HD100s best friends - Tim, Paulo & Stephen

David Scattergood · September 29th, 2006, 04:30 AM

Hi George, I come from a musical background myself and also like to get more involved with film scoring - I'd be interested to know how you yourself create music i.e. what systems you use etc Probably best not to swamp this thread with such information so if you get the opportunity to mail me (or I'll mail you) I'd be most grateful.
Also, let me know how you get on with the 25p scene files...I'm relatively certain there will be a difference.

Good post Daniel btw

Warren Shultz · September 29th, 2006, 10:28 AM

David and George,
While you're at it, I'd love to have contact info with all you guys doing music. I wonder if there could be a composers section.

George David · September 29th, 2006, 03:51 PM

David, please email me @ georgecdavid@qwest.net and we can discuss music further.

To answer your question that may be helpful to other musicians, in the PC platform I use Sony Vegas and Sony Acid to create and mix music. Brian Transeau (Fast and the Furious, Stealth, Monster) uses the same apps as well. I use VST plug-ins with Sony Acid and it's just amazing what you can do with it. Sony Vegas' marker/beat feature is cool for composers as you can create beat markers to sync music like you wouldn't believe.

In the Mac platform, I use Logic. It's great as well but not as intuitive as Acid. I use a Yamaha Motif ES, Yamaha C5 and a Kawai CA1000 for composing. I'm a total gearfreak and a nerd :-)

Warren, that's an awesome idea to create a forum dedicated to film composers. Let's send an email request to Chris Hurd and see what he says.

Jaadgy Akanni · September 29th, 2006, 04:10 PM

About time someone suggested the idea. I'm also a musician and sharing how we go about composing for visuals would be beneficial to all us to . Let's all share are methods and approach. I use Protools HD, Roland V-synth, Akai 4000, Liquid Instruments.

David Scattergood · September 29th, 2006, 04:22 PM

Thanks George - I'll send a mail over to you this weekend.

I'm ridding myself of the PC - I never found it to be 'harmonic' with making music - it crashes on a fairly regular basis when using Cubase et al. I have/had some hardware all connected via midi all piped out to a mixing desk. I'm waving goodbye to this set up however and migrating to the mac world (and will be using Logic Pro 7 as it happens). I believe this will give me much more freedom than before (space is tight at home for a start, plus with an iMac I pretty much have the portability factor to take advantage of)....but perhaps this thread is going a little off topic now! I'll mail you fella.
Many thanks.
dave

David Scattergood · October 2nd, 2006, 06:09 AM

Have sent you a mail George.

Back to the footage here - wondering what format you shot in for the speeded up segment? And where all of the scenes shot in 24p (HDV I assume)?
Also, did you get the opportunity to try the scene files in 25p fella?
Many thanks.
Dave.

Jamon Lewis · October 5th, 2006, 01:18 AM

George i'm pretty new and have posted and commented probably about four times.... That piece was about the most creative thing i've come across on DVi (I'm not patronizing you)

I have a hd100 and have enjoyed Paolo's and Tim's scene files they bring the camera to life.I think the coolest thing was the idea to actually show the scene files in such an applicable way. Adding the music and all, it was like selling somebody a Ferrari and then taking them to the track and showing them how to drive it, when they other wise probably wouldn't have had the skill to enjoy really driving it or would have died inthe process of really learning how to finesse the thing!

Totally inspired me! Thanks to Paulo, who personally emailed me back when i was a total novice with my hd100! I asked him the (seemingly stupidest questions! (now in hind sight!) Now that i realize who he is I really appreciate his email! Thanks to Tim ( and others i haven't had the pleasure of running into yet)also for the selflessness and hard work so all of don't have to work so hard to pull our hair out!

Sorry for the novel, that peice really inspired me though.

Steve Benner · October 5th, 2006, 04:47 AM

The video with the various scene files was excellent. It was a great idea to showcase the various real world applications of them. Great job.

David Scattergood · October 5th, 2006, 05:10 AM

Still wondering the best way to achieve the sped up motion? Understand I would use 50p for slow mo, but is there a requirement to change anything for sped up motion (other than creating this in post)?

Cheers.

Stephen L. Noe · October 5th, 2006, 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Scattergood

Still wondering the best way to achieve the sped up motion? Understand I would use 50p for slow mo, but is there a requirement to change anything for sped up motion (other than creating this in post)?

Cheers.

