480 60p bitrates at DVinfo.net

Thomas Smet · July 29th, 2005, 05:45 PM

Not that anybody would use the 480 60p mode on the HD100 but if they did what would the bitrates be like?

I figure that the quality would be close to a normal SD DVD that would be encoded around 9.85 Mbits/s.

The way I figured that out was that the 720x480x60p video is exactly double the data of a 720x480x30p video. Since it is double the data you divide the 19.7 Mbits/s by 2.

This would make for some pretty nice looking SD video. I cannot really think of any decent use for the 480 60p mode however so this was a complete waste of time.

Steven White · July 29th, 2005, 05:50 PM

720x480p60 would scale quite well to 1280x720. It would also have the benefit of providing excellent slo-motion results for combination with 480p24 and 480p30 content. Also, 480p60 would look stellar on all 60p digital displays and computer monitors.

-Steve

Peter Moore · July 29th, 2005, 06:07 PM

480/60p is also crystal clear smooth and would be awesome for anything that needed to be videographed with high fidelity (such as sports, wildlife, etc.)

Barry Green · July 29th, 2005, 11:11 PM

AFAIK, the 480/60p uses the same HDV data rate of 19 megabits per second.

Thomas Smet · July 29th, 2005, 11:41 PM

Sorry I was so down about the format guys. Yeah there are certain uses for it. I was mainly talking about how silly it was for me to bring this up now. I guess I was just bored.

Anyways Barry I assumed the 480 60p video would use the same 19.7 Mbits/s. What I was talking about is it terms of picture quality when comparing it to a SD DVD it would look like a DVD encoded at 9.85 Mbits/s because twice as many bits are used for the 60p video compared to a regular DVD. Since twice the data is used to get the same level of quality as a 9.85 DVD you would need double the amount of bits. Of course I still don't know how the GOP's play into this very well yet.

The HD100 could make one heck of a SD camera even if people don't like the HD when it comes out.

1. 24p 480p video
2. a great slow motion SD camera
3. Great lens options
4. Shoulder mount
5. a "real" lens
6. Component outputs for uncompressed SD
7. Native 16x9

I think people not even interested in HD might think about getting one of these since it very well may be the best 1/3" SD camera out there.

Anyways I better go find something to do or get some sleep. Yeah maybe I'll do that.

Peter Moore · July 30th, 2005, 12:23 PM

You can also do 720/24p with it after conversion, though it's much more CPU intensive than 480/60p to 24p conversion, and the results would be closer to true 24p with 480p.

Ken Hodson · July 31st, 2005, 10:51 PM

The cam does have an actual 720p24 mode.

As a note the older HD-1/10 does have the 480p60 mode as well. It is also available uncompressed or HDV. Great fun to play with.

Stephen L. Noe · September 12th, 2006, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas Smet

Not that anybody would use the 480 60p mode on the HD100 but if they did what would the bitrates be like?

I figure that the quality would be close to a normal SD DVD that would be encoded around 9.85 Mbits/s.

The way I figured that out was that the 720x480x60p video is exactly double the data of a 720x480x30p video. Since it is double the data you divide the 19.7 Mbits/s by 2.

This would make for some pretty nice looking SD video. I cannot really think of any decent use for the 480 60p mode however so this was a complete waste of time.

Here is the Datastream info.

It's the same as 720pXX

This makes the bits per pixel even more hardy because the chance of being bit starved is pretty small. 480p60 scales up well but the 576p50 is even better. Remember 60% slow mo for 50fps and 50% for 60fps.

good luck...

Joe Bowey · September 12th, 2006, 05:47 PM

Hey thomas I use my hd100 using just standard def. I just helped out on a golf show and everyone was using 480/60.

Jack Walker · September 12th, 2006, 06:00 PM

If one want to shoot 50p or 60p standard definition that will end up primarily as an NTSC DVD, but will also have a PAL DVD version -- what is the best workflow... that is what to shoot in (60p or 50p) and when to change to PAL, etc.?

Thomas Smet · September 13th, 2006, 01:24 AM

How the heck did this year old thread get opened up anyway? This was a topic I brought up over a year ago. It is funny that people are now responding to this.

