HVR-A1U or DVX100B at DVinfo.net

Andrea Miller · October 8th, 2006, 05:34 AM

Hello,

I didn't know here to post this, I won't be offended if somebody moves it elsewhere.

I'm ready to buy a cam, should happen within a month now.
I'm interested in short narratives, maybe eventually a longer project, and also docs. I do not believe that i will ever be transfered to film, I'm a dreamer, but not that kind. I think my work my end up been shown through digital projections.

So, regardless of the price, should I get a DVX100b or a A1U?
A lot of people tell me to NOT buy a SD anymore, it's a thing from the past.
But I like progressive. Is there a way to have decent progressive out of the AU1 in post?

Which do you think would look better digitally projected, all other things equals such as lighting, etc
Thanks
A.

Gareth Watkins · October 8th, 2006, 05:39 AM

[QUOTE=Andrea Miller]should I get a DVX100b or a A1U?
A lot of people tell me to NOT buy a SD anymore, it's a thing from the past.
But I like progressive. Is there a way to have decent progressive out of the AU1 in post?
QUOTE]

Hi Andrea

I think with the above criteria you would be better off looking at the Sony V1 which will be out soon...this camera would give you a better update on the DVX than the A1...

Regards
Gareth

Andrea Miller · October 8th, 2006, 06:06 AM

I'd love to get a HD 110 or a V1, Of course there's not doubt those two cams would be far better than a DVX100b, if I don't put them in the equation it's because I don't have the budget.
I'm not a professional, i just can't justify to buy a V1 right now, well, I could of course, I mean, I own a house and a car, so I guess I can buy a $ 4000 cam, but should I ? Must I? I'm not sure you see what I'm trying to say.
Just because I can, should I? Should I have the best toys at all cost? Is it necessary? My ex husband used to be like that, he always bought the best toys, always, whatever he bought, cam, powertools, just in case he used to say In case of what I used to answer him? In case I need it he replied. But he never did. Besides the fact that the quality of the footage from a V1 will be superior to the one from a A1U or a DVX how is it going to serve me when my work is digitally projected? If my story sucks or is boring is it going to save my ass and get me the first prize at the festival? Now if I manage to get into the White House with an A1U and have an amazing scoop from Cheney, Bush and Condi, all three naked in a hot tub telling me that Bush is a moron! Which footage might be more noticed?

i know I'm going to have a better resolution with a V1 than an A1U, but in my case, I want to be digitally projected in festivals and maybe print some DVD, how is it going to serve me? why should I make the 3000 bucks jump?
What I am going to get out of it?
I'd hate to buy an undersized toy, but buying an oversized one is as stupid if I don't use the feature. I drive a Corolla that takes me to work everyday and does it beautifully! Should I buy a Mercedes?

Andrea Miller · October 8th, 2006, 06:07 AM

Post removed

Ken Hodson · October 8th, 2006, 01:35 PM

The SD cam will give you better lolw light performance.

Matt Davis · October 10th, 2006, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrea Miller

I drive a Corolla that takes me to work everyday and does it beautifully! Should I buy a Mercedes?

Well, for some, 16:9 is really important - even at SD. If you're based in Europe, EVERYTHING is going 16:9. But the A1 will be infuriating to use on a tripod, and you're not going to be doing much in the way of focus pulls or zooms. The V1 is going to have a wide depth of field because of the small chips.

I'd say it's not between a Corolla and a Merc - more like the difference between a Bobcat earth mover and a JCB. Both dig holes, both shift dirt, but what's best for you depends on what you want to do.

If you care about the photography side, I'd steer towards the DVX. If you're into long-term films that you'll be showing in 5 - 10 years, I'd go for the V1 because of the 16:9 and HD aspect. If you're in situations that you can't control, whilst getting once-in-a-lifetime footage (snatched interviews, difficult locations, covert filming), get the A1.

