H1 impressions from experienced filmmaker--WOW!

[Chris Hurd]

To expand on what Spot says above, "Now Hear This" may look like a gear forum at first glance, but we're trying to steer it toward technique. In other words, NHT is sort of an audio-everything board, for now anyway.

[Peter Jefferson]

"Are you saying that you achieve good audio with mic´s through your own separate mixer and then go straight to the DVX? Are we talking no PA here? "

this is what do now... other times i run 2 cameras so in effect im running 4 audio channnels..
I use abuout 4 to 6 mics, jacked into my own Yamaha 01v console, mixed in there (EQd only, no other effects) then output to either 2 or 4 channels straight into the cameras line input

I used to use a Tascam HD-P2, but i found the redundant video footage to come in handy :)

Ive never had an issue doing this...

DSE thanks for the link, however even at 384kbps its JUST on the verge of being acceptable for Dolby Standardisation...

[Kristian Indrehus]

Originally Posted by Peter Jefferson

this is what do now... other times i run 2 cameras so in effect im running 4 audio channnels.. I use abuout 4 to 6 mics, jacked into my own Yamaha 01v console, mixed in there (EQd only, no other effects) then output to either 2 or 4 channels straight into the cameras line input. I used to use a Tascam HD-P2, but i found the redundant video footage to come in handy :)
Ive never had an issue doing this...

Well, if it works don´t fix it. =) An alternative setup that would perform well would be a laptop and a Motu Traveler. Very good converters and pre-amps. Gives you full multitrack option and easy post (for audio)

From a practical point of view it can be tempting to record audio on the cameras. I will be be shooting stage with 3 xl-H1´s this summer, so
you made me curious on how well the H1 audio will perform in HDV. I did a quick subjective a/b test today. I took a raw stage-recording from my DAT player (a semi-pro Tascam) and recorded DAT analog out to H1 analog in. (unbal.)
The recording originates from the PA mixer (-10 analog out to -10 analog DAT in) and hence shows how the H1 would perform as the recorder on the set. It´s not all fair to the H1 because the sound now has gone through two semi-pro converters (DAT+H1) but it certainly wouldn´t be any worse. I first recorded in SD which should give me PCM audio and then recorded the same piece in HDV now recording MPEG2 audio. I listened to both playbacks switching A/B between DAT/PCM and DAT/MPEG.

Now, when listening to sound through different converters your bound to hear different sound. How much of the difference comes from the converters and how much from the different formats is hard to say.
The DAT had some more resolution then both of the other sources, some of it could be the result of the DAT´s better converters. The difference between the PCM and the MPEG on the H1 however, in my ears was minor. That is my first impression anyway.

On paper there is a clear difference and it could turn out to be more pronounced in other scenarios. Personally I think a lot of other factors will have a much larger impact when it comes to actual results. MPEG2 audio stands well beside MPEG2 video as far as I´m concerned. Neither is perfect but both performs quite well.

I will upload the 3 files later in another thread so people can make their own judgement.

[Michael Pappas]

Thanks for your report Jeff, very good info indeed.......

Jeff were the producer on Michael's "Bowling for Columbine" and "Fahrenheit 9/11." ?


Michael Pappas
Arrfilms@hotmail.com

CONTACT VIA AOL INSTANT MESSENGER
AT { PAPPASARTS2 }

PappasArts & Arrfilms Main site
XLH1 and HVX200 frame grabs and news here:
http://www.pbase.com/Arrfilms

http://www.PappasArts.com
http://www.Myspace.com/PappasArts

Originally Posted by Jeff Gibbs

First of all, thanks to everyone for posting footage and impressions the last few weeks. I decided to get the H1 and went out shooting global warming in my own backyard yesterday--green grass, blue water, and people out in shirtsleeves here in Northern Michigan where usually skiing is king this time of year.
I am blown away by this camera. My first impression is that the detail and colors are simply amazing. And I have shot very successful feature films on full HD and film (mostly as a producer, not a DP.) So far in my HDV experience, all the complaints have turned out to not be true or to be overcome with good shooting/learning the workflow. When one factors in that your DV film was probably NOT going to air in theaters just BECAUSE it was DV, HDV is a miracle. HDV is not perfect, it just gets one into the realm of the resolution that just MAY take the audience into the story and away from fighting the image.
I also own a Z1 and it is a great camera. But the lense and tweaks to the H1 put it in a different league to my eye.
As a side note I personally have always been a little leary of the Panasonic hype because when testing the DVX for transfer to film it never came close to beating other affordable DV cameras available yet the forum had newbies thinking this camera was the second coming. (Of course as a doc guy the P2 option is not one I would consider anyway.) Both the dvx and hvx are great camers but the hype has been misleading and a real problem to newcomers in my view.

