JVC Previews NEW Pro HD Camera Specs to Select AVR Resellers

[Joe Carney]

Plus with the dollar dropping like a lead weight, they will probably wait as long as possible to anounce actual pricing. Pana included.

[Vlad Manning]

Sean, you've seen it, handled it. Assuming
a) You are not breaking the dealers solemn oath not to tell anything more
b) The camera you handled could be powered up,
Tell more!

How good is the VF?
Size of LCD
See any evidence of stabilization?
Similarities or differences of controls cf current JVC models
Anything new on the lens (macro or)?
Focus assist details

June is a long way off, and by that time $10,ooo should be long forgotten as a price point, no matter what JVC lists it at initially. The 7000 (2/3" camera) may have no immediate competition and can be priced much higher. This 1/3" one will duke it out w/Panasonic and Sony at the low end, so expect aggressive pricing action, especially by the time Panasonic ships, as that has potentially higher quality output.

I like the mini-sizing of it, could be even better if the top handle breaks down, VF hunkers down, etc. I doubt it will have built-in stereo mics like the Z1 (very handy, btw), but this class benefits from light weight and compactness, so the more config options, the better.

I bet they'll have a good 6 month lead on Pana to market. I hope they get this camera right.

[Sean Dinwoodie]

LOL....I can say no more at this time...hmmm I do have pictures...nope can't post those by order of JVC.

I will comment regarding the quality of this verses the yet to be announced Pana. If you watch this season of American Idol in HD you saw JVC HD-10 footage cut together constantly thoughout the episodes as they traveled around the country. I watched it with severla others and they could not disguish much of the HD-10 footage form the Varicam footage. There you had a single chip 1/3" camera for $3500 being cut with a 3 2/3" 60K for a body camera. BTW Hollywood Studio Rentlas provided gear, assecories,and support to to Idol.

Those shooting with the sony cameras now are noteing HDV's awsome quality with a low bitrate. JVC does MPEG very very well. They are known for their MPEG compression technology. Remember the HD-10 for the most part was created by there consumer division. This camera wil have no problems competing against any mini Pana.

And think about this Panasonic has $60K HD camera (no lens)...next shooting on the same format there is a BRAND NEW $20K SD 24P camera (no lens) - That's a P2 camera!!! They have a lot to loose and therefore a lot to protect in ther other models and customers.....I don't think the lists of specs everyone is dreaming for on the mini Pana will be as long as the pipe dreams....we shall see....not mention I can buy 400 hours of tape for this camera compared to one 4gig P2 card.

......be realistic.....oh yeah hmmm and hot swapable Hard drives???...how much are 4200rpm drives running these days??? A much cheaper option, no?

[Filip Kovcin]

anyone heard any news about pal frame rate(s)? 25p? (50p?)


thanks,

filip

[Ignacio Rodriguez]

Any word on sensitivity? Sean? At such a small sensor size you never know. It does have the potential to be slightly more sensitive to light than the FX1/Z1 because the target resolution is lower, so it can perhaps get away with slightly larger pixels.

[Michael Struthers]

Well they get to be the king of mini-cams for 4 months until the Panasonic model comes out. 4:2:2 is tough to beat.

[Sean Dinwoodie]

4:2:2 Is not that nuch of a step up from 4:2:0 for 5 times the bitrate. I'm also not to impressed by the DVC100 codec. Take a look at http://www.cineform.com/technology/HDQualityAnalysis10bit/HDQualityAnalysis10bit.htm this test from cineform . And you failed to address all of the points I brought up regarding the specs wish list verses the prices of there other cameras including a SD P2 camera with no lens that hasn't even started to ship yet priced at $20K.

In a new pana p2 mini. You will likely not see a removable lens. For two P2 cards you will need to spend $8K. So now you have a fixed lens camera for $18K. If I had that kinda coin why not get the forth coming JVC ProHD XE 2/3"???

Until the DVX-100 arrived the sales of all the other Pana cameras were just as far behind Sony as JVC. Even when the varicam was released the sales were slow.

It appears we have a new generation of shooters from the past few years since the release of the DVX are being led like sheep...sad.

We are not Pana dealers but we do resell Pana cameras at our shop. Don't get me wrong I like Pana and they make good products, but to say they will be able to beat the HD100 with a DVC100 mini cam priced under $10K is really reaching.

Answer me this (hypothetical) 6 months from now we both have $10K to buy a camera and stock to shoot a feature the next day in HD. What camera and stock do you buy???
I know you don't know enough about the Pana, but you can see where I'm headed here......maybe you could aford on 2Gig card if the camera comes out for list a at $9K.