No such thing as the perfect camera. Yet. Though a 2/3" 3xCMOS V1 with interchangable lenses and 35 Mbit recording would be nice. :D

Mathieu Ghekiere · October 10th, 2006, 06:35 AM

Hi Andrea,

Gareth was just making a proposition, seeing what your needs were, and giving you maybe a better option. But it's easier for the members here to give you options if you first give your budget (what can, or are you WILLING to pay for a camera). If Gareth wanted you to buy the best toy, he would have adviced you a RED camera or something ;-)

My opinion: if you're looking at more narrative work, I would go for a DVX, because of 24p, cinegamma, complete manual controls, XLR,...
Indeed, on a big screen a good story doesn't need good resolution (but it's always welcome of course).
There already have been many films on DV theatrically released. Many people that, for instance, saw 28 days later, even didn't know it was dv, I'm talking about regular Joe going for a movie, not filmfreaks or filmmakers as the members here.

SD will still exist for a while, and the SD cameras are as good as they could be, it took some generations of DV cameras to get to this point. HD and HDV still has to be more developed, but it's going better know, with much more support for all the different codecs.
Some people need HD right now, because of clients and such, others don't. But buying a camera right now, it's nice to know it's a bit more future proof.
Having said that, I take color rendition, movement rendition, manual and audio controls above resolution, always.

Best regards,

John Godden · October 10th, 2006, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrea Miller

snip

Now if I manage to get into the White House with an A1U and have an amazing scoop from Cheney, Bush and Condi, all three naked in a hot tub telling me that Bush is a moron!
snip

Major LOL................. :-)

You could get that footage on an old beta camera and it would sell big time! Great visual image.

FWIW, I'm with you on being frugal/"smart". The HD cam technology is leapfrogging so fast right now that you shouldn't buy "for the future". You're not buying a house here, you're buying a a piece of depreciating electronics gear that may be "old" in one year. This is like the computer era circa late 80's.

Good luck
JohnG ........... HD bound but with what???

Andrea Miller · October 10th, 2006, 06:27 PM

"Having said that, I take color rendition, movement rendition, manual and audio controls above resolution, always."

Yes, absolutely. In that respect the DVX is looking better and better.
Well, I could put 2500-3000 bucks in a cam, not 4200 right now, I don't use credit, ever, always cash. never been in debt, never will be.

Yes, I've read that the HVR-A1U is a pain to focus with, and for story telling it's vital to focus well. That might eliminate it.

I'm not based in Europe, I spend half the month there, was there when I registered to the forum. Constantly travelling between DC and Europe several times a month.

Thanks, I'm going to torture myself a little more.

Ken Hodson · October 11th, 2006, 03:06 AM

I'm tending to agree that maybe Sd is your best route now. That said, why is then A1U impossible to focus with? I do not see the logic there. I especially find the "does not work with tri-pod" coment logical at all. It has manual and auto focus. What is the problem people?
I think everyones priority should be low ligh performance. (if your a fully lit studio this obviously is a check no matter what) second would be resolutions/definition. Third is interchangeable lens( for specialized shots) and DOF, which is a play between chip size and lens.
With this simple criteria is is very simple to pick a cam. All you need to figure out is recording opions and price. Quite simple really.
I ask everyone who aks these same "do the work for me" questions. What is your priority!! Seriously. Decide on the single most inportant feature of the cam and pick accordingly to where it meets the price point. But you have to decide your own pecking order. Whats ya need?

Matt Davis · October 11th, 2006, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Hodson

why is then A1U impossible to focus with? I do not see the logic there.

Autofocus will hunt when you least want it to. The focus ring on the one I've used was a zoom ring. IIRC, there's a manual mode with push to auto-focus which would probably be the safest mode for some, but it's really difficult to focus on a moving subject. Maybe I'm a manual lens bigot. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Hodson

I especially find the "does not work with tri-pod" coment logical at all.

