Who is using the HD100 for weddings? at DVinfo.net

Bill Edmunds · July 8th, 2006, 04:07 PM

If you are using the HD100 for weddings, how do you like it? Are you shooting 24p, 30p or 60i? What camera did you migrate from?

Scott Jaco · July 8th, 2006, 06:48 PM

I'm shooting engagement parties and weddings in 720/30p.

The footage looks great using Full Auto mode.

Craig Roblewsky · July 8th, 2006, 08:07 PM

I've started using my HD100s for a few weddings. Weddings are not our primary business, but we do still shoot a few every year. The first time out I set them on full auto, adjusted the focus and let them run just as a test. I didn't want to risk anything the first time out. ;-) However, I was absolutely blown away! The picture is incredible. The next time out I covered the wedding with the HD 100s and used the older cameras as backups. Again - WOW! I had been using the Canon XL1's for several years, but they are probably retiring pretty soon. I've been shooting everything at the wedding in 720/30P. The more I learn about this camera, the more I love it!

- Craig

Marc Colemont · July 10th, 2006, 06:45 AM

From time to time I do weddings too when they ask, makes quick money.
But what does make a wedding so different in shooting then any live event were you need to run and shoot?
I use The HD100 in 720p25. Auto Full mode? No way I will never ever use that button!
This camera is great in having a real lens. It's quicker to focus and to set the Iris without having to rely on a full automatic camera which does it's own thing. Turning the camera against a bright window cause the Auto Iris to close etc....that's a big turn off. So no, everything is been set to manual.
Use the Focus assist and Zebra and you are fine.
And this autofocus thing on other camera's I mostly turn it off anyway since it can behave strange and especially in dark situtaions it's not accurate at all anymore. It's useable in good environments like outdoor for example.
For outside and inside (party with dim lights) I use 2 settings:
- Outdoor I use Paolo's scene setting 3.0,
- Indoor I switch the 'Cinegamma' to 'Standard' and pull the 'Gamma gain' up and 'detail' to 2 for having a crisper image in low light situtaions. The 'Gain' in low-light situations I push up maximum to +6dB. With a dimmable lightsource on the camera I can do all I need.

Tomasz Ostrowski · July 10th, 2006, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Jaco

I'm shooting engagement parties and weddings in 720/30p.

The footage looks great using Full Auto mode.

Hi Scott !
I see you often record in Full Auto mode.
When i turn on Full Auto mode in my hd101 the shutter speed change to 1/25 ??? I see similar effect in manual mode when i change shutter speed from 1/50 to 1/25.(more blurring on moves)
My problem is I would like to set 1/50 shutter speed in Full Auto mode. Is it possible ?

Scott Jaco · July 11th, 2006, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tomasz Ostrowski

Hi Scott !
I see you often record in Full Auto mode.
When i turn on Full Auto mode in my hd101 the shutter speed change to 1/25 ??? I see similar effect in manual mode when i change shutter speed from 1/50 to 1/25.(more blurring on moves)
My problem is I would like to set 1/50 shutter speed in Full Auto mode. Is it possible ?

Full Auto mode uses the default shutter speed.

Try switching to High Definition.

In standard resolution 24p on my HD100, Full Auto forces you to use 1/24th shutter, however, if you switch it to High Definition 24p, 1/48 becomes the default shutter speed.

Scott

Chad Terpstra · July 11th, 2006, 10:13 PM

I'd like to second everything Marc said. Full Auto mode is more of a frustration than a help -especially when you are in and out of different lighting situations where some scenes may be backlit. It also won't switch your ND filter for you and that's the biggest help when going from indoors to out.

The camera isn't terrific in low light, but switching to Standard Gamma and boosting the gamma is a big help. –A great suggestion.

I'm currently shooting SD60i for two reasons: It will match easier with my other cameras which are not HD100's. And it is MUCH better at doing a good quick slow-mo which is the basis of making a good wedding video (at least for all parts not the ceremony, and even some ceremony). I usually do a 24p conversion in post using Nattress (3:2 pulldown in a 60i timeline) to most of the before and after shots). But trying to slow down 24p footage has proven to be not as great of an effect. Once I start doing HD weddings, I'll probably invest in Twixtor or some other program to help out the slow motion.

