BACK SPACE [HDV] P-TAPE

Maxene Kuek · January 23rd, 2008, 03:18 PM

In the updated firmware of the GY-HD100, Menu Screen, OTHERS [2/2] there is a selection for BACK SPACE [HDV] - options P-TAPE, and P-1394 - can someone tell me what this is and when to set each of the options? The default is P-TAPE.

Thanks

Marc Colemont · January 24th, 2008, 09:39 AM

It's a setting to be set at P-1394 When you use the DR-H100. To give priority to the Firewire or Tape recording. It has to do with timings.
Otherwise you could have broken clips on the DR-HD100.

Maxene Kuek · January 25th, 2008, 05:23 AM

Hi Marc - Thanks... Do you mean that if I use the DR100 (Hard Disk recorder, I can record without creating a seperate new clip each time I press record? This has been the ONE reason why we are not using HDD recorders... we want our footage in ONE file.... is this possible??

Marc Colemont · January 26th, 2008, 05:03 AM

No any HardDisk recorder will create seperate files. Even on long clips as most of the Harddisks are been formatted in FAT32 meaning maximum clips of 2Gbyte (it cuts them per 2Gbyte without dropping frames).

Why do you want only one big file? During editing it is so much easier if you have individual file no?
Dragging multiple files on your timeline at once on your NLE does the same what you want.

Maxene Kuek · January 26th, 2008, 02:42 PM

When we shoot an event, it is much easier to scrub through one large file and then cut the clips that we want... We can apply effects to the whole clip ONCE rather than having to do it to the myrids of clips we will end up with doing a wedding - we will be shooting many many different short clips, and we would end up with a huge number of files and easily becomes unmanageable. If ever we want to revert to individual clips, we can still use scene detect to split the tape... Only one problem with the JVC - the tendency for drop outs... I don't seem to be able to cmpletely trust this camera... despite all it's supposed ability to perform well...

Marc Colemont · January 27th, 2008, 05:20 AM

It's just a matter how you organise it in your NLE.
Finding clips way faster then having one long file:
- Create folders of imported clips and move them per item, camera, event etc...
- Label the folders. For bigger projects I make folders per recorded scene, and split it up per camera, or per Wide shots, Close ups, SteadiCam shots etc..
It looks like this takes time but it isn't. Certainly not when you need to re-edit after a few weeks. In no time you are back -into- the project.

Applying effects to clips at once, again it is just a matter of how you organise it in your NLE.
In PPro I cut and edit a piece. When I need to finish it up by applying effects, then I drag the sequence of clips in another sequence, that way you have one clip to apply effect on.
Way faster to modify, as when you edit in the first sequence, the other sequences are modified as well real time.

Sean Adair · January 27th, 2008, 09:37 AM

They are right Maxene. The clips are still reasonably big, and identifying your starts and ends of camera takes is actually a timesaver. Continuos footage plays between clips without a hitch.
In FCP you can either use nested sequences to apply global effects, or use the "paste attributes" command to apply multiple filters/adjustments etc from one clip to any or all others very quickly.
After all, if you are actually editing, there will be more than one clip in your timeline!

Diogo Athouguia · January 27th, 2008, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean Adair

They are right Maxene. The clips are still reasonably big, and identifying your starts and ends of camera takes is actually a timesaver. Continuos footage plays between clips without a hitch.
In FCP you can either use nested sequences to apply global effects, or use the "paste attributes" command to apply multiple filters/adjustments etc from one clip to any or all others very quickly.
After all, if you are actually editing, there will be more than one clip in your timeline!

Just like on PPro, that's my way of editing. I copy the effects from one clip and paste them into the others. I also see no reason for big clips, it's much easier to find what we need on small ones.

Maxene Kuek · January 28th, 2008, 09:14 PM

Not when you are doing a wedding an have TONS of 5-10 sec clips! Yes, we do end up with lots of clips in PPro, but that isour choice... I know that you can paste prsets onto clips, but I would like to be able to do that to one long capture (tape) rather than having to do that to lots an lots of clips... This is not a problem if you have a script and you have set takes... yes, using the HDDR is great for that... but when you are running around filming a wedding where things are time critical, the last thing you want to do is to organise clips into Folders...

