putting sd and hdv on same timeline. at DVinfo.net

Simon J. Harris · March 18th, 2010, 02:56 AM

Hi All,
Would someone be kind enough to give this newbie an opinion on editing and recording formats?

I have a standard def camera that has seen better days and have upgraded to a hd 100 series and am curious to know whether you can put sd and hdv footage on the same timeline?

If not, is it possible to upscale the sd footage somehow? Perhaps using cineform or something?

I edit in Premier. While i really like the jvc, sometimes i would like to have a b camera to do cutaway shots and i was wondering whether i can still use my sd cam?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

regards to all.

Simon.

Noa Put · March 18th, 2010, 04:33 AM

You can make a project with a HD preset in the size your hd camera films in (720/1080/hdv or whatever) and then scale your sd footage up to fit or you can make a SD project and scale your HD footage down.
In both cases I would export to dvd specs only as your sd footage will not be up to HD specs if you would export out to a 720 or 1080i or p file.
My opinion is that HD and SD footage don't mix well, especially when your SD cam is a 4:3 camera and you need to letterbox to get 16:9. the resolution hit is too big compared to a HD cam and you will clearly see the difference is sharpness when going out to dvd.
Cineform will not help in improving shaprness on sd footage, the only way to somewhat combine letterboxed sd footage with Hd footage if your export is SD is to zoom in with the SD camera so it will notice a little less that there is a resolution difference.

Sareesh Sudhakaran · March 19th, 2010, 03:14 AM

which sd camera do you have?

either way don't mix and match the two, if it's both 16:9 and at 24p. The difference in sharpness and color will be very easily noticeable. The lens on the 100u is totally different, even if you match it with an hvx or a z1, etc. Can your sd camera take another lens?

Why not take the two cameras out and shoot a few takes of the same scene, etc under different lighting conditions? You can use After Effects to up-res to the frame size you want and color correct it with the basic tools - and then see how they play. All the best!

Alex Humphrey · March 21st, 2010, 08:36 AM

not sure what version of Premier you have, and haven't done Premier in years but I'll warn you about an annoying hickup from the older versions. In older versions of a lot of NLE's out there mixing formats was a pain. I'm using Final Cut stuio HD (first HD FCS and it's a pain). What I mean is the older software can't handle multiple codes, codes and frame rates in real time in the same project. If I would go back and change an edit, the timeline would change and the computer would try to rerender all the sections that came after the edit point that where did NOT match the project settings. The obvious answer is to load up a project that matches your 2nd camera, load what ever scenes you will likely edit from then export in an HDV 720p 24fps self contained file so you can load that into your HDV project and mix and match without rerender times. That is assuming your shooting and editing 24p on you JVC. The newer NLE seem to handle mixed media a LOT better than the older versions, so this will hopefully be just intersting background info.

One advantage of exporting all your SD at one time to match your JVC footage is besides retiming to 24p from 60i is it's a good time to color correct to something pretty close to your JVC footage. Easier to do it onces with one timeline than shuttle through your project looking for all the cut aways that need to be warmed up for instance. But if you spend a lot of quality time color correcting at the end going from cut to cut of the project it isn't that important. I personally don't have the patience for that and my final project don't generally warrent the time and effort for massive color correction scene by scene if I can help it.

March 18th, 2010, 02:56 AM	#1
Simon J. Harris New Boot Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Perth Posts: 5	putting sd and hdv on same timeline. Hi All, Would someone be kind enough to give this newbie an opinion on editing and recording formats? I have a standard def camera that has seen better days and have upgraded to a hd 100 series and am curious to know whether you can put sd and hdv footage on the same timeline? If not, is it possible to upscale the sd footage somehow? Perhaps using cineform or something? I edit in Premier. While i really like the jvc, sometimes i would like to have a b camera to do cutaway shots and i was wondering whether i can still use my sd cam? Any advice would be greatly appreciated. regards to all. Simon.

March 19th, 2010, 03:14 AM	#3
Sareesh Sudhakaran Trustee Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Mumbai, India Posts: 1,385	which sd camera do you have? either way don't mix and match the two, if it's both 16:9 and at 24p. The difference in sharpness and color will be very easily noticeable. The lens on the 100u is totally different, even if you match it with an hvx or a z1, etc. Can your sd camera take another lens? Why not take the two cameras out and shoot a few takes of the same scene, etc under different lighting conditions? You can use After Effects to up-res to the frame size you want and color correct it with the basic tools - and then see how they play. All the best! __________________ Get the Free Comprehensive Guide to Rigging ANY Camera - one guide to rig them all - DSLRs to the Arri Alexa.

March 18th, 2010, 04:33 AM	#2
Noa Put Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Belgium Posts: 9,510	You can make a project with a HD preset in the size your hd camera films in (720/1080/hdv or whatever) and then scale your sd footage up to fit or you can make a SD project and scale your HD footage down. In both cases I would export to dvd specs only as your sd footage will not be up to HD specs if you would export out to a 720 or 1080i or p file. My opinion is that HD and SD footage don't mix well, especially when your SD cam is a 4:3 camera and you need to letterbox to get 16:9. the resolution hit is too big compared to a HD cam and you will clearly see the difference is sharpness when going out to dvd. Cineform will not help in improving shaprness on sd footage, the only way to somewhat combine letterboxed sd footage with Hd footage if your export is SD is to zoom in with the SD camera so it will notice a little less that there is a resolution difference.

March 21st, 2010, 08:36 AM	#4
Alex Humphrey Major Player Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: california North and South Posts: 642	not sure what version of Premier you have, and haven't done Premier in years but I'll warn you about an annoying hickup from the older versions. In older versions of a lot of NLE's out there mixing formats was a pain. I'm using Final Cut stuio HD (first HD FCS and it's a pain). What I mean is the older software can't handle multiple codes, codes and frame rates in real time in the same project. If I would go back and change an edit, the timeline would change and the computer would try to rerender all the sections that came after the edit point that where did NOT match the project settings. The obvious answer is to load up a project that matches your 2nd camera, load what ever scenes you will likely edit from then export in an HDV 720p 24fps self contained file so you can load that into your HDV project and mix and match without rerender times. That is assuming your shooting and editing 24p on you JVC. The newer NLE seem to handle mixed media a LOT better than the older versions, so this will hopefully be just intersting background info. One advantage of exporting all your SD at one time to match your JVC footage is besides retiming to 24p from 60i is it's a good time to color correct to something pretty close to your JVC footage. Easier to do it onces with one timeline than shuttle through your project looking for all the cut aways that need to be warmed up for instance. But if you spend a lot of quality time color correcting at the end going from cut to cut of the project it isn't that important. I personally don't have the patience for that and my final project don't generally warrent the time and effort for massive color correction scene by scene if I can help it.