Assuming you meant the oposite of what you wrote... :D

In order to change tapes, you have to take the camera off the tripod, then remove the tripod plate. If you're doing long interviews, using it as second camera on an event shoot, or (egad) doing two tapes - one HDV, one DVCAM (happened to me once), a bottom loader is a right royal pain.

Mathieu Ghekiere · October 11th, 2006, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Daviss

In order to change tapes, you have to take the camera off the tripod, then remove the tripod plate. If you're doing long interviews, using it as second camera on an event shoot, or (egad) doing two tapes - one HDV, one DVCAM (happened to me once), a bottom loader is a right royal pain.

That really is a pain in the ass, and a complete sign of a camera designed for consumers!

Ken Hodson · October 11th, 2006, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Daviss

In order to change tapes, you have to take the camera off the tripod, then remove the tripod plate. If you're doing long interviews, using it as second camera on an event shoot, or (egad) doing two tapes - one HDV, one DVCAM (happened to me once), a bottom loader is a right royal pain.

Uggh. Ya that bites. As far as AF, I usually let AF do its thing then lock it.

Stu Holmes · October 11th, 2006, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Daviss

In order to change tapes, you have to take the camera off the tripod, then remove the tripod plate. If you're doing long interviews, using it as second camera on an event shoot, or (egad) doing two tapes - one HDV, one DVCAM (happened to me once), a bottom loader is a right royal pain.

Simple solution : simply buy a tripod adapter (i think Jeff de Maagd makes one) and fit it - you can then change tapes while cam is on tripod. Costs about US$20 i think.

Problem solved.

Mikko Lopponen · October 12th, 2006, 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Daviss

Autofocus will hunt when you least want it to. The focus ring on the one I've used was a zoom ring.

Just move the button to focus, then the ring will be used to focus... Autofocus will hunt a bit in low light, but that's how they do.

Quote:

In order to change tapes, you have to take the camera off the tripod, then remove the tripod plate.

True. Though there are accessories that will enable you to load a new cassette even on a tripod.

October 8th, 2006, 05:34 AM	#1
Andrea Miller Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Munich Posts: 28	HVR-A1U or DVX100B Hello, I didn't know here to post this, I won't be offended if somebody moves it elsewhere. I'm ready to buy a cam, should happen within a month now. I'm interested in short narratives, maybe eventually a longer project, and also docs. I do not believe that i will ever be transfered to film, I'm a dreamer, but not that kind. I think my work my end up been shown through digital projections. So, regardless of the price, should I get a DVX100b or a A1U? A lot of people tell me to NOT buy a SD anymore, it's a thing from the past. But I like progressive. Is there a way to have decent progressive out of the AU1 in post? Which do you think would look better digitally projected, all other things equals such as lighting, etc Thanks A.

October 8th, 2006, 06:06 AM	#3
Andrea Miller Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Munich Posts: 28	Well, yes but I'd love to get a HD 110 or a V1, Of course there's not doubt those two cams would be far better than a DVX100b, if I don't put them in the equation it's because I don't have the budget. I'm not a professional, i just can't justify to buy a V1 right now, well, I could of course, I mean, I own a house and a car, so I guess I can buy a $ 4000 cam, but should I ? Must I? I'm not sure you see what I'm trying to say. Just because I can, should I? Should I have the best toys at all cost? Is it necessary? My ex husband used to be like that, he always bought the best toys, always, whatever he bought, cam, powertools, just in case he used to say In case of what I used to answer him? In case I need it he replied. But he never did. Besides the fact that the quality of the footage from a V1 will be superior to the one from a A1U or a DVX how is it going to serve me when my work is digitally projected? If my story sucks or is boring is it going to save my ass and get me the first prize at the festival? Now if I manage to get into the White House with an A1U and have an amazing scoop from Cheney, Bush and Condi, all three naked in a hot tub telling me that Bush is a moron! Which footage might be more noticed? i know I'm going to have a better resolution with a V1 than an A1U, but in my case, I want to be digitally projected in festivals and maybe print some DVD, how is it going to serve me? why should I make the 3000 bucks jump? What I am going to get out of it? I'd hate to buy an undersized toy, but buying an oversized one is as stupid if I don't use the feature. I drive a Corolla that takes me to work everyday and does it beautifully! Should I buy a Mercedes?

