HD100 + IDX + IDX3 Light + DR-HD100 = Headache

Jim Giberti · May 5th, 2006, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jiri Bakala

I am not quite sure that I follow... If it's all just a matter of a cable, there are specialized shops that will make you a great snake with all the right connectors. One such shop is Audio Services Corp. Canada in Toronto. They will make just about anything - and really well.

Yes Jiri, if you reasd Carl's post above you'll see that is in fact about a simple cabling issue. Like Tim, I assumed that the cable was available and that we'd be up and running with a simple order of drives and accessories, but the accessories aren't available and that's the duh factor.

You've got new HD cameras, battery systems and direct to disk systems - but not the simple cable to allow them to work together.

Like I said in another post, I'm being a lot more Zen like in my approach, but we're in between major projects, otherwise Tim would be calming me down <g>.

Carl Hicks · May 5th, 2006, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Holtermann

I really appreciate your help and if you can let me know tomorrow if it works with the Anton Bauer cable I'd really appreciate it. I'm just blown away that JVC Engineers and QA hasn't already done this leg work.

Hi Tim & others,

I'm happy to report the following:

1. The Anton Bauer "POWERTAP OPEN FS4" cable, part #8075-0056, will plug into the IDX battery bracket, and it will power the DRHD100.

2. The Anton Bauer "PT MULTI" splitter, part #8075-0013, will plug into the IDX battery bracket. This will allow you to run up to four accessories off of the IDX battery, plus the camera. For example, the DRHD100, a light, and a wireless mic all at once. I used small cable ties to secure it to the top of the camera, right in front of the battery bracket. Be careful to limit total power consumption of all accessories and the camera so as to not overload the battery.

3. I powered up the camera, the DRHD100, and an Anton Bauer Ultra-Light 2, and rolled tape and HDD. It operated all items fine. I only did a short test. I will do a longer test over the weekend.

4. I mounted the DRHD100 to an IDX part #O-LWP - DV Camera Wireless Receiver Mounting Bracket. The bracket then attaches to the IDX battery adaptor. I used the supplied cradle for the DRHD100. I attached the cradle to the plate with a small tripod base screw. I had to drill a hole in the O-LWP plate to put the screw in. Be careful to set the DRHD100 cradle high enough up so that when the power cable is pludgged into the bottom, you cn still set the camera down on a table without putting and pressure on the power connector. Anton Bauer is in the process of changing this connector to a right angle design so that less clearance is needed.

IDX is working on a total solution, so at some point you can get it all from one source. Right now, you can put together a solution using IDX and Anton Bauer items together.

Regards, Carl

Tim Holtermann · May 5th, 2006, 04:02 PM

Thanks for the report, that is good news.

I agree that it's a Firestore (Focus) and IDX issue mostly but since JVC branded the drive they also need to be aware of how much headache a simple $10 cable can cause. Especially when they (and IDX) have wording on their website claiming that the system will power both items (HD and Light) at the same time.

What really scares me is that even after another call placed today to IDX they still had no answer for me, in fact they never even called me back. When I asked them at the NAB booth what bracket I need for my HD100 they looked at me like I was out of my mind. I'm with Jonathan, I officially give IDX an F.

Somewhat related - I just got back from talking with the CitiDisk people and I have one of their 80 gig HDV drives that I will be testing over the next week. So far I'm very impressed. It doesn't have a nifty screen but it's half the price. I'll be posting my findings (review) along with some photos of how it mounts to my HD100 in a seperate thread over the next few days.

Jim Giberti · May 6th, 2006, 07:26 AM

Good to hear Carl.
Tim, Is CitiDisk saying that that they too have A drive that will handle HDV 24p? Are you working in FCP? Obviously you'll know very quickly if it works and is reliable.

Tim Holtermann · May 6th, 2006, 11:27 AM

Jim, the CitiDisk just records the stream to the hard drive as m2t files. So it records what ever format the HD100 can spit out of the Firewire port.

I shot some 24p footage to the disk, plugged the CitiDisk in to my PC, it showed up as a drive, I copied the m2t files over and played the footage just fine (I could have just played it back from the drive too). I then ran Cineform on it and converted them to Cineform 4:2:2 to begin editing.

I've been told by CitiDisk that they are working on wrapping quicktime around the files in a future update so that Mac users will have an easier time.

I'll have an in-depth review/worflow with photos later in the week.

Steven Thomas · May 6th, 2006, 12:15 PM

Ok, good news.

How about powering the CitiDisk HDV from the IDX. What cable/adapter will one need to do this?

If not, what is the run time on the CitiDisk?