Other than that, the camera is great for weddings. Though there are certain benefits to other cams in image-stabilization and wider lenses, I'm hooked on the over-the-shoulder shooting style and the real, easily adjustable lens. At first I was uncomfortable not having my peripheral vision (at least on my right side), but now after 7 weddings, it's second nature.

I was previously using the Sony FX1 and I still do as my secondary camera. As I mentioned elsewhere, it’s nice for wider shots and quick detail shots that require some zoom due to the image stabilization. They match pretty well and I color-correct in post to ensure great images from both cameras.

Anyway, best of luck.

Marc Colemont · July 12th, 2006, 02:12 AM

Hi Chad,

I do all my events in HD, even if I know that the end result will be only for a DVD.
It gives a better image converting HD strait from the time-line into SD MPEG2.
I tell all my customers I keep the original HD file as a backup, in case they want it on BlueRay or HD-DVD later on.
For now as a teasing tool, I convert the highlights from a project in WMV-HD. I burn it as an extra file on the DVD.
When they watch it on their laptop they all say: Wow, this looks so much better then SD DVD. I'm sure many of them will want the HD movie later on when the Blueray and/or HD-DVD breaks through.

Scott Jaco · July 12th, 2006, 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Colemont

I tell all my customers I keep the original HD file as a backup, in case they want it on BlueRay or HD-DVD later on.

How are your archiving? Lately, I've been buring H.264 DVD's but it takes too long to encode. Do you have a shorter method?

Chad Terpstra · July 12th, 2006, 11:51 AM

Marc,

I'm starting to come around to this HD wedding idea. I have already seen how much better the SD DVDs will look due to bypassing the 4:1:1 compression down to 4:2:0 of DVDs. But having the HD backup is yet another way to generate business down the road for when the technology is in their homes. May I inquire as to how you put the HD WMV file on the same disc as their SD movie?

For archiving purposes I would imagine you just print it back to tape right?

One thing I would have to figure out is whether to shoot in HDV24p or 30p. 30p is nice, but I do go for that filmic look for the before and after coverage. Maybe I could let the couple decide? How does your slow-mo look?

Marc Colemont · July 12th, 2006, 02:24 PM

Chad,

Indeed it will generate some business afterwards when the HD-DVD formats get more common.

WMV-HD:
The WMV-HD file I place in the root of the DVD, next to the folders TS_Video & TS_Audio which is generated automatically by the DVD authoring package.
I shoot in 25P to be close to the Pal framerate here in Europe. The conversion to 50i gives very good results.

Concerning slow-motion effects I used the frame-blending of my Matrox RTX100 extreme PCI card before. But it does only SD. It's ready for Ebay now.
I'm now using Time-warp from Adobe After Effects. It takes time to render but it gives awesome results. I will upload some footage soon. It gives much better results then with interleased is possible. Another reason why I shoot progressive and not SD50i.

Scott Jaco · July 12th, 2006, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Colemont

Auto Full mode? No way I will never ever use that button!

I started the same way, doing everthing manual but it is just a pain in the ass. Constantly white balancing, adding gain and changing the audio levels for each take.

I shoot in many different lighting situations and I just can't be fumbling with the camera each time the lighting changes or the DJ gets louder ect....

It is always better to do it manual if you have the time but it just doesn't look good to a client, to be tweaking the settings. I'll settle for the slight loss of quality and make my day easier.

This is event videography, not the next Star Wars.

Bill Edmunds · July 12th, 2006, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Jaco

I started the same way, doing everthing manual but it is just a pain in the ass. Constantly white balancing, adding gain and changing the audio levels for each take.

I shoot in many different lighting situations and I just can't be fumbling with the camera each time the lighting changes or the DJ gets louder ect....

It is always better to do it manual if you have the time but it just doesn't look good to a client, to be tweaking the settings. I'll settle for the slight loss of quality and make my day easier.

This is event videography, not the next Star Wars.

Can you use a combination of auto & manual controls, or are you stuck with "all or nothing?" In other words, could you be using auto gain while simultaneously employing manual white balance?

Chad Terpstra · July 12th, 2006, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Edmunds

Can you use a combination of auto & manual controls, or are you stuck with "all or nothing?" In other words, could you be using auto gain while simultaneously employing manual white balance?