Justin Ferar · January 28th, 2008, 11:51 PM

I have to agree with Maxene on this one. Shooting run and gun events is much different than a film narrative. It's much faster to skip logging and just put the whole clip in the timeline and start chopping. Media 100 actually pioneered this workflow way back when. When you do 30 events a year you become very efficient. That said, every editor is different. It's always funny to sit with another editor and see the little differences in workflow.

J.

Marc Colemont · January 29th, 2008, 10:12 AM

Not convinced Justin & Maxene,
For a reception for example I save a lot of time by having these individual clips.
I drag and drop the whole reception on the timeline, and delete instantly double pictures or wrong pictures and use a function to right click in the empty areas to remove the empty spaces again.
Now you can never get that speed by having one long clip and have to do in and outpoints for each few seconds.

Maxene Kuek · January 29th, 2008, 04:04 PM

Hi Marc, We do not set in and out points... we just pull out the RAZOR tool and cut what we want - easy... If we shoot into individual clips, we would STILL need to cut, so there is really no time saving there... We recon we have our work flow quite effecient now, but are open to be shown otherwise... We almost bought a HDD recorder, but the individual clips was what put us off, this despite the advantage of less drop out than tape....

Diogo Athouguia · January 29th, 2008, 06:45 PM

I agree with Marc. When I edit weddings I use the scene detect function to split the tape in individual clips. Before placing them on the timeline, I preview the clip to see if its good and to set the in point, then I put it on the timeline and set the out point using the music's rythm. I used Maxene's method before but I found this way to be much faster, but if your workflow is efficient keep it that way.

Marc, that function you use to remove the empty spaces is the ripple delete right? Try deleting the clip using alt+backspace, I think it will save you some time.

January 23rd, 2008, 03:18 PM	#1
Maxene Kuek Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 30	BACK SPACE [HDV] P-TAPE - What is it? In the updated firmware of the GY-HD100, Menu Screen, OTHERS [2/2] there is a selection for BACK SPACE [HDV] - options P-TAPE, and P-1394 - can someone tell me what this is and when to set each of the options? The default is P-TAPE. Thanks

January 24th, 2008, 09:39 AM	#2
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	It's a setting to be set at P-1394 When you use the DR-H100. To give priority to the Firewire or Tape recording. It has to do with timings. Otherwise you could have broken clips on the DR-HD100. __________________ Marc Colemont - Belgium - http://www.mc-productions.be JVC GY-HM850's, HM890, HM600

January 26th, 2008, 05:03 AM	#4
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	No any HardDisk recorder will create seperate files. Even on long clips as most of the Harddisks are been formatted in FAT32 meaning maximum clips of 2Gbyte (it cuts them per 2Gbyte without dropping frames). Why do you want only one big file? During editing it is so much easier if you have individual file no? Dragging multiple files on your timeline at once on your NLE does the same what you want. __________________ Marc Colemont - Belgium - http://www.mc-productions.be JVC GY-HM850's, HM890, HM600

January 27th, 2008, 05:20 AM	#6
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	It's just a matter how you organise it in your NLE. Finding clips way faster then having one long file: - Create folders of imported clips and move them per item, camera, event etc... - Label the folders. For bigger projects I make folders per recorded scene, and split it up per camera, or per Wide shots, Close ups, SteadiCam shots etc.. It looks like this takes time but it isn't. Certainly not when you need to re-edit after a few weeks. In no time you are back -into- the project. Applying effects to clips at once, again it is just a matter of how you organise it in your NLE. In PPro I cut and edit a piece. When I need to finish it up by applying effects, then I drag the sequence of clips in another sequence, that way you have one clip to apply effect on. Way faster to modify, as when you edit in the first sequence, the other sequences are modified as well real time. __________________ Marc Colemont - Belgium - http://www.mc-productions.be JVC GY-HM850's, HM890, HM600 Last edited by Marc Colemont; January 27th, 2008 at 08:12 AM.

