Upgrade from HD100 to HD200? at DVinfo.net

Jad Meouchy · February 8th, 2008, 05:31 PM

I'm going to be shooting a lot of 720p60 in the next 6months in rough environments. The HD200 is down around 5500 new. Is it worth the upgrade, or should I wait for their new lineup which could be more than 6months out?

The limitations of the HD100's sensitivity are becoming more obvious every day. Is the 200 noticeably better?

Marc Colemont · February 9th, 2008, 02:10 AM

My 5 cents:
The sensitivity of the chip is the same, the noise level is better with the new electronics when I compared with my HD100.
So when you use some gain, were I used maximum +6 db before on the HD100, I can go +9 db now on the HD251 before I see the same noise level.
Of course lighting the subject is always better, but in those cases were you can't, I start to use some gain, were I didn't use it on the HD100.

Brian Luce · February 9th, 2008, 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Colemont

My 5 cents:
The sensitivity of the chip is the same, the noise level is better with the new electronics when I compared with my HD100.
So when you use some gain, were I used maximum +6 db before on the HD100, I can go +9 db now on the HD251 before I see the same noise level.
Of course lighting the subject is always better, but in those cases were you can't, I start to use some gain, were I didn't use it on the HD100.

Do you notice much improvement in the image? I'm wondering if an HD100 owner might be better off using that money to buy a better lens instead. I've seen used 13x's for 4500 dollars.

Marc Colemont · February 9th, 2008, 04:58 AM

I've done only one job together with the two different camera's during the transition from HD100 to HD251, just before I sold the HD100.
I loaded in both cameras Tim's Wide latitude settings, and then adjusted the HD100 to match as good as possible measuring both on a DSC shart at the same time into HDVrack .
The the HD251 was about one stop more sensitive with this scene loaded.
It might be different with other scene files. Both have the 16X lens.
I've had no 13X lens to compare, So I cannot answer that.
Maybe Tim or Paolo or others have tested both lenses next to each other?

Ian Planchon · February 9th, 2008, 08:10 AM

i would wait, everyone jumped all over the 200 and 250 and us 100 users are most likely going to be in prime position when the new models come out, we wont have just spent 8 grand on a camera...

plus, they never changed the lens' just some menu functions, and hardware, and as you said, they are a little more sensitve from what I heard. wait for the next round or the round after that, my prediction is they are gonna try and compete with the EX1 and rock out the 1080p...or am I just dreaming?

Brian Luce · February 9th, 2008, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Colemont

I've done only one job together with the two different camera's during the transition from HD100 to HD251, just before I sold the HD100.
I loaded in both cameras Tim's Wide latitude settings, and then adjusted the HD100 to match as good as possible measuring both on a DSC shart at the same time into HDVrack .
The the HD251 was about one stop more sensitive with this scene loaded.
It might be different with other scene files. Both have the 16X lens.
I've had no 13X lens to compare, So I cannot answer that.
Maybe Tim or Paolo or others have tested both lenses next to each other?

How about picture quality?

Marc Colemont · February 9th, 2008, 03:46 PM

Ian,

I had a good oppertunity to upgrade to HD251 when I had the chance to sell the HD100 at a fair good price.

The reasons to upgrade for me were the 50/60P, as I work regulary with collegues who also bought now the JVC-200 (from JVC 5100), so we can do multicamera work in the same formats. And for great Slo-Mo in 24,25P projects.
I took the step higher to the HD251 as I also needed HD-SDI, Genlock and time-code.
The small enhancements for the DR-HD100 (auto turn off), Screen flip, Screen info on the output monitor is nice to have but was not a deal breaker.

Bruce,
Seeing the footage next to each other is pretty much the same, other then the things I already mentioned.
Stephen Noe, did a great comparison of the quality difference:
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=79436

Ian Planchon · February 9th, 2008, 04:37 PM

i didnt know the 200 did auto turn off for the DRHD100, thats pretty sweet.

I am still gonna keep wishing for a 1080p version. I havent seen a need to update my gear yet, but I also dont shoot any movies, I am pretty much a news guy.

