JVC Everio HDV camcorder at DVinfo.net

Paulo Teixeira · March 4th, 2006, 08:19 PM

I know this camcorder have been mentioned here before but I want to know if any of you have any more information about it is such as release date, etc.

Ken Hodson · March 5th, 2006, 04:07 PM

There has been no HDV Everio announced by JVC. I think you have your facts mixed up.

John McManimie · March 5th, 2006, 05:55 PM

What little information there was on this was discussed here:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...ght=HDV+Everio

Ken Hodson · March 6th, 2006, 05:56 PM

Everything appears to be spun off of a one paragraph TechDigest article, and proliferated in these very forums. JVC has not officially announced anything. They are due for a HD1/10 replacement though. Usually JVC doesn't make any big secrets of what is comming out, and so far JVC has said nothing.
This brings up another question. HDV is a tape standard. What will the HDD varient be called?

Robert M Wright · March 6th, 2006, 06:26 PM

I'd like to see JVC produce an HDV camera that's essentially a hybrid of the HD10 and HD100. 3 1/3" CCDs, handheld (or shoulder mount would be okay too), fixed lens, AF, OIS, and closer to the HD100 for image acquisition control (none of that no simultaneous control of manual iris and shutter sort of stuff). Essentially, something akin to the FX1/Z1, but 720p native rather than 1080i.

Wayne Morellini · March 10th, 2006, 05:25 AM

As you can see there are a couple of different articles there with differing information, and the picture of the thing.

The delay is curious though, we noted a run down in HD1 stock some months ago (see the HD1/10 forum). There are a couple of threads on it, and I mentioned one guy that was at a JVC event where they told the audience that it was coming soon (that was around the 3rd quarter of last year).

Of course, they could be holding out for NAB or latter (why?). Similarly, at a recent event I had a chance to talk to Sony and it's dealer reps privately, I was told that there were new cameras to be released at NAB (Take that as unconfirmed).

My wish list, uncompressed HDMI, XDCAM HD, or better codec (10bit+ 50Mb/s+/or H264), sensor performance of 60-96db s/n, and 10+ stop latitude, 720p or true 1920*1080p with F1.2 lens, and full manual controls.... Hold it, I got to slap myself back into reality.

Well manual controls, better codec and a sensor/lens that has better latitude than the A1 and low light than the z1, that would be great (though, a Cypress Fillfactory IBIS5a with custom filter, or smaller low end Altasens would also be great ;) ).

Ken Hodson · March 10th, 2006, 12:44 PM

better codec?

Wayne Morellini · March 11th, 2006, 09:26 AM

Anything they like, but there is a h264 codec camera chip due out this month, and it has mid bit-rate, so 25Mb/s might be feasible (and yes, I know they aren't really going to abandon HDV, but a new version of HDV based on it would be nice). I am only giving the market observers a hint, rather than, eek, we give you HDV720p with new version of HD1 chip, with semi auto controls (please pass the HC1/3 please) camera ( I believe we should ask for what we want and at the price we want before we get what we don't want).

Ken Hodson · March 11th, 2006, 02:34 PM

Editing applications would need to support it. Thats the only real hold back. Considering the size and scope of HDV, as of yet only one application, AspectHD on the PC side, supports all of the HDV modes. One can see that new codecs aren't absorbed very quickly as far as NLE's go.

Dan Euritt · March 11th, 2006, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Hodson

Editing applications would need to support it.

worst case, it wouldn't be any different than the present "solution" of having to re-encode all raw hdv footage before you can edit it.

the real problem is that there are licensing issues and hardware support issues with new codecs... in particular, nobody is going to do anything without new silicon for the cameras.

that is finally happening with h.264, and it's going to be very interesting... camera manufacturers could keep on using the same tape drives that they are presently using for dv and hdv, just feed the drives a new h.264 data stream instead.

Ken Hodson · March 11th, 2006, 04:50 PM

Long live mini-DV. The last tape format.
A mp4 HDV2 on mini-DV would bring many smiles.

Wayne Morellini · March 12th, 2006, 04:30 AM

The editing situation is similar to what we had with the JVC HD1/10. At that stage, it shipped with a less than desired HDV software, but others followed, because it was the way the industry would move. At the moment h264 is the consumer target for the future with many products planned to support it, so h264 should be under consideration by a number of companies (I even was looking at a 8 channel h264 capture board for security cameras yesterday).