Absolutely. All the controls affected by "Full Auto" can be turned on or off one at a time in manual mode. I usually have the audio levels in auto and toggle between manual white balance and iris. The iris is the easiest to switch. If you know you're going to move someplace tricky and don't want to mess with the iris, the switch is right there next to your pinky. But to me, making a quick adjustment is a lot easier than having the iris dip one way or the other uncontrollably and lose an important moment. You get used to it really fast. It’s also much quicker & easier than with any other 1/3” chip camera I’ve ever used.

It may not be Star Wars, but I want all my work to be the best quality it can be. If that means taking a few moments (when I have them) to find a good white balance and/or gain setting, then so be it.

Marc Colemont · July 13th, 2006, 04:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Jaco

I started the same way, doing everthing manual but it is just a pain in the ass. Constantly white balancing, adding gain and changing the audio levels for each take.

I shoot in many different lighting situations and I just can't be fumbling with the camera each time the lighting changes or the DJ gets louder ect....

It is always better to do it manual if you have the time but it just doesn't look good to a client, to be tweaking the settings. I'll settle for the slight loss of quality and make my day easier.

This is event videography, not the next Star Wars.

Hi Scott,

I understand your feeling about it, that it can be overwelming, having to set manually all the settings. But in reallity it is not that hard, it needs some training of a few hours to get used to it. It's like driving a car. The first time you have too many pedals, after a while you don't even think how to drive, you just do.
You will see that the footage you get by doing everything manual get's a 'constant' look instead of relying on auto settings. Watch out for churches were they have colored glas. It will screw the auto balance big time.

I'll explain my workflow when I shoot, which for me gives the shortest time to setup the camera on an event in a new situation. Maybe others can jump in here too, we can all learn from each other. I would be interested anyway to hear how others setup their camera the quickest way.
When I'm walking from indoor <--> outdoor I already:
- Zoom out the lens so you have already a pretty sharp image
- Take in or out the ND (outdoor ND1 or ND2, indoor take them out)
Entering the room or arriving outdoor:
- Set the exposure first by relying on the zebra, and turn the Iris of the lens.
These are settings which for me need to be done first since they cannot be easilly corrected in post without loosing image quality.
- Only when I have the right exposure then I check the white balance. Over- or underexposed images make it not possible to make a good white balance. I made presets so I can swap quickly between 3200 indoor or 5600 outdoor already. But is some cases you need to set it differently like with TL-lights (On my camera I turned on the mode to fade the white balance, this way the white balance doesn't jump while already shooting if no time).
- Then look for your shot , zoom in and Focus.

My audio I mostly put in Auto, it gives good results on events. For concert and productions I use manual settings for audio.

July 8th, 2006, 04:07 PM	#1
Bill Edmunds Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Conway, NH Posts: 574	Who is using the HD100 for weddings? If you are using the HD100 for weddings, how do you like it? Are you shooting 24p, 30p or 60i? What camera did you migrate from?

July 8th, 2006, 06:48 PM	#2
Scott Jaco Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Sherman Oaks, CA Posts: 471	I'm shooting engagement parties and weddings in 720/30p. The footage looks great using Full Auto mode.

July 8th, 2006, 08:07 PM	#3
Craig Roblewsky New Boot Join Date: May 2006 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 24	I've started using my HD100s for a few weddings. Weddings are not our primary business, but we do still shoot a few every year. The first time out I set them on full auto, adjusted the focus and let them run just as a test. I didn't want to risk anything the first time out. ;-) However, I was absolutely blown away! The picture is incredible. The next time out I covered the wedding with the HD 100s and used the older cameras as backups. Again - WOW! I had been using the Canon XL1's for several years, but they are probably retiring pretty soon. I've been shooting everything at the wedding in 720/30P. The more I learn about this camera, the more I love it! - Craig

