Which camera being used for Soccer World Cup in Germany? at DVinfo.net

Stu Holmes · June 5th, 2006, 09:51 AM

Does anybody know what model camera is being used to film the football (soccer..) matches in Germany over the next 4-5weeks?

Panasonic?
Sony?

This article on FIFA's site gives some detail about the matches, but doesn't mention which cameras etc being used.
http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com/06/en/050629/1/41zh.html

thanks

Tomas Chinchilla · June 5th, 2006, 09:23 PM

If you look close at the left side of this picture, isn't this either an FX1 or Z!?

http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com.../606792133.jpg

Stephan Ahonen · June 6th, 2006, 12:59 AM

The cameras used in live broadcasting share extremely little in common with the consumer camcorders that you use. The cameras themselves do not record anything to tape, they simply produce the picture and send it down a triax or fiber line to the truck where they can be cut into the broadcast or recorded for replay. Intercom and program audio and video also travel back to the camera operator to keep him aware of the overall production. Exposure control is set by a small team of specialist operators in the truck looking at all of the cameras matching them for consistency.

For the actual models of cameras, I am going to guess that they are using Thomson Grass Valley LDK series cameras.

Duane Prince · June 9th, 2006, 05:39 PM

..nothing personal, but how in the world, did you even guess that it was was a Sony FX1 or Z1.... we're looking at the same photo, right?...

Tomas Chinchilla · June 9th, 2006, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duane Prince

..nothing personal, but how in the world, did you even guess that it was was a Sony FX1 or Z1.... we're looking at the same photo, right?...

No offense taken, it's just that I have a similar picture of my FX1 and it looks exactly the same, may be it's not.

For the record, I am not sure that it is.

Jemore Santos · June 9th, 2006, 06:30 PM

It's abit obvious that the Z1 is not used for broadcast use for the world cup, Thomas was actually talking about the camera on the left of the broadcast camera, oh Thomas beat me to it.

Tomas Chinchilla · June 9th, 2006, 07:32 PM

Thanks Jemore,

Sorry for the confusion guys!

Daniel Wang · June 9th, 2006, 07:58 PM

You might've mistaken the lens on the far far left as a handycam, but that's a lens. I dont see how anyone could consider that OB cam in the image center as a handycam. If you've configured a handycam to look like that...heck even to fit on the V-plate that those cameras sit on (for the Tripod)...sheesh.

They are using 17 Thompson/Phillips LDK 6000MKII, 6 LDK 6200 Slow Motion cameras,

Panasonic - 50 DVCPRO SD units, 25 DVCPRO HD units, and 60 P2 Cameras (35 HVX200, and 25 ENG P2)

Maybe, just maybe you saw an HVX but not in that image.

Douglas Spotted Eagle · June 10th, 2006, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duane Prince

..nothing personal, but how in the world, did you even guess that it was was a Sony FX1 or Z1.... we're looking at the same photo, right?...

Black color vs grey of FX1, plus mic suspension, which the FX1 doesn't have.

Glenn Davidson · June 10th, 2006, 09:19 PM

Check out that zoom. He's got the player 'two tits' from across the field. Damn those Germans are good!

Stephan Ahonen · June 10th, 2006, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glenn Davidson

Check out that zoom. He's got the player 'two tits' from across the field. Damn those Germans are good!

The lenses that can do that are actually relatively common in the sports broadcasting world. Bare minimum zoom in a sports truck is 55x, and a lot of trucks have a full compliment of 70x lenses plus an 87. They go all the way up to 100x but I've only ever seen one of those personally. These things cost more than your house, which is why it never ceases to amaze me that they actually trust camera operators with them. =O

I believe a 100x can fill the screen with someone's face on the opposite 30 yard line from a low endzone position. Actually being able to keep a shot that tight is a different matter, you need surgeons hands to pull it off.

Stu Holmes · June 12th, 2006, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel Wang

They are using 17 Thompson/Phillips LDK 6000MKII, 6 LDK 6200 Slow Motion cameras,

Thanks Daniel. Any idea what the frame rate is on the LDK 6200 ? Just watching the slow-mo stuff on Tv, it looks pretty high fps.

Stephan Ahonen · June 12th, 2006, 02:55 PM

The specs on the camera are here: http://thomsongrassvalley.com/produc...as/ldk6200_hd/

They shoot twice the basic scan rate of whatever standard they're in. In NTSC countries they shoot 119.88 fps in 720 and 59.94 fps interlaced in 1080 (119.88 fields per second). In PAL they shoot either 100 fps in 720 or 50 fps interlaced in 1080 (100 fields per second).

Thomson also has standard def super slomo cameras that shoot three times the NTSC or PAL field rate, 89.91 frames/179.82 fields per second NTSC and 75 frames/150 fields per second PAL.

Karl Heiner · June 17th, 2006, 07:26 AM

what kind of system do the camera operators have to move the camera+seat (left-right. do they have hand controls or foot controls?
anybody knows?

thanks

Stephan Ahonen · June 18th, 2006, 06:06 AM

I take it you're referring to this shot: http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com/06/en/...aid=189149&d=1

Notice his feet are sitting on the ground, he's just kicking himself around. The hands are too busy zooming and focusing to bother with yet another control.

One unusual thing I noticed is all these european camera operators have their lens controls backwards. All the camera ops I know control zoom with the right hand and focus with the left. I'm curious as to how the europeans came to do it their way, especially since on older lenses with crank-operated zoom (that's right, no servo zoom, just a big crank. You'd be suprised at how many trucks still don't have servo zooms, and a lot of operators prefer it that way!) the cables for the zoom and focus enter the lens in a way that you would need to awkwardly cross the cables over each other to do it the "european" way.