Silicon, look at:

www.ambarella.com

This is a very advanced integrated camera codec chip, it will do above 15Mb/s, there is a professional model ($1000 from a report). Even though it is decked out for a camera, I estimate it should easily go onto a PCI card, USB2.0, or main board, for editing and capture, or h264 HDTV (I don't know if there is any plans for this, but there is Mpeg 4 HD aimed for Europe, and cable can use anything they want). I have not approached the company, but I have approached a few people to test out there interest in a component/HDMI HD capture unit (I was aiming for low compression visually lossless like cineform does) but people really aren't that alert. The thing is that if a reference board is available with standard software, then 99% of the work has been done already by somebody else, all you then have to worry about is contract manufacturing it in volume. But the truth is that, depending on price and size of reference board, that once somebody does it, they may just be able to order the reference board in a batch at a discount and repackage it with a drive and component/HDMI ports. There is more unrealised functionality that could be added, but I'm keeping that to myself.

One manufacturer is closer than the other two (by the December news reports) with a HD camera, see the news threads I posted about it, and March is the availability of the chip. The Japanese were reported to be very impressed. I am not saying that JVC would do this, but it would be good if they had a change of heart and did ;).

Such a codec would be more suitable to a hard drive rather than tape.

I wonder, should I post the h264 capture idea to alternative imaging, now that I have revealed what I "was" doing in the background?

Thanks

Wayne.

Paulo Teixeira · March 19th, 2006, 09:10 PM

I’m sorry I took so long to finally respond to this article even though I was the one who started it. I’m the type of person that always knows which type of camcorders from which companies that are coming out but this camcorder by JVC has left me in the cold. I mean you can’t find anything useful on the internet about this camcorder. JVC is definitely doing a wonderful job keeping this camcorder under warps.

Wayne Morellini,
Thats good news to hear. Let me take a guess, a 3 chip ¼ inch camcorder that is the same size category with the Canon GL2 and the Panasonic DVC30. OH an 3 CMOS

Ken Hodson · March 20th, 2006, 12:29 AM

Exactly the point. There has never been anything released by JVC saying there would be a HDV Everio. The big deal with the Everio, which JVC is marketing quite hard, is it is a HDD based cam which records to a form of mpeg2. Some people took this to mean HDV which it is not. JVC has never been quiet about any of its HD cams. We will know about any new ones long befor release.

Chris Hurd · March 20th, 2006, 01:48 AM

Some folks might not be clear on the concept: if it doesn't use tape, then it ain't HDV. From the official HDV consortium web site at www.hdv-info.net:

(2) License of HDV trademarks

HDV and HDV logo will be licensed only to the tape drive products which can record and play video cassette compliant to the HDV Format (HDV Tapes). The HDV trademarks may not be used on any products without a such tape drive.

While JVC might produce an Everio camcorder using a digital video codec similar to HDV, they most certainly will not brand it as an "HDV camcorder" because its lack of a tape transport clearly prohibits them from doing so. There will be no such thing as a disk-based or drive-based HDV camcorder. Hope this helps,

March 4th, 2006, 08:19 PM	#1
Paulo Teixeira Trustee Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 1,773	JVC Everio HDV camcorder I know this camcorder have been mentioned here before but I want to know if any of you have any more information about it is such as release date, etc.

March 5th, 2006, 04:07 PM	#2
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	There has been no HDV Everio announced by JVC. I think you have your facts mixed up. __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

March 6th, 2006, 05:56 PM	#4
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	Everything appears to be spun off of a one paragraph TechDigest article, and proliferated in these very forums. JVC has not officially announced anything. They are due for a HD1/10 replacement though. Usually JVC doesn't make any big secrets of what is comming out, and so far JVC has said nothing. This brings up another question. HDV is a tape standard. What will the HDD varient be called? __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

March 10th, 2006, 12:44 PM	#7
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	better codec? __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

March 11th, 2006, 02:34 PM	#9
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	Editing applications would need to support it. Thats the only real hold back. Considering the size and scope of HDV, as of yet only one application, AspectHD on the PC side, supports all of the HDV modes. One can see that new codecs aren't absorbed very quickly as far as NLE's go. __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

March 5th, 2006, 05:55 PM	#3
John McManimie Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 314	What little information there was on this was discussed here: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...ght=HDV+Everio

March 6th, 2006, 06:26 PM	#5
Robert M Wright Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Minnesota (USA) Posts: 2,171	I'd like to see JVC produce an HDV camera that's essentially a hybrid of the HD10 and HD100. 3 1/3" CCDs, handheld (or shoulder mount would be okay too), fixed lens, AF, OIS, and closer to the HD100 for image acquisition control (none of that no simultaneous control of manual iris and shutter sort of stuff). Essentially, something akin to the FX1/Z1, but 720p native rather than 1080i.