July 10th, 2006, 06:45 AM	#4
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	From time to time I do weddings too when they ask, makes quick money. But what does make a wedding so different in shooting then any live event were you need to run and shoot? I use The HD100 in 720p25. Auto Full mode? No way I will never ever use that button! This camera is great in having a real lens. It's quicker to focus and to set the Iris without having to rely on a full automatic camera which does it's own thing. Turning the camera against a bright window cause the Auto Iris to close etc....that's a big turn off. So no, everything is been set to manual. Use the Focus assist and Zebra and you are fine. And this autofocus thing on other camera's I mostly turn it off anyway since it can behave strange and especially in dark situtaions it's not accurate at all anymore. It's useable in good environments like outdoor for example. For outside and inside (party with dim lights) I use 2 settings: - Outdoor I use Paolo's scene setting 3.0, - Indoor I switch the 'Cinegamma' to 'Standard' and pull the 'Gamma gain' up and 'detail' to 2 for having a crisper image in low light situtaions. The 'Gain' in low-light situations I push up maximum to +6dB. With a dimmable lightsource on the camera I can do all I need.

July 11th, 2006, 10:13 PM	#7
Chad Terpstra Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Posts: 320	I'd like to second everything Marc said. Full Auto mode is more of a frustration than a help -especially when you are in and out of different lighting situations where some scenes may be backlit. It also won't switch your ND filter for you and that's the biggest help when going from indoors to out. The camera isn't terrific in low light, but switching to Standard Gamma and boosting the gamma is a big help. –A great suggestion. I'm currently shooting SD60i for two reasons: It will match easier with my other cameras which are not HD100's. And it is MUCH better at doing a good quick slow-mo which is the basis of making a good wedding video (at least for all parts not the ceremony, and even some ceremony). I usually do a 24p conversion in post using Nattress (3:2 pulldown in a 60i timeline) to most of the before and after shots). But trying to slow down 24p footage has proven to be not as great of an effect. Once I start doing HD weddings, I'll probably invest in Twixtor or some other program to help out the slow motion. Other than that, the camera is great for weddings. Though there are certain benefits to other cams in image-stabilization and wider lenses, I'm hooked on the over-the-shoulder shooting style and the real, easily adjustable lens. At first I was uncomfortable not having my peripheral vision (at least on my right side), but now after 7 weddings, it's second nature. I was previously using the Sony FX1 and I still do as my secondary camera. As I mentioned elsewhere, it’s nice for wider shots and quick detail shots that require some zoom due to the image stabilization. They match pretty well and I color-correct in post to ensure great images from both cameras. Anyway, best of luck.

July 12th, 2006, 02:12 AM	#8
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	Hi Chad, I do all my events in HD, even if I know that the end result will be only for a DVD. It gives a better image converting HD strait from the time-line into SD MPEG2. I tell all my customers I keep the original HD file as a backup, in case they want it on BlueRay or HD-DVD later on. For now as a teasing tool, I convert the highlights from a project in WMV-HD. I burn it as an extra file on the DVD. When they watch it on their laptop they all say: Wow, this looks so much better then SD DVD. I'm sure many of them will want the HD movie later on when the Blueray and/or HD-DVD breaks through.

July 12th, 2006, 11:51 AM	#10
Chad Terpstra Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Posts: 320	Marc, I'm starting to come around to this HD wedding idea. I have already seen how much better the SD DVDs will look due to bypassing the 4:1:1 compression down to 4:2:0 of DVDs. But having the HD backup is yet another way to generate business down the road for when the technology is in their homes. May I inquire as to how you put the HD WMV file on the same disc as their SD movie? For archiving purposes I would imagine you just print it back to tape right? One thing I would have to figure out is whether to shoot in HDV24p or 30p. 30p is nice, but I do go for that filmic look for the before and after coverage. Maybe I could let the couple decide? How does your slow-mo look?

July 12th, 2006, 02:24 PM	#11
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	Chad, Indeed it will generate some business afterwards when the HD-DVD formats get more common. WMV-HD: The WMV-HD file I place in the root of the DVD, next to the folders TS_Video & TS_Audio which is generated automatically by the DVD authoring package. I shoot in 25P to be close to the Pal framerate here in Europe. The conversion to 50i gives very good results. Concerning slow-motion effects I used the frame-blending of my Matrox RTX100 extreme PCI card before. But it does only SD. It's ready for Ebay now. I'm now using Time-warp from Adobe After Effects. It takes time to render but it gives awesome results. I will upload some footage soon. It gives much better results then with interleased is possible. Another reason why I shoot progressive and not SD50i.