Mid to High End Turnkey Editing System – June 2007

[Stuart Brontman]

I'm about to take the plunge into the quad core world of an Intel Q6600. I might even have it slightly over-clocked by a qualified builder.

Can someone shed some light on the never-ending controversy about the RAM amount needed (and used) for a 32 bit operating system like XP Pro or Vista 32? Some claim 2 gig is it, others say CS3 programs can access 3 gig (especially with some sort of modification to the ini. file), and others say it's worth it to go with 4 gig. My current older dual xeon has 4 gig of RAM, and AE 7.0 clearly says it's accessing only 2 gig.

The only other option is running XP Pro 64 bit, but I've heard it has compatibility issues with too many drivers and hardware. I'm upgrading to CS3 apps. I also use the Xena LH board along with Prospect HD.

Thanks for any feedback on this.

Stuart

[Jon McGuffin]

Stuart,

This is a pretty complicated subject... Windows Vista and XP Pro are both 32-bit operating systems share the same memory addressing limitations (sans the 64-bit versions obviously).... Here is a good article that's a little more geared toward the gamer but still usefull..

part 1
http://www.anandtech.com/gadgets/showdoc.aspx?i=3034

part 2
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...oc.aspx?i=3044

part 3
http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=3060

Much of that information might blow over most peoples heads (as it does mine in many cases) but anybody who can discipline themselves to get through it will come away with a much better understanding of what is going on with the whole 2Gb vs 4Gb deal..

Jon

PS: My advice.... If you can afford the extra $125, get the 4Gb and be prepared for the future and give your current NLE anything it can take advantage of...

[Jeff Bekeris]

Just to let those contemplating doing your own PC build that mine went pretty well. I ordered everything from mwave the Tuesday after Labor day and it was all on my doorstep by Friday! Actually, I didn't realize they are only about 60 miles from me. Here's what I ended up building:

ANTEC P182 Aluminum Mid Tower Case Black
MSI P35 PLATINUM INTEL P35 CHIPSET ATX FORM FACTOR 2xPCI-E(X16)/2xPCI-E(X1)/2xPCI/4xDDR2 W/SATA2 RAID,LAN(Gb),1394,USB 2.0 & AUDIO
ENERMAX EG495AX-VEW SFMA 485W POWER SUPPLY
CORE 2 QUAD Q6600 2.4G (1066Mhz)
KINGSTON 2GB DDR2 667=(1GB x 2)
XFX GEFORCE 8600GTS 256MB PCI EXPRESS XXX 730MHZ DDR3 DUAL DVI
CREATIVE LABS SOUNDBLASTER X-FI XTREME GAMER
WD 150GB WD1500ADFD SATA150 16MB 10,000RPM
HITACHI 1TB 0A34193 / 0A35155 SATA3GB 7200RPM 32MB # HDS721010KLA330
HP DVD1040I 20X LIGHTSCRIBE 1.2 MULTIFORMAT DVD BURNER
SABRENT CRW-UINB 52 IN 1 BLACK USB 2.0 INTERNAL MEMORY CARD READER & WRITER
MICROSOFT WINDOWS XP PROFESSIONAL W/SP2

I followed some online step by step instructions. Here's links to two that I found to be good "pre-study" material.

http://www.pcmech.com/byopc/
http://computer.howstuffworks.com/build-a-computer.htm

For the specifics I followed the included documentation. I had the CPU and memory installed on the board and tested, as well as the power unit in the case. For about $80.00 more I could have had basically the whole thing done but it actually was fairly easy, a great learning experience and fun!

I took my time and spent the afternoon installing the MOBO, graphics card and primary drives. Installing just the "basics" to start it up was a tip I found on the net which made good sense. Of course, Jon here helped me with a few questions I had as well along the way.

I did have one challenge with the Hitachi drive. After I installed it and booted up it was recognized in the bios, but not windows. I went to Hitachi and found some help guides there. I had to use the device manager to specify the drive and do a "quick format." Windows XP then could "see" the drive. I checked updates on all the drivers and everything was good. XP had about 28 updates to do.

It was pretty rewarding to put it all together and then have it just purring. I did my first video project over the weekend just to see how it would perform. I did a 3:30 length video project with lots of transitions, titles and effects. The quad-core really smokes during the rendering process. I was able render and burn the project in about 5 minutes.

I downloaded Vegas 8 Pro (that just released a few days ago). It is working pretty nicely on the system as well. I like the features and it seems pretty intuitive. Running MS Flight Sim Deluxe as well.

Jon, thanks again for all the help. It really wasn't too bad at all and that Anton case is pretty nice to work with and it looks real good as well. I'm pretty pleased. I've got a quiet, smokin' rig to do projects on now!

Jeff

[Jon McGuffin]

Fantastic Jeff..

What's also so nice about the system you built is that you spent far less than an off the shelf system plus you have the added benefit of knowing each and every component that went into the system... Good stuff...

Jon

[Jeff Bekeris]

Yes, it came in at just under 2k. I feel a lot more comfortable looking "under the hood" as well. It's a good feeling.

[Jim Bucciferro]

Jon,
I've been following this thread and have priced out the system you spec'd at the beginning.
I'm thinking Quad Core is the way to go to be ready for the future along with 4GB RAM.
Is the Q6600 the latest Quad core from Intel or is there another newer version?

Also, mWave is out of stock on the Antec P182 and I really like the specs on it. Can you recommend a compatible case?