[David Saraceno]

Originally Posted by Michael Pappas

Jeff were the producer on Michael's "Bowling for Columbine" and "Fahrenheit 9/11." ?

I thought Gibbs was the music composer on that flick?

[Donald Pittelli]

last nite i went to Adwar Video in farmingdale ny . thay had sony panasonic jvc and canons hd products ,cameras and hd displays . i hope some others on this board were also there . seing all these hd cams side by side was a thrill . i am a canon fan and own an xl2 .but i have to say in my humble opinion the panasonic had them all beat by a mile . every thing about the 200 is better . and also the panasonics sales team was well informed and knew there product . on other thing jvc had a dvd player on display not yet on the market that up grades a standard dvd to hd it realy was awson . thanks and chow dp

[Michael Pappas]

Donald,

Thanks for the report. Yeah, the HVX200 is quite amazing. It's going to be an awesome tool for those filmmakers / Documentarians / News etc that use it. With solid sate recording ( P2 ) it is today were it's all going to be in the very near future. Tapeless.... Please if there is any other stuff you learned or saw, let us know. I would be curious hear about it as well others.



Link: XLH1 and HVX Info and Footage
http://www.pbase.com/arrfilms

Michael Pappas
Arrfilms@hotmail.com
PappasArts & Arrfilms Main site

CONTACT VIA AOL INSTANT MESSENGER
AT { PAPPASARTS2 }


XLH1 and HVX200 frame grabs and news here:
http://www.pbase.com/Arrfilms

http://www.PappasArts.com
http://www.Myspace.com/PappasArts

Originally Posted by Donald Pittelli

last nite i went to Adwar Video in farmingdale ny . thay had sony panasonic jvc and canons hd products ,cameras and hd displays . i hope some others on this board were also there . seing all these hd cams side by side was a thrill . i am a canon fan and own an xl2 .but i have to say in my humble opinion the panasonic had them all beat by a mile . every thing about the 200 is better . and also the panasonics sales team was well informed and knew there product . on other thing jvc had a dvd player on display not yet on the market that up grades a standard dvd to hd it realy was awson . thanks and chow dp

[Dale Connelly]

Originally Posted by Donald Pittelli

panasonic had them all beat by a mile . every thing about the 200 is better . and also the panasonics sales team was well informed and knew there product .

Did you base your opinion on the spec comparison they provided you?

Originally Posted by Donald Pittelli

on other thing jvc had a dvd player on display not yet on the market that up grades a standard dvd to hd it realy was awson . thanks and chow dp

that product deserves an infomercial. ;)

[Donald Pittelli]

to anser your question my opinion was based on what i saw . all cameras were running and they were only 20 or 30 ft apart if that .so it was easy to compare . also it was easy to see that panansonic was getting a good deal of the crowd . i got there early and had an opportunity to talk to the reps . but by 5pm the place was packed . also that dvd player . jvc guy told us it was made by another company for jvc and was not on market for sale at this time . one other thing if you could beleave this a pana rep told me that in the next few years there will be 100 gig p2 cards . thanks dp

[Peter Jefferson]

Originally Posted by Donald Pittelli

to anser your question my opinion was based on what i saw . all cameras were running and they were only 20 or 30 ft apart if that .so it was easy to compare . also it was easy to see that panansonic was getting a good deal of the crowd . i got there early and had an opportunity to talk to the reps . but by 5pm the place was packed . also that dvd player . jvc guy told us it was made by another company for jvc and was not on market for sale at this time . one other thing if you could beleave this a pana rep told me that in the next few years there will be 100 gig p2 cards . thanks dp

hey donald, there are already dvdplayers whch connect though HDMI and DVI which upscale SD to HD (720p or 1080i)
thereyre about 250bux AUD...

[Donald Pittelli]

yes i have seen them in best buy . my samsong 42" hd dose a real nice job of making video look good . i hook my xl2 up via rca cable .and it is very nice to to look at .shot some seaguls the other day in 24p got one of them hovering over the car . watching the wings in 24p is awsom .anyway this unit they had at the jvc table was just better than i have seen . although after giving it some thought it may have been just a very good monitor . the jvc guy did say it was new though .well thanks and by dp