Dropouts on tape and SSE at DVinfo.net

Daniel Weber · April 22nd, 2007, 06:32 PM

Well after shooting about 20 hours of footage with my 1 year old HD100, I have experience 2 well know problems.

The first is SSE under some tricky lighting problems. This was at 0db and it only appeared a few times.

The second and more disturbing is tape drop outs.

I shot 2.5 hours of footage today and started looking at the footage in reverse order of it being shot.

I noticed a few drop outs on the 3rd tape, a few more on the second tape and now on the 1st tape there are drop outs every few seconds. I stopped playing the tape and ran a head cleaner through it, but the drop outs are still there.

I have a feeling it might be the play back heads, but I am afraid to put the 3rd tape back in the camera fearing that it might cause problems with the footage.

Am I being to cautious?

What have other people done to help with drop outs?

I am on the verge of buying the DRHD-100 DTE which would get rid of the drop outs.

Thanks for any helpful insights.

Dan Weber

Adam Grunseth · April 22nd, 2007, 08:19 PM

About SSE:
When I first recieved my camera I noticed a slight SSE in dim lighting conditions when the camera was first turned on and pointed at a flat surface with no detail. I called JVC about it and was told that sometimes the camera needs to see a scene with detail in it when it is first turned on for the calibration circuit to sync up both halfs of the CCD. It seems to work, as long as I first point the camera at a decently lit scene with some amount of detail in it I have no problems with SSE no matter what I do therafter.

About tape dropouts:
I usually use my firestore, which of course doesn't have any tape dropout problems. However, before my firestore arrived I did use tape and never recieved any drop outs- but I followed some basic rules with the tape to avoid drop outs: First I chose one brand of tape and stuck with it, switching brands can lead to gunk build up on the heads because of different chemical coatings on different brands of tape. Also I only use each tape once, never reusing or recycling them. The more the tape is used the more stretched it can become and the higher chance of dropouts.

Brian Luce · April 22nd, 2007, 09:01 PM

I can see SSE when my lens cap is on.

I get a small dropout about every 5 to 10 minutes. Very irritating.

eventually i'll have to get firestore.

Justin Ferar · April 22nd, 2007, 09:13 PM

Hey Brian,

What tape stock are you using?

Daniel Weber · April 22nd, 2007, 09:26 PM

I have always used brand new tapes. I use the Panasonic MQ tapes.

I can live with the little bit of SSE I had.

The drop outs are another issue.

I went back and played over the first tape I played and it was showing drop outs when it hadn't before. I think that there is something up with the playback heads. I ran the cleaner tape again, and still the same issue.

I can't loose this project and am at a los as to how to capture the footage now. I don't have access to a deck. I have put off buying one since I knew that I would be getting a firestore soon, but now I am concerned about the playback heads.

Thanks,

Dan

Brian Luce · April 22nd, 2007, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin Ferar

Hey Brian,

What tape stock are you using?

panasonic AY DVM60FF

Justin Ferar · April 22nd, 2007, 11:25 PM

This probably has nothing to do with it BUT...

A few months ago panasonic started touting it's new AMQ tape to compete against DVCAM. The advertised heavily in the mags and had some promotions. At the time I was using 2 JVC GY-5000's. We decided to make the switch and immediately started having rediculous dropouts described here even after cleaning the heads. What's even weirder is that they would pretty much occur when the camera was pointing down.

After a total freak out I switched back to DVCAM- smooth as butter.

I'm not saying the AMQ is poor quality. My personal experience is just that AMQ doesn't go well with JVC.

When we upgraded to the HD200's I decided to go with JVC's pro HD tape. After about 12 hours of footage I have seen one recorded dropout so far.

Anyone else having success with panasonic tape?

Daniel Weber · April 22nd, 2007, 11:29 PM

I have been using the MQ Panasonic tapes with no problems until today.

I have emailed my local JVC rep, Ken Freed, and let's see what he says. I will keep everyone here updated.

I am getting tired of tape real fast!!!! I never want to capture another tape again!!!!

Dan Weber

Mark Silva · April 23rd, 2007, 01:04 AM

I have had dropouts and only use the JVCPRO-HD tapes.

Interestingly enough all of my colleagues use the Sony HDV tapes
and nobody has had dropouts with them.

I'm very much considering switching to the Sony HDV tapes.

Dennis Stevens · April 23rd, 2007, 07:52 AM

I had tape drop out issues that sound identical to what is being described here.