Thanks
Jim

[Steven Reid]

Jon,
Excellent thread. I'm afraid that I have to flaunt my ignorance: how does one actually connect HDs in a RAID configuration? (I've done some reading, so at least I tried before I posted.)
1. There is software and hardware RAID, hardware generally being the better choice, correct?
2. There are PCI card controllers, I know, allowing connection of internal HDs. Is this the solution? Drop in a card and connect/configure? If yes to the card, which would you suggest?
3. Do some MoBos, such as the one you suggested on page 1, obviate the need for an additional RAID controller card?

Thanks,
Steve

[Jon McGuffin]

Hello Jim,

The Quad Core is in fact *not* the most recent or fastest Quad Core processor, it just happens to bring the most value per dollar. This chip runs 4 processing cores at 2.4Ghz on a 1066Mhz FSB 4Mb X2 L2 Cache for roughly $280.00. The next fastest Quad Core runs at 2.66Ghz on a 1066Mhz FSB as well but costs $550.00. Kinda of absurd when you think about it that for literally an extra 10% of processing performance increase (not system speed, just the processor) costs you TWICE as much.

For the record, the $275 Quad Core if you *really* wanted that extra performance is known to overclock pretty well with a good aftermarket cooler. Most people seem to get this processor to run at the 3.1 - 3.3Ghz range, at 2.8Ghz or 3.0Ghz should be easily attainable..

There are other places to pickup the P182, newegg.com is a good one. The P180 is usually cheaper and frankly is about 95% the same, so that's a good option as well.

[Stuart Brontman]

I ended up getting a system built by someone with almost the same specs as Jeff. It's costing me about $500 more, but I'm paying to have it professionally over-clocked to about 3.3 GHz. I'm also getting the nVidia 8800 card. Same HD setup for booting etc... I also play MS flight simulator! This should be a rig that will make HD/HDV and Prospect HD editing MUCH easier than my "old" dual Xeon (it's almost 4 years old - ancient by today's standards).

This is a great thread and has been helpful to me as I made this investment.

Thanks Jon.

Stuart

[Jeff Bekeris]

Stuart,

You're going to love that 10k hard drive. It really screams loading up the new software and the OS seems to be cooking as well. MS Flight Sim is running with many of the graphic selections set to high. I'm sure the graphics card is a big help, but all my programs are loading with lightning speed.

I'm going be doing some HD editing pretty soon. We'll see how that goes. It sure is a posiive experience having such a responsive rig doing video editing now!

Jeff

[Stuart Brontman]

It's hard waiting for the rig! My builder needs about 7-10 days, but that will go by quickly. I'm also having him run some tests to check the software speed if he throws two of the 10k boot drives in, setup as a RAID 0. I know some people are doing that for gaming, but it would be interesting to see how it helps (or not) with editing software. For those few moments I get for Flight Simulator, this machine should be a thrill too!

[Jon McGuffin]

Originally Posted by Stuart Brontman

It's hard waiting for the rig! My builder needs about 7-10 days, but that will go by quickly. I'm also having him run some tests to check the software speed if he throws two of the 10k boot drives in, setup as a RAID 0. I know some people are doing that for gaming, but it would be interesting to see how it helps (or not) with editing software. For those few moments I get for Flight Simulator, this machine should be a thrill too!

Awsome that you found somebody to build one and then overclock it for you. Good stuff... The $500 extra you are paying probably isn't too bad considering what they'll be doing to it and the fact you got a video card that is $150+ more. If you're happy with what you end up getting, do tell who this builder is so I may reference him for others here.

Jon

[Jon McGuffin]

Originally Posted by Stuart Brontman

It's hard waiting for the rig! My builder needs about 7-10 days, but that will go by quickly. I'm also having him run some tests to check the software speed if he throws two of the 10k boot drives in, setup as a RAID 0. I know some people are doing that for gaming, but it would be interesting to see how it helps (or not) with editing software. For those few moments I get for Flight Simulator, this machine should be a thrill too!

Problem with RAID 0 on the system drive is that we're talking about is a 2X greater failure rate and when you throw in a 10K drive, it's probably a little higher. You also have noise and heat issues to be concerned about. I too would like to see the performance advantages of this, but I suspect it's probably still best to go with one 10K drive as the system drive.

[Stuart Brontman]

Jon,

Thanks for the concern about the dual 10k drives. I agree it's an issue. Right now he's only testing the idea. If it results in significant performance gains I'll consider it. Either way I always keep a back-up clone of my system drive just in case! All my data is on the second drive and/or my RAID drives (where my raw video files go). I'll keep you posted and will certainly be willing to give out this guy's name if all works out.

Stuart

[Baldwin Li]

a great thread, folks, ive learnt lots from it. I too will be soon embarking on a new PC mission and have some choices to make. It sounds to me like the Intel Quad Core is the way to go, especially since I'm a Vegas user, but the price of the newer Duos is very appealing. Here's my CPU options: (prices from microdirect.co.uk)

Core 2 Duo E6750 2.66GHz - £118
Quad Core Q6660 2.4GHz is £168

I believe the quad core will outperform the E6750 (but only in situations where all 4 processers are used such as rendering in Vegas) but is it really worth the extra 40% cost to get the quad?

Another quick question, I currently have two drives which i want to buy clones of to make a RAID 0.

One is a 320GB the other a 500GB (both Seagate Barracuda SATAII). I plan to get another 500GB but is there any disadvantage at raiding such a large drive? am i better getting 1 or 2 more 320GB for speed (it'll obviously cost more)?

thanks,

baldwin