October 8th, 2006, 06:07 AM	#4
Andrea Miller Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Munich Posts: 28	I'm not sure Post removed

October 8th, 2006, 01:35 PM	#5
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	The SD cam will give you better lolw light performance. __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

October 10th, 2006, 06:35 AM	#7
Mathieu Ghekiere Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Belgium Posts: 2,195	Hi Andrea, Gareth was just making a proposition, seeing what your needs were, and giving you maybe a better option. But it's easier for the members here to give you options if you first give your budget (what can, or are you WILLING to pay for a camera). If Gareth wanted you to buy the best toy, he would have adviced you a RED camera or something ;-) My opinion: if you're looking at more narrative work, I would go for a DVX, because of 24p, cinegamma, complete manual controls, XLR,... Indeed, on a big screen a good story doesn't need good resolution (but it's always welcome of course). There already have been many films on DV theatrically released. Many people that, for instance, saw 28 days later, even didn't know it was dv, I'm talking about regular Joe going for a movie, not filmfreaks or filmmakers as the members here. SD will still exist for a while, and the SD cameras are as good as they could be, it took some generations of DV cameras to get to this point. HD and HDV still has to be more developed, but it's going better know, with much more support for all the different codecs. Some people need HD right now, because of clients and such, others don't. But buying a camera right now, it's nice to know it's a bit more future proof. Having said that, I take color rendition, movement rendition, manual and audio controls above resolution, always. Best regards, __________________ http://productionsofthe3rdkind.com http://pr3k.com

October 8th, 2006, 05:39 AM	#2
Gareth Watkins Major Player Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: France Posts: 578	[QUOTE=Andrea Miller]should I get a DVX100b or a A1U? A lot of people tell me to NOT buy a SD anymore, it's a thing from the past. But I like progressive. Is there a way to have decent progressive out of the AU1 in post? QUOTE] Hi Andrea I think with the above criteria you would be better off looking at the Sony V1 which will be out soon...this camera would give you a better update on the DVX than the A1... Regards Gareth

October 10th, 2006, 06:27 PM	#9
Andrea Miller Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Munich Posts: 28	Hummm! "Having said that, I take color rendition, movement rendition, manual and audio controls above resolution, always." Yes, absolutely. In that respect the DVX is looking better and better. Well, I could put 2500-3000 bucks in a cam, not 4200 right now, I don't use credit, ever, always cash. never been in debt, never will be. Yes, I've read that the HVR-A1U is a pain to focus with, and for story telling it's vital to focus well. That might eliminate it. I'm not based in Europe, I spend half the month there, was there when I registered to the forum. Constantly travelling between DC and Europe several times a month. Thanks, I'm going to torture myself a little more.

October 11th, 2006, 03:06 AM	#10
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	I'm tending to agree that maybe Sd is your best route now. That said, why is then A1U impossible to focus with? I do not see the logic there. I especially find the "does not work with tri-pod" coment logical at all. It has manual and auto focus. What is the problem people? I think everyones priority should be low ligh performance. (if your a fully lit studio this obviously is a check no matter what) second would be resolutions/definition. Third is interchangeable lens( for specialized shots) and DOF, which is a play between chip size and lens. With this simple criteria is is very simple to pick a cam. All you need to figure out is recording opions and price. Quite simple really. I ask everyone who aks these same "do the work for me" questions. What is your priority!! Seriously. Decide on the single most inportant feature of the cam and pick accordingly to where it meets the price point. But you have to decide your own pecking order. Whats ya need? __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.