I only used the JVC ProHD tapes. Head cleaning tape made no difference.

Finally I sent the camera to JVC for servicing. They were able to fix the problem.

They sent back a sheet with the camera saying what they did, but I don't have it front of me. As I recall, I think they had to replace a part.

Sending it in for servicing - that was the bottom line, in my case.

Daniel Weber · April 23rd, 2007, 08:26 AM

I took the tapes into my office today and played them back on a Sony HVR-M25U deck and there were no dropouts. To me this would mean that the playback heads are bad.

I am glad that the tapes are fine, but bummed that I have to send it in for service and pay for something that happened when the camera is only 13 months old. I also had to wait to use the camera for 3 months while my IDX battery kit was being sent.

I will be sending it off the JVC this week.

Does anyone have any idea how long the turn around time is for a repair like this?

Dan Weber

Dennis Stevens · April 23rd, 2007, 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel Weber

Does anyone have any idea how long the turn around time is for a repair like this?

Dan Weber

I can tell you my experience. My camera went to the New Jersey facility. It took about 3 weeks.

I asked if it could be fixed and returned by a certain date, which they were able to do. The fellow I spoke to said if I requested to get the camera back by a particular date, they would try, but couldn't guarantee.

Brian Luce · April 23rd, 2007, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel Weber

I took the tapes into my office today and played them back on a Sony HVR-M25U deck and there were no dropouts. To me this would mean that the playback heads are bad.

I am glad that the tapes are fine, but bummed that I have to send it in for service and pay for something that happened when the camera is only 13 months old. I also had to wait to use the camera for 3 months while my IDX battery kit was being sent.

I will be sending it off the JVC this week.

Does anyone have any idea how long the turn around time is for a repair like this?

Dan Weber

d

You situation follows mine exactly. I bought the camera in March of 06. Didn't get batterieis til June. I assumed everyone was getting the dropouts. I'll try the pro tapes and even the sony tapes. If no luck, send it to JVC.

Diogo Athouguia · April 23rd, 2007, 02:39 PM

I always use Panasonic MQ or the cheapest JVC tapes, never had drop outs. I'm sure that tapes are not the problem. Don't switch to Sony tapes before cleaning the heads, as I was told by a JVC technician only JVC, Panasonic or Fuji tapes should be used.

Joe Bowey · April 23rd, 2007, 04:47 PM

I had the same problem too. I need to send of camera in because I also have some pixels out right in the middle of frame.
I have a 4 year mack warranty which entitles me to a free professional head cleaning a year.

April 22nd, 2007, 06:32 PM	#1
Daniel Weber Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Maryland, USA Posts: 696	Dropouts on tape and SSE Well after shooting about 20 hours of footage with my 1 year old HD100, I have experience 2 well know problems. The first is SSE under some tricky lighting problems. This was at 0db and it only appeared a few times. The second and more disturbing is tape drop outs. I shot 2.5 hours of footage today and started looking at the footage in reverse order of it being shot. I noticed a few drop outs on the 3rd tape, a few more on the second tape and now on the 1st tape there are drop outs every few seconds. I stopped playing the tape and ran a head cleaner through it, but the drop outs are still there. I have a feeling it might be the play back heads, but I am afraid to put the 3rd tape back in the camera fearing that it might cause problems with the footage. Am I being to cautious? What have other people done to help with drop outs? I am on the verge of buying the DRHD-100 DTE which would get rid of the drop outs. Thanks for any helpful insights. Dan Weber

April 22nd, 2007, 09:13 PM	#4
Justin Ferar Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Larkspur, CA Posts: 378	Hey Brian, What tape stock are you using? __________________ www.justinferar.com www.weddingsonfilm.com

April 22nd, 2007, 11:25 PM	#7
Justin Ferar Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Larkspur, CA Posts: 378	This probably has nothing to do with it BUT... A few months ago panasonic started touting it's new AMQ tape to compete against DVCAM. The advertised heavily in the mags and had some promotions. At the time I was using 2 JVC GY-5000's. We decided to make the switch and immediately started having rediculous dropouts described here even after cleaning the heads. What's even weirder is that they would pretty much occur when the camera was pointing down. After a total freak out I switched back to DVCAM- smooth as butter. I'm not saying the AMQ is poor quality. My personal experience is just that AMQ doesn't go well with JVC. When we upgraded to the HD200's I decided to go with JVC's pro HD tape. After about 12 hours of footage I have seen one recorded dropout so far. Anyone else having success with panasonic tape? __________________ www.justinferar.com www.weddingsonfilm.com