What am I not seeing? How can the Pana compete for a HD camera under $10K???

[Sean Dinwoodie]

<<<-- Originally posted by Ignacio Rodriguez : Any word on sensitivity? -->>>

No I'm sorry, but I'm looking forward to testing! :)

[Barry Green]

What am I not seeing?

Any details. None have been released yet.

How can the Pana compete for a HD camera under $10K???

Once the details are released, we'll see how it may (or may not) compete. Of the little that we do know, we know that DVCPRO-HD is 4:2:2 vs. 4:2:0, and has no GOP, and the solid-state recording system means no dropouts - ever, vs. HDV's rare but potential 15-frame dropouts. To some of us, those are significant issues. And we have no idea whether the Panasonic will offer interchangeable lenses, larger chips, wireless video transmitting, who knows> We don't know the form factor (shoulder-mount? Handycam? Palmcam?) We don't know whether it has tape or not, whether it supports hard disk recording or not... whether it works with remote camera CCU's, whether it can jam-sync timecode, etc. And we don't know what P2 cards cost. And we don't know if P2 is the only recording medium -- for all we know, the thing may have a hot-swappable hard disk interface built on it!

In short, there's no way you can even begin to hope to think about considering comparing the cameras, because we don't know anything about the Panasonic yet. It's a little premature to declare the war "over".

[Sean Dinwoodie]

Hey Barry,

That's exactly what I've been trying to say. We don't know what the Pana will have, but we do know the other cameras in the line for panasonic.

[Barry Green]

I think JVC's announcement is just fascinating. Even though it may "break" from the formal HDV standard, introducing the 24P as a new standard is great news -- the camera is still fully HDV-compliant in "regular" mode, so you have the choice: full HDV compatibility, PLUS a new 24P mode. If HDV won't support 24P, JVC will make a new format that does -- that's really cool!

I've been looking forward to this camera's introduction for quite a while, I really want to see what they've done with it. I thought the DV500 and DV5000 were excellent little cameras for the money, an incredible value, and I've been hoping they'd produce an HDV version of that camera. Looks like they probably have (just substituting 1/3" chips instead of 1/2" chips, but HD instead of SD).

I think the ones who are kicking themselves right now aren't Panasonic necessarily, but rather Canon. Interchangeable lenses was supposed to be Canon's domain, and now JVC may have trumped them. Remains to be seen what the lens mount is (or did they announce that?) If it uses a standard 1/2" bayonet lens mount or something else that's likely to be industry-standard (rather than proprietary), that'll be a huge advantage for the JVC!

[Michael Struthers]

Well if the JVC has interchangeable lenses, you're going to have to get yourself some more lenses, right? I imagine those little Fujinon's won't be cheap. If you shot a feature with a canon xl2 you'd have to get the 16x AND a 3x wide angle. Runs up the price a bit.

"Hypothetically" speaking, both cams could be way over 10k properly outfitted.

I think I still might take the Panny just on form factor alone. Although I, like everyone else except Sean, would like to see what JVC's hdv 720p looks like versus Panny's solution. And I still don't know where you can edit 720p 24p hdv.

Other things to consider...viewfinder quailty, mobility, etc etc.

One more thing, in my mind - JVC has more to prove than Panny.

[Barry Green]

You make a point about the lenses -- assumedly you'd need HD-caliber glass. On the one hand, that can make it quite expensive, certainly a lot more expensive than SD-caliber glass.

On the other hand, if you *do* use something like Zeiss DigiPrimes, the quality could be phenomenal.

I guess we'll have to wait until they announce specifications about the lens mount and lens options.

[Joel Corral]

<<<-- Originally posted by Christopher C. Murphy : At $10,000 this won't change people's minds who were and are considering the Z1U.

All I have to say is "Data 19Mps" - a joke for $10,000. You can get a cheap $399 Mini-DV camera from Best Buy with a higher rate - 25Mps! -->>>

yeah but it is avi @ 25 mbs not mpeg @ 25mbs you know more than anyone that 19mbs m2t will have a ton of more data than 25mbs avi.

[Murad Toor]

<<<-- Originally posted by Michael Struthers : And I still don't know where you can edit 720p 24p hdv. -->>>

I can do that today in FCP by transcoding to DVCPROHD 720p24 on capture. It's not HDV strictly speaking, but it's an out-of-the-box solution using HDVxDV and FCPHD. DVCPROHD 720p24 is already in there as a native codec.