Laptop monitoring solution? at DVinfo.net

Troy Lamont · October 7th, 2003, 02:01 PM

A thought;

What about running the firewire connection to a capable laptop with at least a 1280X720 resolution monitor and a firewire input? Screen size would be at least 15" or 17" which would be great for focusing.

I don't have the JVC, but I've done this with my Sony TRV20. You connect the camcorder to the laptop and I have to launch the editing program to view the camcorder output in real time.

I think the same should work for the JVC. Anyone have a laptop and care to try it? If anyone wants to send me their HD10/HD1 I can check it out for you. :-)

HP has a nice little laptop on the PC side that should work nicely. It has a 17" widescreen 1400 X 900 res monitor with firewire built in. The model is the zd7010us.

I'm sure the Apple aficionados here with Powerbook G4s may be able to do the same as well.

Troy

Rob Lohman · October 7th, 2003, 02:08 PM

Yes that quite possible at least on my XL1s. I shot around 25%
of my Lady X episode with my laptop connected. The XL1s only
outputs at SD so that's 720x576 for me at PAL. The main reason
I used it was to see what is going on in the area of the image
the viewfinder doesn't show. Also it was handy on some occasion
for checking light levels and focus.

Alex Raskin · October 7th, 2003, 02:12 PM

1. The JVC's bundled software does *not* allow for monitoring the footage, only capturing TS files to the hard drive. Anybody knows of the PC-based alternative solutions that do real time video monitoring?

2. 17" is too small to see the difference between SD and HD. You can as well use a *SD video monitor* driven by the cam's S-Video output: real time monitoring, no problem.

In my opinion, if the monitor is less than 22", there is no visible difference between HD and SD, because pixels are simply situated too close together.

Different opinions backed by experience are welcome!

(Do I need new glasses? :)

Ken Hodson · February 13th, 2004, 01:49 AM

Any update in regards to field monitoring with a laptop?
Has there been any development in software to make this happen?
Ken

Troy Lamont · February 13th, 2004, 10:03 AM

Not that I'm aware of. In doing some additional research I came across a software package that JVC offers for a network digital camera via firewire, but I don't think it would support video. I've got an email into them to see. I'll post an update.

Does Cineform capture video or does it just import video thats already been imported?

What about Premiere Pro? Anyone use that?

Troy

Ken Hodson · February 15th, 2004, 06:20 PM

I can't believe that with all of the advancements as far as editing HDV that no one has designed an app for video preview. It doesn't even have to record, just give an actual view of what would be recorded.
How about virtualDub in preview mode?
Ken

Phil Wright · February 16th, 2004, 11:25 AM

Have patience. :) Connect HD and Aspect HD users will have ability to use their laptops as HD field monitors shortly.

Heath McKnight · February 16th, 2004, 01:58 PM

Good points, Phil and Ken. I'm sure it will come soon.

heath

Ken Hodson · February 16th, 2004, 10:04 PM

How do you know that Phil? I really hope this is the case. I figured if it was coming Mr. Newman would have posted.
Ken

David Newman · February 16th, 2004, 10:50 PM

Phil is another engineer at CineForm. All the engineers at CineForm simple like creating HD tools, sometimes on the side. Phil is the developer responsible for this new tool, so he will post again when he has a beta release.

Ken Hodson · February 16th, 2004, 11:23 PM

Oh that is great guys. I was hoping that was the case. It will effect our buying decision in regards to monitors, therefor I appreciate the forshadowing. We all want the most out of our budgets.
Ken

John Hatchett · February 17th, 2004, 11:09 AM

If Cineform are developing a real-time, firewire connected, display program for a tabletpc, I am interested in that as a standalone program. Please enable a pen/button UI rather than requiring the keyboard.

If they want to add the option to capture to disk as well, so that I can turn my tabletpc into a 'firestore like device'. I would welcome that as well. Even if it requires an external 7200rpm drive on the USB2 or FW400 bus.

And if they are still looking for FEATURES to add ... an option for a 30 second lagged display. I video a lot of basketball and hooking up a computer and projector off the firewire bus to enhance the venue with an HD instant replay would be awesome!

Phil Wright · February 17th, 2004, 12:32 PM

Ken - As David noted I'm working on simple utility to take the firewire feed from an HDV camera and display it in a window your PC desktop. Noticed the activity on the thread and figured why not. Should have a beta available to current customers in a day or two.

John - Thanks for the input. The program essentially has no UI as you just connect the camera, run the app and you get your video in a window. So it should work fine in a tabletpc environment IF the tablet PC can decode the HD MPEG-2 video in real-time. The spooling to disk is possible and whether it becomes a feature of this new program, of HDLink or both hasn't been decided yet. The delayed display of the firewire feed is more complex. We'll have to think about that a bit.

Ken Hodson · February 17th, 2004, 01:58 PM

Are we talking the same level of CPU/FSB that is required for AspectHD, or would we be able to get away with a lower system for this preview stream?
Ken

Phil Wright · February 17th, 2004, 02:31 PM

You need enough CPU/memory bandwith to decode and playback the full-res MPEG-2 stream.

Fairly straightforward test would be to load one of the M2T files that HDLink or the JVC capture utility can capture onto the system in question and play it back in MediaPlayer. Check your cpu load in Task Manager while it is playing. You'll want some breathing space so playback should be less than 90% load.

A 2GHz P4 with DDR seems to be about the minimum.