There is no other way to achieve sped up footage with the HD-100 than doing it in your NLE. It's OK though because your NLE will cut frames to speed up your video which does not have ill effect on the footage (motion wise). You want to select a speed up value that is divisible by the actual framerate to ensure that only frames get cut and there are no interpolated frames created by your NLE.

David Scattergood · October 5th, 2006, 07:21 AM

Thanks Stephen - whereas you would use 50p on slow mo, well, where's the 12.5p for fast motion I thought!
I haven't had chance to use FCP yet (thanks to apple's 'speedy' shipping!) but I will try one or two techniques as soon as recieve the kit.
I'm guessing with 25p I should be looking at something like 75% (for example). The night shots (where it quickly gets dark as per George's footage) I would presume to speed up by something far greater?
I'll do a search on this forum as I bet this has been covered before (and I don't want to go off topic here).

Many thanks.
Dave.

Tim Dashwood · October 5th, 2006, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen L. Noe

There is no other way to achieve sped up footage with the HD-100 than doing it in your NLE.

If you know you will be undercranking, you should lower your shutterspeed for the proper motion blur effect.

For example, if undercranking for 12fps (200% speedup from 24fps), set the shutter speed to 1/24th.
If undercranking to 6fps (400% speedup from 24fps) set the shutter speed to 1/12th.

George David · October 5th, 2006, 08:57 AM

David, thanks for the email. I tested 25p very briefly and I'll play around with that some more as I have more time.

Jamon, that was too kind of you. I don't even know what to say about that but thanks. I just had fun playing around with the settings designed by these guys who are 50x more knowledgeable than me.

Stephen is right about speeding that up in post. That was 8x normal speed. As far as the super fast transition from day to night, I just crossfaded two different clips together.

Tim, thanks for the shutter speed setting tip. I'll definitely remember that :-)

Here's more testing that I've done (nothing fancy). I wish I had more time adding clips of real actors and stuff. But I'm just too swamped right now preparing for this little film. I really love the Bleach bypass setting especially underexposed. I may do the whole movie that way to get that Tim Burton feel.

Please right-click and save.
http://www.georgedavidfilms.com/samp...nefiletest.wmv

David Scattergood · October 5th, 2006, 09:04 AM

Interesting...
Tim - where did you get these figures from (and I'm certainly not by a vast stretch of the imagination debating these - more I'd like to know how to work them out):

Quote:

...if undercranking for 12fps (200% speedup from 24fps.

I've found the shutter speed on this camera to become almost strobe like as soon as it's switched past 1/25th.
The 'classic' day quickly switching to night with the automobiles car light trails - is there a number for this eg at 25fps should I be looking at around 6.25fps (400%)?
Also - there are often pans in these shots - you have to be slow enough with progressive anyhow - how would you achieve a pan that could feasibly take 15 mins (thereabouts)???

David Scattergood · October 5th, 2006, 09:07 AM

Oh and thanks again George. Now downloading your latest footage fella.

Quote:

As far as the super fast transition from day to night, I just crossfaded two different clips together.

Spotted it. I actually thought you had the day into dusk scene over the sped up footage, which looking back you didn't - it was the later scene.

September 29th, 2006, 04:10 PM	#34
Jaadgy Akanni Major Player Join Date: May 2006 Location: new york city Posts: 346	About time someone suggested the idea. I'm also a musician and sharing how we go about composing for visuals would be beneficial to all us to . Let's all share are methods and approach. I use Protools HD, Roland V-synth, Akai 4000, Liquid Instruments. __________________ I will be KING!

October 5th, 2006, 01:18 AM	#37
Jamon Lewis Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: NY NY USA Posts: 95	The was great George i'm pretty new and have posted and commented probably about four times.... That piece was about the most creative thing i've come across on DVi (I'm not patronizing you) I have a hd100 and have enjoyed Paolo's and Tim's scene files they bring the camera to life.I think the coolest thing was the idea to actually show the scene files in such an applicable way. Adding the music and all, it was like selling somebody a Ferrari and then taking them to the track and showing them how to drive it, when they other wise probably wouldn't have had the skill to enjoy really driving it or would have died inthe process of really learning how to finesse the thing! Totally inspired me! Thanks to Paulo, who personally emailed me back when i was a total novice with my hd100! I asked him the (seemingly stupidest questions! (now in hind sight!) Now that i realize who he is I really appreciate his email! Thanks to Tim ( and others i haven't had the pleasure of running into yet)also for the selflessness and hard work so all of don't have to work so hard to pull our hair out! Sorry for the novel, that peice really inspired me though.