March 10th, 2006, 05:25 AM	#6
Wayne Morellini Inner Circle Join Date: May 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 2,762	As you can see there are a couple of different articles there with differing information, and the picture of the thing. The delay is curious though, we noted a run down in HD1 stock some months ago (see the HD1/10 forum). There are a couple of threads on it, and I mentioned one guy that was at a JVC event where they told the audience that it was coming soon (that was around the 3rd quarter of last year). Of course, they could be holding out for NAB or latter (why?). Similarly, at a recent event I had a chance to talk to Sony and it's dealer reps privately, I was told that there were new cameras to be released at NAB (Take that as unconfirmed). My wish list, uncompressed HDMI, XDCAM HD, or better codec (10bit+ 50Mb/s+/or H264), sensor performance of 60-96db s/n, and 10+ stop latitude, 720p or true 1920*1080p with F1.2 lens, and full manual controls.... Hold it, I got to slap myself back into reality. Well manual controls, better codec and a sensor/lens that has better latitude than the A1 and low light than the z1, that would be great (though, a Cypress Fillfactory IBIS5a with custom filter, or smaller low end Altasens would also be great ;) ).

March 11th, 2006, 09:26 AM	#8
Wayne Morellini Inner Circle Join Date: May 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 2,762	Anything they like, but there is a h264 codec camera chip due out this month, and it has mid bit-rate, so 25Mb/s might be feasible (and yes, I know they aren't really going to abandon HDV, but a new version of HDV based on it would be nice). I am only giving the market observers a hint, rather than, eek, we give you HDV720p with new version of HD1 chip, with semi auto controls (please pass the HC1/3 please) camera ( I believe we should ask for what we want and at the price we want before we get what we don't want).

March 11th, 2006, 04:50 PM	#11
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	Long live mini-DV. The last tape format. A mp4 HDV2 on mini-DV would bring many smiles. __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

March 12th, 2006, 04:30 AM	#12
Wayne Morellini Inner Circle Join Date: May 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 2,762	The editing situation is similar to what we had with the JVC HD1/10. At that stage, it shipped with a less than desired HDV software, but others followed, because it was the way the industry would move. At the moment h264 is the consumer target for the future with many products planned to support it, so h264 should be under consideration by a number of companies (I even was looking at a 8 channel h264 capture board for security cameras yesterday). Silicon, look at: www.ambarella.com This is a very advanced integrated camera codec chip, it will do above 15Mb/s, there is a professional model ($1000 from a report). Even though it is decked out for a camera, I estimate it should easily go onto a PCI card, USB2.0, or main board, for editing and capture, or h264 HDTV (I don't know if there is any plans for this, but there is Mpeg 4 HD aimed for Europe, and cable can use anything they want). I have not approached the company, but I have approached a few people to test out there interest in a component/HDMI HD capture unit (I was aiming for low compression visually lossless like cineform does) but people really aren't that alert. The thing is that if a reference board is available with standard software, then 99% of the work has been done already by somebody else, all you then have to worry about is contract manufacturing it in volume. But the truth is that, depending on price and size of reference board, that once somebody does it, they may just be able to order the reference board in a batch at a discount and repackage it with a drive and component/HDMI ports. There is more unrealised functionality that could be added, but I'm keeping that to myself. One manufacturer is closer than the other two (by the December news reports) with a HD camera, see the news threads I posted about it, and March is the availability of the chip. The Japanese were reported to be very impressed. I am not saying that JVC would do this, but it would be good if they had a change of heart and did ;). Such a codec would be more suitable to a hard drive rather than tape. I wonder, should I post the h264 capture idea to alternative imaging, now that I have revealed what I "was" doing in the background? Thanks Wayne.

March 19th, 2006, 09:10 PM	#13
Paulo Teixeira Trustee Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 1,773	I’m sorry I took so long to finally respond to this article even though I was the one who started it. I’m the type of person that always knows which type of camcorders from which companies that are coming out but this camcorder by JVC has left me in the cold. I mean you can’t find anything useful on the internet about this camcorder. JVC is definitely doing a wonderful job keeping this camcorder under warps. Wayne Morellini, Thats good news to hear. Let me take a guess, a 3 chip ¼ inch camcorder that is the same size category with the Canon GL2 and the Panasonic DVC30. OH an 3 CMOS

March 20th, 2006, 12:29 AM	#14
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	Exactly the point. There has never been anything released by JVC saying there would be a HDV Everio. The big deal with the Everio, which JVC is marketing quite hard, is it is a HDD based cam which records to a form of mpeg2. Some people took this to mean HDV which it is not. JVC has never been quiet about any of its HD cams. We will know about any new ones long befor release. __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

March 20th, 2006, 01:48 AM	#15
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Some folks might not be clear on the concept: if it doesn't use tape, then it ain't HDV. From the official HDV consortium web site at www.hdv-info.net: (2) License of HDV trademarks HDV and HDV logo will be licensed only to the tape drive products which can record and play video cassette compliant to the HDV Format (HDV Tapes). The HDV trademarks may not be used on any products without a such tape drive. While JVC might produce an Everio camcorder using a digital video codec similar to HDV, they most certainly will not brand it as an "HDV camcorder" because its lack of a tape transport clearly prohibits them from doing so. There will be no such thing as a disk-based or drive-based HDV camcorder. Hope this helps, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!