P2 like workflow in a HDV context : possible ? at DVinfo.net

Luc Saint-Elie · December 12th, 2006, 02:35 AM

Hello,

My question may sound stupid, if it’s the case please excuse me

The situation :
----------------
Currently I’m a freelance video journalist working for a little tv show (not really newsgathering but what I do is more or less in the same spirit, I do little interviews, and short features shot mainly outdoor to put technological consumer stuff in context).
A former (still) photographer I currently use a Canon XL2 (my main employer technical setting is in DVcam and the XL2 stands rather nicely compared to the big Sony, as long as the light is good)

Currently I work in SD and in the short future will continue to do so, but at a time world here will slowly switch to HD (well known song), so at a point of time I’ll have to switch to HDV (very likely a XLH1 or a XHA1)

I work alone and editing takes some time, some place (hard disk…) and requires a pretty annoying part of file management.

I’m reading P2info.net and am very interested not by the card concept (sound very very expansive) but by the workflow concept.
If my understanding is good, with the P2 system two versions of the file are recorded, the normal HD file and a low definition mpeg4 version that can be used for editing, the real editing been automagically done after on the real full weight file. Sounds great.

My questions:
-----------------
1- In real life (Real Life is a context that very often proves to be rather different from theory, from time to time I wonder if it wouldn’t be better to live in a theoretical world) is this “double file, a light for quick editing that is later automatically reported to the real heavy one” system really that great ?

2 - Does it exist a hard disk system (Focus or same stuff) that allows this kind of way of working with a double record (real file and very light low resolution one) allowing to quickly edit the light file then report editing on the real file ?

The reason behind the question ? : space, hard disk space. Currently I store : DV tapes, then my editing on hard disk. If I could save on hard disk only low resolution version of my rushes, it would require less space and browsing through my archives to search a specific sequence that I want to reuse would perhaps be easier and quicker.

In fact my Stills are managed by a software (iView Media Pro) that like every still management software stores vignettes of the real pictures that makes browsing indexing and so on much more rapid. When I need a specific image I search for it and at the end use the real file, I’m wondering if it would be possible (and valuable) to do the same with video archives.

Thanks in advance

Luc

Nate Weaver · December 12th, 2006, 02:45 AM

Not only is it possible, it already exists:

It's called XDCAM/XDCAM HD

Luc Saint-Elie · December 12th, 2006, 03:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate Weaver

Not only is it possible, it already exists:

It's called XDCAM/XDCAM HD

Hello,

Its very likely a fantastic system, but my question takes place in a HDV world :-)

Bruno Donnet · December 12th, 2006, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luc Saint-Elie

The reason behind the question ? : space, hard disk space. Currently I store : DV tapes, then my editing on hard disk. If I could save on hard disk only low resolution version of my rushes, it would require less space and browsing through my archives to search a specific sequence that I want to reuse would perhaps be easier and quicker.

With HDV tapes, the PC capture step is in everycase mandatory (transfer from your camcorder to your PC): during this step, all the HDV camcorders are able to ouput a DV flow (so in SD quality), even if you have recorded in HD on your tapes.

That's solve your problem: you store and edit in SD as you do today, and you keep your HD footages on tapes for a future use (maybe, in a future day, you will change your PC and/or your hard-drive, and so, will be able to handle a full workflow in HD with these archived footages).

(PS: I see that you live in the same location than me: do not hesitate to send me an E-mail).

Peter Ferling · December 12th, 2006, 07:50 AM

Simultaneous capture to both tape and a firestore or hard drive.

Chuck Fadely · December 15th, 2006, 08:26 PM

The space requirements for HDV footage are the same or even a little less than SD footage on your computer.

The impact on workflow comes at render time, when HDV takes about four times as long as SD. But basic cuts editing is the same speed as you have now.

The proxy file editing (like P2) would be good for the Panasonic HD footage or for the XDCAM, but you don't need it for HDV.

December 12th, 2006, 02:35 AM	#1
Luc Saint-Elie New Boot Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Paris-France Posts: 20	P2 like workflow in a HDV context : possible ? Hello, My question may sound stupid, if it’s the case please excuse me The situation : ---------------- Currently I’m a freelance video journalist working for a little tv show (not really newsgathering but what I do is more or less in the same spirit, I do little interviews, and short features shot mainly outdoor to put technological consumer stuff in context). A former (still) photographer I currently use a Canon XL2 (my main employer technical setting is in DVcam and the XL2 stands rather nicely compared to the big Sony, as long as the light is good) Currently I work in SD and in the short future will continue to do so, but at a time world here will slowly switch to HD (well known song), so at a point of time I’ll have to switch to HDV (very likely a XLH1 or a XHA1) I work alone and editing takes some time, some place (hard disk…) and requires a pretty annoying part of file management. I’m reading P2info.net and am very interested not by the card concept (sound very very expansive) but by the workflow concept. If my understanding is good, with the P2 system two versions of the file are recorded, the normal HD file and a low definition mpeg4 version that can be used for editing, the real editing been automagically done after on the real full weight file. Sounds great. My questions: ----------------- 1- In real life (Real Life is a context that very often proves to be rather different from theory, from time to time I wonder if it wouldn’t be better to live in a theoretical world) is this “double file, a light for quick editing that is later automatically reported to the real heavy one” system really that great ? 2 - Does it exist a hard disk system (Focus or same stuff) that allows this kind of way of working with a double record (real file and very light low resolution one) allowing to quickly edit the light file then report editing on the real file ? The reason behind the question ? : space, hard disk space. Currently I store : DV tapes, then my editing on hard disk. If I could save on hard disk only low resolution version of my rushes, it would require less space and browsing through my archives to search a specific sequence that I want to reuse would perhaps be easier and quicker. In fact my Stills are managed by a software (iView Media Pro) that like every still management software stores vignettes of the real pictures that makes browsing indexing and so on much more rapid. When I need a specific image I search for it and at the end use the real file, I’m wondering if it would be possible (and valuable) to do the same with video archives. Thanks in advance Luc

December 12th, 2006, 02:45 AM	#2
Nate Weaver Wrangler Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 2,100	Not only is it possible, it already exists: It's called XDCAM/XDCAM HD __________________ My Work: nateweaver.net

December 12th, 2006, 07:50 AM	#5
Peter Ferling Trustee Join Date: May 2005 Location: Wyomissing, PA Posts: 1,141 Images: 57	Simultaneous capture to both tape and a firestore or hard drive.

December 15th, 2006, 08:26 PM	#6
Chuck Fadely Major Player Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: United States Posts: 306	The space requirements for HDV footage are the same or even a little less than SD footage on your computer. The impact on workflow comes at render time, when HDV takes about four times as long as SD. But basic cuts editing is the same speed as you have now. The proxy file editing (like P2) would be good for the Panasonic HD footage or for the XDCAM, but you don't need it for HDV.