October 7th, 2003, 02:01 PM	#1
Troy Lamont Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Studio City, CA Posts: 236	Laptop monitoring solution? A thought; What about running the firewire connection to a capable laptop with at least a 1280X720 resolution monitor and a firewire input? Screen size would be at least 15" or 17" which would be great for focusing. I don't have the JVC, but I've done this with my Sony TRV20. You connect the camcorder to the laptop and I have to launch the editing program to view the camcorder output in real time. I think the same should work for the JVC. Anyone have a laptop and care to try it? If anyone wants to send me their HD10/HD1 I can check it out for you. :-) HP has a nice little laptop on the PC side that should work nicely. It has a 17" widescreen 1400 X 900 res monitor with firewire built in. The model is the zd7010us. I'm sure the Apple aficionados here with Powerbook G4s may be able to do the same as well. Troy

October 7th, 2003, 02:08 PM	#2
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	Yes that quite possible at least on my XL1s. I shot around 25% of my Lady X episode with my laptop connected. The XL1s only outputs at SD so that's 720x576 for me at PAL. The main reason I used it was to see what is going on in the area of the image the viewfinder doesn't show. Also it was handy on some occasion for checking light levels and focus. __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

February 13th, 2004, 01:49 AM	#4
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	Any update in regards to field monitoring with a laptop? Has there been any development in software to make this happen? Ken __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

February 15th, 2004, 06:20 PM	#6
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	I can't believe that with all of the advancements as far as editing HDV that no one has designed an app for video preview. It doesn't even have to record, just give an actual view of what would be recorded. How about virtualDub in preview mode? Ken __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

February 16th, 2004, 01:58 PM	#8
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	Good points, Phil and Ken. I'm sure it will come soon. heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

October 7th, 2003, 02:12 PM	#3
Alex Raskin Trustee Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,435	1. The JVC's bundled software does not allow for monitoring the footage, only capturing TS files to the hard drive. Anybody knows of the PC-based alternative solutions that do real time video monitoring? 2. 17" is too small to see the difference between SD and HD. You can as well use a SD video monitor driven by the cam's S-Video output: real time monitoring, no problem. In my opinion, if the monitor is less than 22", there is no visible difference between HD and SD, because pixels are simply situated too close together. Different opinions backed by experience are welcome! (Do I need new glasses? :)

February 13th, 2004, 10:03 AM	#5
Troy Lamont Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Studio City, CA Posts: 236	Not that I'm aware of. In doing some additional research I came across a software package that JVC offers for a network digital camera via firewire, but I don't think it would support video. I've got an email into them to see. I'll post an update. Does Cineform capture video or does it just import video thats already been imported? What about Premiere Pro? Anyone use that? Troy

February 16th, 2004, 11:25 AM	#7
Phil Wright CineForm (Aspect HD) Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Oceanside, CA Posts: 57	Have patience. :) Connect HD and Aspect HD users will have ability to use their laptops as HD field monitors shortly.

February 16th, 2004, 10:04 PM	#9
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	How do you know that Phil? I really hope this is the case. I figured if it was coming Mr. Newman would have posted. Ken __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

February 16th, 2004, 10:50 PM	#10
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Phil is another engineer at CineForm. All the engineers at CineForm simple like creating HD tools, sometimes on the side. Phil is the developer responsible for this new tool, so he will post again when he has a beta release. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

February 16th, 2004, 11:23 PM	#11
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	Oh that is great guys. I was hoping that was the case. It will effect our buying decision in regards to monitors, therefor I appreciate the forshadowing. We all want the most out of our budgets. Ken __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

February 17th, 2004, 11:09 AM	#12
John Hatchett New Boot Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 23	If Cineform are developing a real-time, firewire connected, display program for a tabletpc, I am interested in that as a standalone program. Please enable a pen/button UI rather than requiring the keyboard. If they want to add the option to capture to disk as well, so that I can turn my tabletpc into a 'firestore like device'. I would welcome that as well. Even if it requires an external 7200rpm drive on the USB2 or FW400 bus. And if they are still looking for FEATURES to add ... an option for a 30 second lagged display. I video a lot of basketball and hooking up a computer and projector off the firewire bus to enhance the venue with an HD instant replay would be awesome!

February 17th, 2004, 12:32 PM	#13
Phil Wright CineForm (Aspect HD) Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Oceanside, CA Posts: 57	Ken - As David noted I'm working on simple utility to take the firewire feed from an HDV camera and display it in a window your PC desktop. Noticed the activity on the thread and figured why not. Should have a beta available to current customers in a day or two. John - Thanks for the input. The program essentially has no UI as you just connect the camera, run the app and you get your video in a window. So it should work fine in a tabletpc environment IF the tablet PC can decode the HD MPEG-2 video in real-time. The spooling to disk is possible and whether it becomes a feature of this new program, of HDLink or both hasn't been decided yet. The delayed display of the firewire feed is more complex. We'll have to think about that a bit.

February 17th, 2004, 01:58 PM	#14
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	Are we talking the same level of CPU/FSB that is required for AspectHD, or would we be able to get away with a lower system for this preview stream? Ken __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

February 17th, 2004, 02:31 PM	#15
Phil Wright CineForm (Aspect HD) Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Oceanside, CA Posts: 57	You need enough CPU/memory bandwith to decode and playback the full-res MPEG-2 stream. Fairly straightforward test would be to load one of the M2T files that HDLink or the JVC capture utility can capture onto the system in question and play it back in MediaPlayer. Check your cpu load in Task Manager while it is playing. You'll want some breathing space so playback should be less than 90% load. A 2GHz P4 with DDR seems to be about the minimum.