PM	#9
Paulo Teixeira Trustee Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 1,773	You can get the Sanyo FH1 for as low as around $432 in reputable dealers such as B&H. Since it’s not AVCHD, you should be able to edit the files natively in Final Cut. __________________ https://www.youtube.com/user/PhotoVi...esEtc/featured https://www.pond5.com/artist/paulot

July 21st, 2009, 05:16 AM	#3
John McDonald Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London, UK. Posts: 53	Thanks Tom, testing shows that strapped to the chassis under the vehicle it does a good job in good light for a 100 quid camera - and being nice and flat it can be attached with Velcro to any flat surface which is handy. Importing into FCP on a timeline with HM100 footage does take a while however (it prompts to convert the footage to the timeline settings) But I'd like to know what other options are available for this smaller type of camera and a better consumer level camera that would integrate with the HM100 footage with the least hassle (as I'll be editing in my vehicle in Africa etc). Maybe the JVC GZ-HM200BEK or GZ-X900EK etc etc

July 21st, 2009, 10:19 AM	#4
Elvis Ripley Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: OK Posts: 62	I use the Canon Vixia cameras quite a bit and have 2 I used for side cameras on a lot of shoots. They are very high quality and clean looking in bright light until dusk. Canon also updates their line twice a year with almost no change so you can easily find the last model from a couple months ago heavily discounted. In the Canon line cameras that star with HF are High definition Flash recorders which is what you probably want.

July 22nd, 2009, 07:00 AM	#5
John Markert Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Belle Mead NJ Posts: 50	Canon HV20 used on Ebay should do ya.

July 29th, 2009, 05:57 PM	#8
Tony Tibbetts Major Player Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 385	The Panasonic TM300 look like it would serve your purpose. Even cheaper the Canon HF200 looks like it would work as well. An older Panasonic SD100 would be less problematic in regards to conveversion if you are shooting progressive as there is no pulldown required. You could probably pick one of those up for around $500.

August 1st, 2009, 05:22 AM	#10
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	I'm dying to know what you finaly plonk the dosh for John.

August 3rd, 2009, 07:49 AM	#11
John McDonald Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London, UK. Posts: 53	Likewise Tom, I'm very interested in what I buy as well ;-) I have decided I need another cheap throw away (!) camera like the small Toshiba - but maybe the Sanyo or Samsungs or similar. And then I need the equivalent of the good old trusty Sony TRV900 or Canon HV30 - a very good consumer camera - and it needs to have some kind of night shot capability. Ideally these would all share the same batteries somehow ;-) Does the HM100 share the same batteries with the consumer range of JVC cameras? (Busy in other areas at the moment but will intensify the hunt next week if not before ;)

August 3rd, 2009, 07:52 AM	#12
John McDonald Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London, UK. Posts: 53	PS: I haven't had time to really dig into if I should shoot in 1080 interlaced or progressive with the HM100 so this clouds the smaller camera selection at this stage!!! ;)

September 27th, 2009, 07:14 AM	#13
John McDonald Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London, UK. Posts: 53	OK, I need to order something in the next two weeks, so stressing over this a little. It looks like the best mode for me to shoot in with my JVC HM100 is 1024 x 720 in 50p mode? However I can't find any consumer camcorders that record in this mode..... Some of the Sanyo Xacti models do 1024 x 720 but in 60p mode. How much effort is it to convert this to 50p with only a Macbook Pro/FCS etc? Does the conversion take hours? Other than that, any suggestions?

September 27th, 2009, 07:38 AM	#14
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	I wish I could answer your questions - but I can't. It was so easy in the TRV900 days - it was that or a Panasonic MX350, and all to Mini DV tape. Now the pathway is strewn with boulders to stub your toes on, tributaries and side-roads feed it, lay-byes and dead ends make like mazes. (hey - you like that?)

September 27th, 2009, 01:36 PM	#15
John McDonald Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: London, UK. Posts: 53	Quite so Tom! I'm more stressed about getting the correct kit and workflow in FCP than I am about driving solo across the Sahara and places like the Congo..... ;-) Maybe HDV was the way to go after all - the HM100 has a high cost of ownership as cards are expensive (I have 10 * 32GB cards ) and I need 12 * 500GB mini harddrives for the trip - add that up! Plus there is no easy answer when you need smaller cams (and I need at least 3). JVC - PLEASE update your consumer line with a mini HM100 that records in .mov with the same resolution options (by Friday please!)