Jad Meouchy · February 10th, 2008, 03:28 AM

Thanks for all the info/advice. With the current pricing from JVC, I am going to purchase a new 200 this week. I'm sure they'll have something interesting at NAB, but it will take 6 months from announcement to full release.

Brian Luce · February 11th, 2008, 04:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Colemont

Ian,

Bruce,
Seeing the footage next to each other is pretty much the same, other then the things I already mentioned.
Stephen Noe, did a great comparison of the quality difference:
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=79436

It's interesting that S. Noe found different results, he feels there is a marked improvement in image quality.

February 8th, 2008, 05:31 PM	#1
Jad Meouchy Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 663	Upgrade from HD100 to HD200? I'm going to be shooting a lot of 720p60 in the next 6months in rough environments. The HD200 is down around 5500 new. Is it worth the upgrade, or should I wait for their new lineup which could be more than 6months out? The limitations of the HD100's sensitivity are becoming more obvious every day. Is the 200 noticeably better? __________________ software engineer

February 9th, 2008, 02:10 AM	#2
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	My 5 cents: The sensitivity of the chip is the same, the noise level is better with the new electronics when I compared with my HD100. So when you use some gain, were I used maximum +6 db before on the HD100, I can go +9 db now on the HD251 before I see the same noise level. Of course lighting the subject is always better, but in those cases were you can't, I start to use some gain, were I didn't use it on the HD100. __________________ Marc Colemont - Belgium - http://www.mc-productions.be JVC GY-HM850's, HM890, HM600

February 9th, 2008, 04:58 AM	#4
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	I've done only one job together with the two different camera's during the transition from HD100 to HD251, just before I sold the HD100. I loaded in both cameras Tim's Wide latitude settings, and then adjusted the HD100 to match as good as possible measuring both on a DSC shart at the same time into HDVrack . The the HD251 was about one stop more sensitive with this scene loaded. It might be different with other scene files. Both have the 16X lens. I've had no 13X lens to compare, So I cannot answer that. Maybe Tim or Paolo or others have tested both lenses next to each other? __________________ Marc Colemont - Belgium - http://www.mc-productions.be JVC GY-HM850's, HM890, HM600

February 9th, 2008, 03:46 PM	#7
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	Ian, I had a good oppertunity to upgrade to HD251 when I had the chance to sell the HD100 at a fair good price. The reasons to upgrade for me were the 50/60P, as I work regulary with collegues who also bought now the JVC-200 (from JVC 5100), so we can do multicamera work in the same formats. And for great Slo-Mo in 24,25P projects. I took the step higher to the HD251 as I also needed HD-SDI, Genlock and time-code. The small enhancements for the DR-HD100 (auto turn off), Screen flip, Screen info on the output monitor is nice to have but was not a deal breaker. Bruce, Seeing the footage next to each other is pretty much the same, other then the things I already mentioned. Stephen Noe, did a great comparison of the quality difference: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=79436 __________________ Marc Colemont - Belgium - http://www.mc-productions.be JVC GY-HM850's, HM890, HM600

February 10th, 2008, 03:28 AM	#9
Jad Meouchy Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 663	Thanks for all the info/advice. With the current pricing from JVC, I am going to purchase a new 200 this week. I'm sure they'll have something interesting at NAB, but it will take 6 months from announcement to full release. __________________ software engineer

February 9th, 2008, 08:10 AM	#5
Ian Planchon Major Player Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: an Alaskan living in Des Moines, Iowa Posts: 513	i would wait, everyone jumped all over the 200 and 250 and us 100 users are most likely going to be in prime position when the new models come out, we wont have just spent 8 grand on a camera... plus, they never changed the lens' just some menu functions, and hardware, and as you said, they are a little more sensitve from what I heard. wait for the next round or the round after that, my prediction is they are gonna try and compete with the EX1 and rock out the 1080p...or am I just dreaming?

February 9th, 2008, 04:37 PM	#8
Ian Planchon Major Player Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: an Alaskan living in Des Moines, Iowa Posts: 513	i didnt know the 200 did auto turn off for the DRHD100, thats pretty sweet. I am still gonna keep wishing for a 1080p version. I havent seen a need to update my gear yet, but I also dont shoot any movies, I am pretty much a news guy.