October 5th, 2006, 08:57 AM	#43
George David Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Utah Posts: 150	Another clip to watch... David, thanks for the email. I tested 25p very briefly and I'll play around with that some more as I have more time. Jamon, that was too kind of you. I don't even know what to say about that but thanks. I just had fun playing around with the settings designed by these guys who are 50x more knowledgeable than me. Stephen is right about speeding that up in post. That was 8x normal speed. As far as the super fast transition from day to night, I just crossfaded two different clips together. Tim, thanks for the shutter speed setting tip. I'll definitely remember that :-) Here's more testing that I've done (nothing fancy). I wish I had more time adding clips of real actors and stuff. But I'm just too swamped right now preparing for this little film. I really love the Bleach bypass setting especially underexposed. I may do the whole movie that way to get that Tim Burton feel. Please right-click and save. http://www.georgedavidfilms.com/samp...nefiletest.wmv

September 29th, 2006, 04:30 AM	#31
David Scattergood Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Manchester, UK Posts: 755	Hi George, I come from a musical background myself and also like to get more involved with film scoring - I'd be interested to know how you yourself create music i.e. what systems you use etc Probably best not to swamp this thread with such information so if you get the opportunity to mail me (or I'll mail you) I'd be most grateful. Also, let me know how you get on with the 25p scene files...I'm relatively certain there will be a difference. Good post Daniel btw

September 29th, 2006, 10:28 AM	#32
Warren Shultz Major Player Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 248	David and George, While you're at it, I'd love to have contact info with all you guys doing music. I wonder if there could be a composers section.

September 29th, 2006, 03:51 PM	#33
George David Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Utah Posts: 150	David, please email me @ georgecdavid@qwest.net and we can discuss music further. To answer your question that may be helpful to other musicians, in the PC platform I use Sony Vegas and Sony Acid to create and mix music. Brian Transeau (Fast and the Furious, Stealth, Monster) uses the same apps as well. I use VST plug-ins with Sony Acid and it's just amazing what you can do with it. Sony Vegas' marker/beat feature is cool for composers as you can create beat markers to sync music like you wouldn't believe. In the Mac platform, I use Logic. It's great as well but not as intuitive as Acid. I use a Yamaha Motif ES, Yamaha C5 and a Kawai CA1000 for composing. I'm a total gearfreak and a nerd :-) Warren, that's an awesome idea to create a forum dedicated to film composers. Let's send an email request to Chris Hurd and see what he says.

September 29th, 2006, 04:22 PM	#35
David Scattergood Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Manchester, UK Posts: 755	Thanks George - I'll send a mail over to you this weekend. I'm ridding myself of the PC - I never found it to be 'harmonic' with making music - it crashes on a fairly regular basis when using Cubase et al. I have/had some hardware all connected via midi all piped out to a mixing desk. I'm waving goodbye to this set up however and migrating to the mac world (and will be using Logic Pro 7 as it happens). I believe this will give me much more freedom than before (space is tight at home for a start, plus with an iMac I pretty much have the portability factor to take advantage of)....but perhaps this thread is going a little off topic now! I'll mail you fella. Many thanks. dave

October 2nd, 2006, 06:09 AM	#36
David Scattergood Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Manchester, UK Posts: 755	Have sent you a mail George. Back to the footage here - wondering what format you shot in for the speeded up segment? And where all of the scenes shot in 24p (HDV I assume)? Also, did you get the opportunity to try the scene files in 25p fella? Many thanks. Dave.

October 5th, 2006, 04:47 AM	#38
Steve Benner Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: United States Posts: 590	The video with the various scene files was excellent. It was a great idea to showcase the various real world applications of them. Great job.

October 5th, 2006, 05:10 AM	#39
David Scattergood Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Manchester, UK Posts: 755	Still wondering the best way to achieve the sped up motion? Understand I would use 50p for slow mo, but is there a requirement to change anything for sped up motion (other than creating this in post)? Cheers.

October 5th, 2006, 07:21 AM	#41
David Scattergood Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Manchester, UK Posts: 755	Thanks Stephen - whereas you would use 50p on slow mo, well, where's the 12.5p for fast motion I thought! I haven't had chance to use FCP yet (thanks to apple's 'speedy' shipping!) but I will try one or two techniques as soon as recieve the kit. I'm guessing with 25p I should be looking at something like 75% (for example). The night shots (where it quickly gets dark as per George's footage) I would presume to speed up by something far greater? I'll do a search on this forum as I bet this has been covered before (and I don't want to go off topic here). Many thanks. Dave.