Jonathan Porter · September 13th, 2006, 01:38 AM

Probabaly because people have had a year to play and are starting to realise there are a lot of other interesting things to this camera (and that HDV is still in its infancy for delivery to anything other than filmout or television). I to would love to know a work flow that is recommended when working with 576/50P footage, is the quality better when downconverted to SD DVD than 720P? Because I am a long way off providing my customers an HDDVD option, so will be downconverting to SD DVD for the forseeable future. To edit in a 720P timeline or not to edit in a 720P timeline?.... that is the question. :-)

JP

July 29th, 2005, 05:45 PM	#1
Thomas Smet Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 1,719	480 60p bitrates Not that anybody would use the 480 60p mode on the HD100 but if they did what would the bitrates be like? I figure that the quality would be close to a normal SD DVD that would be encoded around 9.85 Mbits/s. The way I figured that out was that the 720x480x60p video is exactly double the data of a 720x480x30p video. Since it is double the data you divide the 19.7 Mbits/s by 2. This would make for some pretty nice looking SD video. I cannot really think of any decent use for the 480 60p mode however so this was a complete waste of time.

July 31st, 2005, 10:51 PM	#7
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	The cam does have an actual 720p24 mode. As a note the older HD-1/10 does have the 480p60 mode as well. It is also available uncompressed or HDV. Great fun to play with. __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

July 29th, 2005, 05:50 PM	#2
Steven White Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 547	720x480p60 would scale quite well to 1280x720. It would also have the benefit of providing excellent slo-motion results for combination with 480p24 and 480p30 content. Also, 480p60 would look stellar on all 60p digital displays and computer monitors. -Steve

July 29th, 2005, 06:07 PM	#3
Peter Moore Trustee Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Arlington VA Posts: 1,034	480/60p is also crystal clear smooth and would be awesome for anything that needed to be videographed with high fidelity (such as sports, wildlife, etc.)

July 29th, 2005, 11:11 PM	#4
Barry Green Barry Wan Kenobi Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: North Carolina Posts: 3,863	AFAIK, the 480/60p uses the same HDV data rate of 19 megabits per second.

July 29th, 2005, 11:41 PM	#5
Thomas Smet Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 1,719	Sorry I was so down about the format guys. Yeah there are certain uses for it. I was mainly talking about how silly it was for me to bring this up now. I guess I was just bored. Anyways Barry I assumed the 480 60p video would use the same 19.7 Mbits/s. What I was talking about is it terms of picture quality when comparing it to a SD DVD it would look like a DVD encoded at 9.85 Mbits/s because twice as many bits are used for the 60p video compared to a regular DVD. Since twice the data is used to get the same level of quality as a 9.85 DVD you would need double the amount of bits. Of course I still don't know how the GOP's play into this very well yet. The HD100 could make one heck of a SD camera even if people don't like the HD when it comes out. 1. 24p 480p video 2. a great slow motion SD camera 3. Great lens options 4. Shoulder mount 5. a "real" lens 6. Component outputs for uncompressed SD 7. Native 16x9 I think people not even interested in HD might think about getting one of these since it very well may be the best 1/3" SD camera out there. Anyways I better go find something to do or get some sleep. Yeah maybe I'll do that.

July 30th, 2005, 12:23 PM	#6
Peter Moore Trustee Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Arlington VA Posts: 1,034	You can also do 720/24p with it after conversion, though it's much more CPU intensive than 480/60p to 24p conversion, and the results would be closer to true 24p with 480p.

September 12th, 2006, 05:47 PM	#9
Joe Bowey Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Glendale, AZ Posts: 217	Hey thomas I use my hd100 using just standard def. I just helped out on a golf show and everyone was using 480/60.

September 12th, 2006, 06:00 PM	#10
Jack Walker Trustee Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Burbank Posts: 1,811	If one want to shoot 50p or 60p standard definition that will end up primarily as an NTSC DVD, but will also have a PAL DVD version -- what is the best workflow... that is what to shoot in (60p or 50p) and when to change to PAL, etc.?

September 13th, 2006, 01:24 AM	#11
Thomas Smet Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 1,719	How the heck did this year old thread get opened up anyway? This was a topic I brought up over a year ago. It is funny that people are now responding to this.

September 13th, 2006, 01:38 AM	#12
Jonathan Porter New Boot Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Clermont, Queensland, Australia Posts: 15	Probabaly because people have had a year to play and are starting to realise there are a lot of other interesting things to this camera (and that HDV is still in its infancy for delivery to anything other than filmout or television). I to would love to know a work flow that is recommended when working with 576/50P footage, is the quality better when downconverted to SD DVD than 720P? Because I am a long way off providing my customers an HDDVD option, so will be downconverting to SD DVD for the forseeable future. To edit in a 720P timeline or not to edit in a 720P timeline?.... that is the question. :-) JP