Truth abouth HD10 output in REC mode at DVinfo.net

Alex Raskin · October 1st, 2003, 07:16 PM

There seems to be some confusion regarding what kind of output HD10 has in REC mode.

Some forum participants insist that the camera allows to choose up to 720p on its Component output during Recording.

This stems from the fact that the cam's menu indeed seems to allow output signal changes in Rec mode.

JVC manual however says that the cam only outputs in 480p during recording, period.

Here's the final answer:

JVC is right. These cameras only output 480p via Component during recording. (Of course, users can still choose whatever signal conversion they please in HD Play mode.)

I also noticed some strong aliasing on Component out during REC - which seems to be introduced by JVC to help focusing?

To see what I'm talking about, try shooting a closeup of some black text on paper. You'll see (at least on HD monitor) that Component out produces strong white aliasing around the letters.

My speculation is that JVC did it on purpose to help focusing: the aliasing appears only when fine lines (like text) are actually in focus. Visually it looks like the image "pops" when in focus (expression coined in by Steve Mullen).

This same effect occurs when looking at cam's LCD monitor, and makes it really easy to say whether or not the focus is achieved.

It could be that the aliasing is simply a result of 480p downconversion of the cam's HD signal. But I think it is likely that JVC did it on purpose in Rec mode.

And now, for twisted ending... wanna still see full-res 720p output while recording? Get the signal not from Component out, but from the iLink port, it's coming out 720p in REC mode just fine.

For this, run firewire cable (I got 30ft one by Laird at $70) from the cam to DH30000 D-VHS recorder, then take D-VHS' Component Out to HD monitor. Voila! - 720p, dramatically high-res monitoring in REC mode! (No aliased edges there, mind you.) The only drawback is about 1.5s delay introduced by DH30K's processor. Credit for this solution goes to Andre Jesmanowicz - see his other great posts in this forum. (Latest D-VHS, DH40000, will work just the same of course.)

Steve Mullen · October 1st, 2003, 10:02 PM

Alex is right on all counts.

Emilio Le Roux · October 7th, 2003, 08:22 PM

I have a couple questions, I think some people here could answer.

First of all, is it possible to monitor in a standard NTSC monitor or TV set while shooting with the JY-HD10?
Since in HD recording the JVC only outputs 480p (which would be the SD format?) would it display normally in any S-video or composite monitor?

And other related question: while using the camera in VIDEO mode, i.e. using as a recorder from the IEEE input, will it output the video thru the composite/s-video connectors, so I can use a external TV to monitor editing using the camera as a bridge?

Sorry if these questions are obvious. I have a small but growing production company and I am looking after buying the JY-HD10 as a first, mid-range camera. I have not access to this equipment here, i have to import it and I am a bit concerned about the investment.

Emilio

Ken Hodson · October 8th, 2003, 12:18 PM

Would that HD output during REC setup allow taping on the DVHS? If so would there be any drawbacks as far as quality?
Ken

October 1st, 2003, 07:16 PM	#1
Alex Raskin Trustee Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,435	Truth abouth HD10 output in REC mode There seems to be some confusion regarding what kind of output HD10 has in REC mode. Some forum participants insist that the camera allows to choose up to 720p on its Component output during Recording. This stems from the fact that the cam's menu indeed seems to allow output signal changes in Rec mode. JVC manual however says that the cam only outputs in 480p during recording, period. Here's the final answer: JVC is right. These cameras only output 480p via Component during recording. (Of course, users can still choose whatever signal conversion they please in HD Play mode.) I also noticed some strong aliasing on Component out during REC - which seems to be introduced by JVC to help focusing? To see what I'm talking about, try shooting a closeup of some black text on paper. You'll see (at least on HD monitor) that Component out produces strong white aliasing around the letters. My speculation is that JVC did it on purpose to help focusing: the aliasing appears only when fine lines (like text) are actually in focus. Visually it looks like the image "pops" when in focus (expression coined in by Steve Mullen). This same effect occurs when looking at cam's LCD monitor, and makes it really easy to say whether or not the focus is achieved. It could be that the aliasing is simply a result of 480p downconversion of the cam's HD signal. But I think it is likely that JVC did it on purpose in Rec mode. And now, for twisted ending... wanna still see full-res 720p output while recording? Get the signal not from Component out, but from the iLink port, it's coming out 720p in REC mode just fine. For this, run firewire cable (I got 30ft one by Laird at $70) from the cam to DH30000 D-VHS recorder, then take D-VHS' Component Out to HD monitor. Voila! - 720p, dramatically high-res monitoring in REC mode! (No aliased edges there, mind you.) The only drawback is about 1.5s delay introduced by DH30K's processor. Credit for this solution goes to Andre Jesmanowicz - see his other great posts in this forum. (Latest D-VHS, DH40000, will work just the same of course.)

October 1st, 2003, 10:02 PM	#2
Steve Mullen HDV Cinema Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 4,007	Alex is right on all counts. __________________ Switcher's Quick Guide to the Avid Media Composer >>> http://home.mindspring.com/~d-v-c

October 7th, 2003, 08:22 PM	#3
Emilio Le Roux Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Salvador, Bahia Posts: 33	about monitoring I have a couple questions, I think some people here could answer. First of all, is it possible to monitor in a standard NTSC monitor or TV set while shooting with the JY-HD10? Since in HD recording the JVC only outputs 480p (which would be the SD format?) would it display normally in any S-video or composite monitor? And other related question: while using the camera in VIDEO mode, i.e. using as a recorder from the IEEE input, will it output the video thru the composite/s-video connectors, so I can use a external TV to monitor editing using the camera as a bridge? Sorry if these questions are obvious. I have a small but growing production company and I am looking after buying the JY-HD10 as a first, mid-range camera. I have not access to this equipment here, i have to import it and I am a bit concerned about the investment. Emilio

October 8th, 2003, 12:18 PM	#4
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	Would that HD output during REC setup allow taping on the DVHS? If so would there be any drawbacks as far as quality? Ken __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.