Monitoring HDV edits? How?

[Sean McHenry]

We are still refining our workflow and wondering how others are monitoring HDV editing? We are an Avid house here ans the Mojo will work for this but only with specific resolutions and the video is pretty ugly on the NTSC monitors.

We are primarily interested in going to NTSC client monitors.

What is everyone using for client monitoring in HDV workflow?

The old idea of watching the output through the deck or camera is not going to work unless we render everything from my information as MPEG won't flow like SD video on the 1394 pipe unless it's rendered out first.

What about things like 3 headed cards or S-Video outs, etc.

Sean McHenry

[David Andrews]

The Edius NX for HDV plus the expansion Kit provides real time, full resolution HD component video output, and also SD video output. Info here:
http://www.canopus-uk.com/US/product...NX_Options.asp
...assuming, of course, your pc is powerful enough to do HDV

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

You can use a component out on some applications, that feed a DVI/full screen out to a 1900 x 1200 monitor, which is our workflow. You can also find hardware converters like the MIT that convert DVI to component, said component feeding a larger LCD monitor for clients.

[Sean McHenry]

Douglas, where is the DVI signal coming from that you feed to this monitor? In Avid land, a sort of fairy land now with trolls and magical, seldom seen technical wizards...we have only the Mojo as a 1394 to real world NTSC device.

Here is the heart of the question, as Avid intakes HDV footage, does it truely transcode the MPEG to another, MXF format? If so, the 1394 signal may not be present as it isn't in a protocol that would normally be sent out the 1394 line.

Avid made assertions early in the development of the Mojo system that they "took control" of the 1394 line and it was no longer a standard firewire channel after that. There is a breakout 1394 line on the mojo that can be used as a 1394 connection for decks and cameras through the Mojo but, their idea of SD output through the Mojo is a bit ugly and perhaps, unrendered?

If they are using MXF as an internal codec of sorts, a standard firewire device hooked to the 1394 line might not see a usable signal. I think this might be the case? If true, the deck can't transcode to SD for an NTSC monitor. No viewable output from the timeline then.

I'm so confused anymore. Time to call the sales rep. Man I hate that. SD was so easy.

Sean

[Nick Jushchyshyn]

Does your software easily support proxy files?

In Media Studio Pro (and several other programs such as Avid, I'm sure) the source clips can be proxied to DV or MPEG which are used for real-time display on the timeline and previews and such, but then the origianl HDV files are automatically used for render outputs.

This still does require a pre-render step, but it's done to the source clips prior to editing, rather than on the timeline while you work.

In MSP I've even done this with raw CineAlta 1920x1080 captures and it's works great (disclaimer: these particular plates were captured directly from the camera to a RAID array via a Kona 2 on a G5 system running Final Cut). Realtime scrubbing and output to DV NTSC (at DV res), but then the full HD renders look crystal clear at full res since they come from the raw plates.

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

Originally Posted by Sean McHenry

Douglas, where is the DVI signal coming from that you feed to this monitor? In Avid land, a sort of fairy land now with trolls and magical, seldom seen technical wizards...we have only the Mojo as a 1394 to real world NTSC device.

Here is the heart of the question, as Avid intakes HDV footage, does it truely transcode the MPEG to another, MXF format? If so, the 1394 signal may not be present as it isn't in a protocol that would normally be sent out the 1394 line.

Avid made assertions early in the development of the Mojo system that they "took control" of the 1394 line and it was no longer a standard firewire channel after that. There is a breakout 1394 line on the mojo that can be used as a 1394 connection for decks and cameras through the Mojo but, their idea of SD output through the Mojo is a bit ugly and perhaps, unrendered?

If they are using MXF as an internal codec of sorts, a standard firewire device hooked to the 1394 line might not see a usable signal. I think this might be the case? If true, the deck can't transcode to SD for an NTSC monitor. No viewable output from the timeline then.

I'm so confused anymore. Time to call the sales rep. Man I hate that. SD was so easy.

Sean

Sean,
Sony Vegas, and soon another app, grab the second monitor head out on a dual head card as a full screen display complete with color profiles if you need them.
AVID does use the 1394 stream differently than other apps do, it's just a data stream at that point, and the Mojo does the decode. Doesn't really help for HDV much....OK, not at all....But the Vegas method is truly brilliant, because it requires no hardware decode at all, and allows you to see HD on an HD display.

[Sean McHenry]

Douglas, thanks again. Yet one more thing to think about as I read more of the Vegas manual.

I'll pass that info on.

Sean McHenry

[Robert Nagle]

I posted a thread elsewhere (actually in 3 different places about this very question...actually outputting to an HDTV set).


Someone suggested using the dual head graphics card (like APVe or Pny Quadro fx-540) to output the HD footage to my living room HDTV via component port.

The Matrox people say that Parhelia APVe doesn't support the ability to preview hdv footage in the hdtv with Vegas 6.

Are they talking about something else? Or are you basically out of luck if Vegas 6 is your editing environment and you're trying to view footage from the PC on a HDTV?

rj