January 27th, 2008, 09:37 AM	#7
Sean Adair Major Player Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New York, NY Posts: 463	They are right Maxene. The clips are still reasonably big, and identifying your starts and ends of camera takes is actually a timesaver. Continuos footage plays between clips without a hitch. In FCP you can either use nested sequences to apply global effects, or use the "paste attributes" command to apply multiple filters/adjustments etc from one clip to any or all others very quickly. After all, if you are actually editing, there will be more than one clip in your timeline! __________________ Sean Adair - NYC - www.adairproductions.com JVC GY-HM-700 with 17x5 lens, MacPro 3.2ghz 8-core, 18gb. (JVC HD200 4 sale soon)

January 25th, 2008, 05:23 AM	#3
Maxene Kuek Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 30	Hi Marc - Thanks... Do you mean that if I use the DR100 (Hard Disk recorder, I can record without creating a seperate new clip each time I press record? This has been the ONE reason why we are not using HDD recorders... we want our footage in ONE file.... is this possible??

January 26th, 2008, 02:42 PM	#5
Maxene Kuek Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 30	When we shoot an event, it is much easier to scrub through one large file and then cut the clips that we want... We can apply effects to the whole clip ONCE rather than having to do it to the myrids of clips we will end up with doing a wedding - we will be shooting many many different short clips, and we would end up with a huge number of files and easily becomes unmanageable. If ever we want to revert to individual clips, we can still use scene detect to split the tape... Only one problem with the JVC - the tendency for drop outs... I don't seem to be able to cmpletely trust this camera... despite all it's supposed ability to perform well...

January 28th, 2008, 09:14 PM	#9
Maxene Kuek Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 30	Not when you are doing a wedding an have TONS of 5-10 sec clips! Yes, we do end up with lots of clips in PPro, but that isour choice... I know that you can paste prsets onto clips, but I would like to be able to do that to one long capture (tape) rather than having to do that to lots an lots of clips... This is not a problem if you have a script and you have set takes... yes, using the HDDR is great for that... but when you are running around filming a wedding where things are time critical, the last thing you want to do is to organise clips into Folders...

January 28th, 2008, 11:51 PM	#10
Justin Ferar Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Larkspur, CA Posts: 378	I have to agree with Maxene on this one. Shooting run and gun events is much different than a film narrative. It's much faster to skip logging and just put the whole clip in the timeline and start chopping. Media 100 actually pioneered this workflow way back when. When you do 30 events a year you become very efficient. That said, every editor is different. It's always funny to sit with another editor and see the little differences in workflow. J. __________________ www.justinferar.com www.weddingsonfilm.com

January 29th, 2008, 10:12 AM	#11
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	Not convinced Justin & Maxene, For a reception for example I save a lot of time by having these individual clips. I drag and drop the whole reception on the timeline, and delete instantly double pictures or wrong pictures and use a function to right click in the empty areas to remove the empty spaces again. Now you can never get that speed by having one long clip and have to do in and outpoints for each few seconds. __________________ Marc Colemont - Belgium - http://www.mc-productions.be JVC GY-HM850's, HM890, HM600

January 29th, 2008, 04:04 PM	#12
Maxene Kuek Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 30	Hi Marc, We do not set in and out points... we just pull out the RAZOR tool and cut what we want - easy... If we shoot into individual clips, we would STILL need to cut, so there is really no time saving there... We recon we have our work flow quite effecient now, but are open to be shown otherwise... We almost bought a HDD recorder, but the individual clips was what put us off, this despite the advantage of less drop out than tape.... Last edited by Maxene Kuek; January 29th, 2008 at 04:06 PM. Reason: added point

January 29th, 2008, 06:45 PM	#13
Diogo Athouguia Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Portugal Posts: 282	I agree with Marc. When I edit weddings I use the scene detect function to split the tape in individual clips. Before placing them on the timeline, I preview the clip to see if its good and to set the in point, then I put it on the timeline and set the out point using the music's rythm. I used Maxene's method before but I found this way to be much faster, but if your workflow is efficient keep it that way. Marc, that function you use to remove the empty spaces is the ripple delete right? Try deleting the clip using alt+backspace, I think it will save you some time.