Which jib/ crane for travelling light?

[Thomas Schwenger]

Hi,

do you have any recommendations for a jib/ crane in the 3-5m range that is well suited for travelling light - under 10kg - and not taking up too much space (length around 1m when packed, so no overcharge baggage when taking a plane) and available in Europe?
What about stability and smoothness of the shots?

I found these, they are similar priced, around 2.500 EUR, incl VAT

A1 light-crane / Reisekran / Kamerakran
Mela Leichtkran Astro 350
ABC MiniCrane 350

[Hart Boyd]

You might want to look at the MicroDolly Jib System also.


http://www.microdolly.com/micro_3.html

[Thomas Schwenger]

Hart,

the Microdolly looks really good, but when I equip the jib with the accessories and extensions that are provided with the other cranes, the prices here in Europe add easily up to EUR 5000 and that is far off my budget.

Any other suggestions/ experiences?

[Andrew Dean]

Interesting question. My advantajib weighs around 25lbs (roughly 10kg) but is longer than a meter. For me, the excess baggage is worth having full pan/tilt articulation, but thats me.

This might be obvious to you but in case you overlooked it, I'll mention it anyways. The weight of the jib is nothing compared to the weight of the counterweights. The longer the arm, the more weight you need. To fly a sony fx1 (not a very heavy camera) at the 10' (roughly 3 meters) length on my advantajib requires something like 35kg of counterweight. To fly an ex3 requires upwards of 55kg at the operator end. There is an extension that lowers that down quite a bit (but makes it harder to control) but it still needs a good 35kg to fly an ex3... and thats at 3 meters. At 5 meters, thats going to multiply. Using the weight ratios, that would estimate an ex3 to require 90kg of counterweight. (obviously this will vary depending on the length of the arm on the operator side, but its still going to be a crapload of weight).

I got sucked into my advantajib being shoulder portable... but as with any jib, you gotta have a buttload of weights as well, which puts a damper in the super portable concept. Several jibs offer baskets for counterweight, but 80-90kg is a LOT of rocks, and a pretty darn big basket.

I apologize if thats all obvious stuff. I just thought I'd mention it in case you hadn't considered it. It makes shorter jibs like the se7en jib a lot more practical/attractive. (and you can do a lot of magic with a short jib).

cheers!

[Thomas Schwenger]

Andrew,

when I meant travelling light, I meant the jib to be light. I can (almost) always purchase the weights at a local store and throw them away before flying back.
The amount of counter weight for the advanta-jib shocks me a bit as I know for the other jibs I had on my list the ratio is about 1:3 up to 1:4 for a lenght of 3 meter total (2m before pivot point and 1m after), so this results for my EX1 in a total of 20-25kg.
Nevertheless, the advanta-jib looks very promising, although a bit pricey regarding the actual currency rate - have you bought it with both extensions and the back extension and would you recommend it?

[Sheldon D. Charron]

Originally Posted by Andrew Dean

Interesting question. My advantajib weighs around 25lbs (roughly 10kg) but is longer than a meter. For me, the excess baggage is worth having full pan/tilt articulation, but thats me.

This might be obvious to you but in case you overlooked it, I'll mention it anyways. The weight of the jib is nothing compared to the weight of the counterweights. The longer the arm, the more weight you need. To fly a sony fx1 (not a very heavy camera) at the 10' (roughly 3 meters) length on my advantajib requires something like 35kg of counterweight. To fly an ex3 requires upwards of 55kg at the operator end. There is an extension that lowers that down quite a bit (but makes it harder to control) but it still needs a good 35kg to fly an ex3... and thats at 3 meters. At 5 meters, thats going to multiply. Using the weight ratios, that would estimate an ex3 to require 90kg of counterweight. (obviously this will vary depending on the length of the arm on the operator side, but its still going to be a crapload of weight).

I got sucked into my advantajib being shoulder portable... but as with any jib, you gotta have a buttload of weights as well, which puts a damper in the super portable concept. Several jibs offer baskets for counterweight, but 80-90kg is a LOT of rocks, and a pretty darn big basket.

I apologize if thats all obvious stuff. I just thought I'd mention it in case you hadn't considered it. It makes shorter jibs like the se7en jib a lot more practical/attractive. (and you can do a lot of magic with a short jib).

cheers!

I watched the video on the advanta-jib, but I'm confused as how to operate the pan/tilt. Can you explain how that is done? I also liked the Seven, but it appears that the only way to operate it is from the camera end, and in many circumstances, I want to operate from the counter weight end. For example, when operating from on a rooftop, bridge, balcony, rock ledge, truck bed, etc.

[Andrew Dean]

This reply is probably a few months late...
Sorry.


You control the advantajib from the back end basically like how you'd control a tripod head. If you pan the control arm, you pan the camera. If you tilt the control arm, you tilt the camera. Its sorta like having a little remote control head on the back end that you use to control the head on the front. It can work well, but takes a fair bit of practice to make perfectly smooth.

The pan is controlled by a cable, the tilt by hydraulics.

Cheers!
-A

[Andrew Dean]

Hehe. and this is even LATER, and likely irrelevant, but i'll respond for the anthropologists...

The weights i was estimating were for the full 10' reach. Thats over 3 meters AFTER the center point. (yes i have both extensions and like 'em) There isn't any "technology" to the weight requirements for jibs/cranes other than the weight of the jib/crane. After that its all physics. The advantajib is very light for its length, about the lightest 10' reach you'll find, so the comparisons to cranes after that would be based solely on the length of the arm on the control side. The shorter the arm, the less the operator has to move to control things. The longer, the more you have to squat and reach... but with less weight. The advantajib has an extension arm that lets you use less weight, but its at the expense of having to move around a lot more to control things.

Since thats the tradeoff with any crane, and since physics dictates the amount of weight needed, most comparisons between weight ratios of different cranes are kinda silly. The only real variable is how much the crane itself weighs. The length of the arm and the control arm is variable in many systems.

hope that helps... somebody in the future!

cheers,
-a

Originally Posted by Thomas Schwenger

Andrew,

when I meant travelling light, I meant the jib to be light. I can (almost) always purchase the weights at a local store and throw them away before flying back.
The amount of counter weight for the advanta-jib shocks me a bit as I know for the other jibs I had on my list the ratio is about 1:3 up to 1:4 for a lenght of 3 meter total (2m before pivot point and 1m after), so this results for my EX1 in a total of 20-25kg.
Nevertheless, the advanta-jib looks very promising, although a bit pricey regarding the actual currency rate - have you bought it with both extensions and the back extension and would you recommend it?