Jim Giberti · May 6th, 2006, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Holtermann

Jim, the CitiDisk just records the stream to the hard drive as m2t files. So it records what ever format the HD100 can spit out of the Firewire port.

I shot some 24p footage to the disk, plugged the CitiDisk in to my PC, it showed up as a drive, I copied the m2t files over and played the footage just fine (I could have just played it back from the drive too). I then ran Cineform on it and converted them to Cineform 4:2:2 to begin editing.

I've been told by CitiDisk that they are working on wrapping quicktime around the files in a future update so that Mac users will have an easier time.

I'll have an in-depth review/worflow with photos later in the week.

Sounds good Tim...and sorry for misreading you earlier.
I'm really interested in hearing your experience with the CitiDisk. I pretty much wrote it off as an option after getting some early feedback from Douglas S.E. about reliablility and support.
Has it been pretty much plug and play so far?
I'll give them a call on Monday to see how soon they're talking regarding the Quicktime update.

Jim Giberti · May 6th, 2006, 01:29 PM

Steven, I was checking out the options earlier and it looks like they've got a nice V mount holder for the HDD that would fit onto the existing IDX back. The the battery would piggy back to that. It has a D-tap cable to CitiDisk cable to power it.
It looks like it would add about 3" to the back of the HD100.
It's the PCKT1256-V2V toward the bottom of this page.

http://www.shining.com/products/totalsolution/pckt1256/

I'm still leaning toward the Firestore especially if they are really coming out with the Quicktime 24p upgrade in the coming week.

Carl Hicks · May 9th, 2006, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carl Hicks

3. I powered up the camera, the DRHD100, and an Anton Bauer Ultra-Light 2, and rolled tape and HDD. It operated all items fine. I only did a short test. I will do a longer test over the weekend.

Update: With a fully charged IDX 70 watt battery, the full package ran 1 hour and 15 minutes before shutting down. This is with the camera on and tape rolling, the DRHD100 rolling, the Anton Bauer Ultralight 2 on, and operating the zoom every 10 minutes or so. I think this is not bad for the IDX battery, considering the load.

Tim Holtermann · May 9th, 2006, 10:59 PM

Hmm, actually I think that is bad. I would like to see at least 2 +hours constant use. How much power does that light draw?

Tim Holtermann · May 9th, 2006, 11:49 PM

Here are some quick photos of my HD100 Rig with the CitiDisk attached. Notice how their adaptor mounts on to the IDX plate and then the IDX battery mounts to their adaptor.

What is great about this setup is that it provides an extra 2 pin D-tap connector so I can power the CitiDisk and on board light at the same time with no special cords or other hassles.

Note: I don't have the Firewire plug connected in the photos but normally you would have a short cord there to connect the CitiDisk to the HD100.

http://66.34.47.146/temp/hd100/IMG_1089.JPG

http://66.34.47.146/temp/hd100/IMG_1090.JPG

http://66.34.47.146/temp/hd100/IMG_1091.JPG

Carl Hicks · May 9th, 2006, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Holtermann

Hmm, actually I think that is bad. I would like to see at least 2 +hours constant use. How much power does that light draw?

Tim,

The UltraLight 2 has a 25 watt lamp.

Best Regards, Carl

Jiri Bakala · May 10th, 2006, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Holtermann

Hmm, actually I think that is bad. I would like to see at least 2 +hours constant use. How much power does that light draw?

Tim, Carl is right. The load on the battery is pretty heavy and expecting 2+ hrs of everything rolling is unreasonable.

By the way, the AB Ultralight 2 could have different bulbs, the most common is 35W but the light can take up to 50W. Of course, the bigger wattage of the bulb the shorter battery life. Consider yourself warned; if you keep using the IDX (or any other) batteries with this much load you will shorten their overall life too.

Yoochul Chong · May 10th, 2006, 08:18 AM

i think the IDX light draws 11 watts. haven't tested this, but i think I can get 2 hours of use of the camera and light using the smaller IDS 7s battery.

Tim Holtermann · May 10th, 2006, 08:22 AM

If you run within the specified load max then you shouldn't shorten or damange your batteries. Let us look at the specs again.

1. IDX (7s) battery load is 53w Max.

2. IDX Light 11W Load at 100% output.

3. DR-HD100 (CitiDisk) 7.5W

4. JVC GY-HD100 in Record Mode: 17W

Total: 35.5W

The IDX 7s notes typical camera run-time at 2.7 hours (@ 26W) so the 35.5W load would shave some of this run time off but it shouldn't reduce it by half. Further, this is if you were running your IDX light at full output the entire time.