It also doesn't make sense because if you're running handheld you're pretty much are forced to zoom with your right hand and focus with your left, so if you switch between handheld and hard cameras a lot I can't imagine it would be very easy to adapt.

June 5th, 2006, 09:51 AM	#1
Stu Holmes Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Europe Posts: 844	Which camera being used for Soccer World Cup in Germany? Does anybody know what model camera is being used to film the football (soccer..) matches in Germany over the next 4-5weeks? Panasonic? Sony? This article on FIFA's site gives some detail about the matches, but doesn't mention which cameras etc being used. http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com/06/en/050629/1/41zh.html thanks

June 5th, 2006, 09:23 PM	#2
Tomas Chinchilla Major Player Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 212 Images: 8	If you look close at the left side of this picture, isn't this either an FX1 or Z!? http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com.../606792133.jpg __________________ Tomas A. Chinchilla \| CANON XH A1, HV20 & HC3 \| Retired Cams: GL2, HC1, FX1, Z1, \| Final Cut Studio 2

June 9th, 2006, 05:39 PM	#4
Duane Prince Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: central AZ. Posts: 36	..nothing personal, but how in the world, did you even guess that it was was a Sony FX1 or Z1.... we're looking at the same photo, right?... __________________ tumbleweed

June 9th, 2006, 06:30 PM	#6
Jemore Santos Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Tokyo/Sydney Posts: 297	It's abit obvious that the Z1 is not used for broadcast use for the world cup, Thomas was actually talking about the camera on the left of the broadcast camera, oh Thomas beat me to it. __________________ "eyes through a digital world"

June 9th, 2006, 07:32 PM	#7
Tomas Chinchilla Major Player Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 212 Images: 8	Thanks Jemore, Sorry for the confusion guys! __________________ Tomas A. Chinchilla \| CANON XH A1, HV20 & HC3 \| Retired Cams: GL2, HC1, FX1, Z1, \| Final Cut Studio 2

June 6th, 2006, 12:59 AM	#3
Stephan Ahonen Major Player Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 512	The cameras used in live broadcasting share extremely little in common with the consumer camcorders that you use. The cameras themselves do not record anything to tape, they simply produce the picture and send it down a triax or fiber line to the truck where they can be cut into the broadcast or recorded for replay. Intercom and program audio and video also travel back to the camera operator to keep him aware of the overall production. Exposure control is set by a small team of specialist operators in the truck looking at all of the cameras matching them for consistency. For the actual models of cameras, I am going to guess that they are using Thomson Grass Valley LDK series cameras.

June 9th, 2006, 07:58 PM	#8
Daniel Wang Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Rochester, NY Posts: 113	You might've mistaken the lens on the far far left as a handycam, but that's a lens. I dont see how anyone could consider that OB cam in the image center as a handycam. If you've configured a handycam to look like that...heck even to fit on the V-plate that those cameras sit on (for the Tripod)...sheesh. They are using 17 Thompson/Phillips LDK 6000MKII, 6 LDK 6200 Slow Motion cameras, Panasonic - 50 DVCPRO SD units, 25 DVCPRO HD units, and 60 P2 Cameras (35 HVX200, and 25 ENG P2) Maybe, just maybe you saw an HVX but not in that image.

June 10th, 2006, 09:19 PM	#10
Glenn Davidson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Nevada City, California Posts: 499	Check out that zoom. He's got the player 'two tits' from across the field. Damn those Germans are good!

June 12th, 2006, 02:55 PM	#13
Stephan Ahonen Major Player Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 512	The specs on the camera are here: http://thomsongrassvalley.com/produc...as/ldk6200_hd/ They shoot twice the basic scan rate of whatever standard they're in. In NTSC countries they shoot 119.88 fps in 720 and 59.94 fps interlaced in 1080 (119.88 fields per second). In PAL they shoot either 100 fps in 720 or 50 fps interlaced in 1080 (100 fields per second). Thomson also has standard def super slomo cameras that shoot three times the NTSC or PAL field rate, 89.91 frames/179.82 fields per second NTSC and 75 frames/150 fields per second PAL.

June 17th, 2006, 07:26 AM	#14
Karl Heiner Major Player Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: california Posts: 342	what kind of system do the camera operators have to move the camera+seat (left-right. do they have hand controls or foot controls? anybody knows? thanks

June 18th, 2006, 06:06 AM	#15
Stephan Ahonen Major Player Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 512	I take it you're referring to this shot: http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com/06/en/...aid=189149&d=1 Notice his feet are sitting on the ground, he's just kicking himself around. The hands are too busy zooming and focusing to bother with yet another control. One unusual thing I noticed is all these european camera operators have their lens controls backwards. All the camera ops I know control zoom with the right hand and focus with the left. I'm curious as to how the europeans came to do it their way, especially since on older lenses with crank-operated zoom (that's right, no servo zoom, just a big crank. You'd be suprised at how many trucks still don't have servo zooms, and a lot of operators prefer it that way!) the cables for the zoom and focus enter the lens in a way that you would need to awkwardly cross the cables over each other to do it the "european" way. It also doesn't make sense because if you're running handheld you're pretty much are forced to zoom with your right hand and focus with your left, so if you switch between handheld and hard cameras a lot I can't imagine it would be very easy to adapt.