April 22nd, 2007, 08:19 PM	#2
Adam Grunseth Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Eugene Oregon Posts: 393	About SSE: When I first recieved my camera I noticed a slight SSE in dim lighting conditions when the camera was first turned on and pointed at a flat surface with no detail. I called JVC about it and was told that sometimes the camera needs to see a scene with detail in it when it is first turned on for the calibration circuit to sync up both halfs of the CCD. It seems to work, as long as I first point the camera at a decently lit scene with some amount of detail in it I have no problems with SSE no matter what I do therafter. About tape dropouts: I usually use my firestore, which of course doesn't have any tape dropout problems. However, before my firestore arrived I did use tape and never recieved any drop outs- but I followed some basic rules with the tape to avoid drop outs: First I chose one brand of tape and stuck with it, switching brands can lead to gunk build up on the heads because of different chemical coatings on different brands of tape. Also I only use each tape once, never reusing or recycling them. The more the tape is used the more stretched it can become and the higher chance of dropouts.

April 22nd, 2007, 09:01 PM	#3
Brian Luce Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 2,290	I can see SSE when my lens cap is on. I get a small dropout about every 5 to 10 minutes. Very irritating. eventually i'll have to get firestore.

April 22nd, 2007, 09:26 PM	#5
Daniel Weber Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Maryland, USA Posts: 696	I have always used brand new tapes. I use the Panasonic MQ tapes. I can live with the little bit of SSE I had. The drop outs are another issue. I went back and played over the first tape I played and it was showing drop outs when it hadn't before. I think that there is something up with the playback heads. I ran the cleaner tape again, and still the same issue. I can't loose this project and am at a los as to how to capture the footage now. I don't have access to a deck. I have put off buying one since I knew that I would be getting a firestore soon, but now I am concerned about the playback heads. Thanks, Dan

April 22nd, 2007, 11:29 PM	#8
Daniel Weber Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Maryland, USA Posts: 696	I have been using the MQ Panasonic tapes with no problems until today. I have emailed my local JVC rep, Ken Freed, and let's see what he says. I will keep everyone here updated. I am getting tired of tape real fast!!!! I never want to capture another tape again!!!! Dan Weber

April 23rd, 2007, 01:04 AM	#9
Mark Silva Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Pacific NW Posts: 431	I have had dropouts and only use the JVCPRO-HD tapes. Interestingly enough all of my colleagues use the Sony HDV tapes and nobody has had dropouts with them. I'm very much considering switching to the Sony HDV tapes.

April 23rd, 2007, 07:52 AM	#10
Dennis Stevens Major Player Join Date: May 2006 Location: Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 425	I had tape drop out issues that sound identical to what is being described here. I only used the JVC ProHD tapes. Head cleaning tape made no difference. Finally I sent the camera to JVC for servicing. They were able to fix the problem. They sent back a sheet with the camera saying what they did, but I don't have it front of me. As I recall, I think they had to replace a part. Sending it in for servicing - that was the bottom line, in my case.

April 23rd, 2007, 08:26 AM	#11
Daniel Weber Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Maryland, USA Posts: 696	I took the tapes into my office today and played them back on a Sony HVR-M25U deck and there were no dropouts. To me this would mean that the playback heads are bad. I am glad that the tapes are fine, but bummed that I have to send it in for service and pay for something that happened when the camera is only 13 months old. I also had to wait to use the camera for 3 months while my IDX battery kit was being sent. I will be sending it off the JVC this week. Does anyone have any idea how long the turn around time is for a repair like this? Dan Weber

April 23rd, 2007, 02:39 PM	#14
Diogo Athouguia Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Portugal Posts: 282	I always use Panasonic MQ or the cheapest JVC tapes, never had drop outs. I'm sure that tapes are not the problem. Don't switch to Sony tapes before cleaning the heads, as I was told by a JVC technician only JVC, Panasonic or Fuji tapes should be used.

April 23rd, 2007, 04:47 PM	#15
Joe Bowey Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Glendale, AZ Posts: 217	I had the same problem too. I need to send of camera in because I also have some pixels out right in the middle of frame. I have a 4 year mack warranty which entitles me to a free professional head cleaning a year.