Obviously this doesn't account for the AB (or other high output) light. Which does put more load on the camera than an LED light.

May 5th, 2006, 04:02 PM	#18
Tim Holtermann Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 184	Thanks for the report, that is good news. I agree that it's a Firestore (Focus) and IDX issue mostly but since JVC branded the drive they also need to be aware of how much headache a simple $10 cable can cause. Especially when they (and IDX) have wording on their website claiming that the system will power both items (HD and Light) at the same time. What really scares me is that even after another call placed today to IDX they still had no answer for me, in fact they never even called me back. When I asked them at the NAB booth what bracket I need for my HD100 they looked at me like I was out of my mind. I'm with Jonathan, I officially give IDX an F. Somewhat related - I just got back from talking with the CitiDisk people and I have one of their 80 gig HDV drives that I will be testing over the next week. So far I'm very impressed. It doesn't have a nifty screen but it's half the price. I'll be posting my findings (review) along with some photos of how it mounts to my HD100 in a seperate thread over the next few days.

May 6th, 2006, 07:26 AM	#19
Jim Giberti Major Player Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Bethel, VT Posts: 824	Good to hear Carl. Tim, Is CitiDisk saying that that they too have A drive that will handle HDV 24p? Are you working in FCP? Obviously you'll know very quickly if it works and is reliable.

May 6th, 2006, 11:27 AM	#20
Tim Holtermann Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 184	Jim, the CitiDisk just records the stream to the hard drive as m2t files. So it records what ever format the HD100 can spit out of the Firewire port. I shot some 24p footage to the disk, plugged the CitiDisk in to my PC, it showed up as a drive, I copied the m2t files over and played the footage just fine (I could have just played it back from the drive too). I then ran Cineform on it and converted them to Cineform 4:2:2 to begin editing. I've been told by CitiDisk that they are working on wrapping quicktime around the files in a future update so that Mac users will have an easier time. I'll have an in-depth review/worflow with photos later in the week.

May 6th, 2006, 12:15 PM	#21
Steven Thomas Trustee Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,896	Ok, good news. How about powering the CitiDisk HDV from the IDX. What cable/adapter will one need to do this? If not, what is the run time on the CitiDisk?

May 6th, 2006, 01:29 PM	#23
Jim Giberti Major Player Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Bethel, VT Posts: 824	Steven, I was checking out the options earlier and it looks like they've got a nice V mount holder for the HDD that would fit onto the existing IDX back. The the battery would piggy back to that. It has a D-tap cable to CitiDisk cable to power it. It looks like it would add about 3" to the back of the HD100. It's the PCKT1256-V2V toward the bottom of this page. http://www.shining.com/products/totalsolution/pckt1256/ I'm still leaning toward the Firestore especially if they are really coming out with the Quicktime 24p upgrade in the coming week.

May 9th, 2006, 10:59 PM	#25
Tim Holtermann Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 184	Hmm, actually I think that is bad. I would like to see at least 2 +hours constant use. How much power does that light draw?

May 9th, 2006, 11:49 PM	#26
Tim Holtermann Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 184	Here are some quick photos of my HD100 Rig with the CitiDisk attached. Notice how their adaptor mounts on to the IDX plate and then the IDX battery mounts to their adaptor. What is great about this setup is that it provides an extra 2 pin D-tap connector so I can power the CitiDisk and on board light at the same time with no special cords or other hassles. Note: I don't have the Firewire plug connected in the photos but normally you would have a short cord there to connect the CitiDisk to the HD100. http://66.34.47.146/temp/hd100/IMG_1089.JPG http://66.34.47.146/temp/hd100/IMG_1090.JPG http://66.34.47.146/temp/hd100/IMG_1091.JPG

May 10th, 2006, 08:18 AM	#29
Yoochul Chong Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 72	i think the IDX light draws 11 watts. haven't tested this, but i think I can get 2 hours of use of the camera and light using the smaller IDS 7s battery.

May 10th, 2006, 08:22 AM	#30
Tim Holtermann Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 184	If you run within the specified load max then you shouldn't shorten or damange your batteries. Let us look at the specs again. 1. IDX (7s) battery load is 53w Max. 2. IDX Light 11W Load at 100% output. 3. DR-HD100 (CitiDisk) 7.5W 4. JVC GY-HD100 in Record Mode: 17W Total: 35.5W The IDX 7s notes typical camera run-time at 2.7 hours (@ 26W) so the 35.5W load would shave some of this run time off but it shouldn't reduce it by half. Further, this is if you were running your IDX light at full output the entire time. Obviously this doesn't account for the AB (or other high output) light. Which does put more load on the camera than an LED light.