SHOOTING DOCUMENTARY: CANON XL2 or JVCHD100u or SONY Z1U......who is the winner?????

Boyd Ostroff · January 12th, 2006, 07:41 PM

The NP-F970 batteries run a pretty long time on the Z1. I haven't ever run one of mine completely dry, but I'd estimate that they're good for about 5 hours while rolling tape, zooming in an out and having the LCD panel on. I think they last even longer in a situation where you turn the camera on and off and let it rest awhile between takes.

Chris Loomis · January 12th, 2006, 08:22 PM

well it took a lot of pulling on my hair but i bought the Z1u today at it will be in my hands on monday. three days before i pack up and head to brasil.

when it came down to it PRICE turned out to be a deciding factor. I got the Z1U brand new with a 3 piece filter set, wide angle converter, telephoto converter and a hard and soft case, with a four year exended warranty with cleaning for $4500 dollars. i then bought 3 npf970 batteries, a quick charger, a senheiser me66 mic, and a 75 watt capable frezzi mini fill light with soft box and a 3hour 18v waist battery to run the light. ALL SAID AND DONE THE PACKAGE COST ME - $6,000 out the door.

to get the same package with the hd100u and a comparable anton bauer battery set up the camera would cost me close to $8,000

Now I'm still not sure which camera will turn out to be thebetter CHOICE for low light documentary shooting, so i ended up going with the cheaper price point and getting the Z1u...i'm sure i can tweek it to fit me needs after i've really learned the finer points of the camera.

I'm kinda sad that I won't have the option of the manual lens that the hd100u would provide me but I think the Z1u was the best choice given my circumstances. My gut feeling is that the Hd100u (or the canon xlh1) would perform much better than the z1u for a theatrical/predesigned camera set up type film esp. given the manual lens and 35mm option. But I can't think about that now. when the time comes to do the theatrical/controlable shoot I'll trade in my z1u and get the hd100 or the xlh1 or whatever else has come down the pipeline.

I sure hope i made a good choice. I guess the proof will be in the pudding. now i can't wait to get out and start shooting........!!!!!

Philip Williams · January 12th, 2006, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Loomis

well it took a lot of pulling on my hair but i bought the Z1u today <snip>

Nooooooooo!!!!!! Terrible choice!!!!

:) Just kidding dude! Glad you made a choice, seems to be the hardest part of camcorder ownership these days. Enjoy your cam, good luck on your project and please remember to keep us updated once you're rolling.

Boyd Ostroff · January 12th, 2006, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Loomis

I got the Z1U brand new with a 3 piece filter set, wide angle converter, telephoto converter and a hard and soft case, with a four year exended warranty with cleaning for $4500 dollars.

Wow, that sounds like a suspiciously low price, assuming the accessories and warranty are any good (please do NOT post a link to a non-sponsor though). Let us know how everything works out for you.

I suspect that the telephoto and wide adaptor lenses may not be so great at that price. Suggest that you do some testing before using them for anything important.

But congratulations on your purchase, it sounds like a logical choice for you.

Panos Bournias · January 12th, 2006, 11:00 PM

Hi Chris, I have never used the Sony Cam but I think that could perform better than the JVC for low light situations. (Normally Sonys do so).
The JVC can be adjusted through the gamma and black settings, to perform better in low light in order not to use the gain that is always an imergency option. (I think that the final image that you get is more original than the sony one).
For sure you will need some lights to get nice low light images, I think with any HDV camera, or DV camera, lights are nessessary for low light and night shots.
But you can get, lets say, 4 YANIRO MINI SPOTS - 500W with Pinza support for less than 1000 usd.
If you go second hand or try to find in Brazil you can make a 3-4 kw package of lights in the range of 1.000 usd.
And this will be the most essential part of your low light approach.
If you go for the HD100 you will need a better micro as well.
The one on the camera is usable but it will not give you the best performance. Keep in mind that if you start a project far away from home, long time shooting etc. you must have solved before... in a basic way, light and sound use, camera support and camera storage.
So all these will take you up, for the HD100, to ~ 10.000 USD.
See it as an investment for the future, if your documentary succeeds this money will represent peanuts compaired to your final satisfaction.

PS. In HDV mode you need a tripod that will not shake.
In my opinion 100mm ball with fluid head like the miller 25 is the min required. HDV really shakes if it is not supported correctly. But if it is stable it really rocks.
All the best - Panos b

Heath McKnight · January 13th, 2006, 01:06 PM

Test the cameras, see which one is best, is HD or DV best FOR YOU, etc. And give yourself time--HDV isn't like DV...The biggest things are focus and audio. It's critical you know the camera, even if it's DV, but especially HDV.

heath

January 12th, 2006, 08:22 PM	#17
Chris Loomis New Boot Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: santa clarita, ca Posts: 9	the deal is done!!!! well it took a lot of pulling on my hair but i bought the Z1u today at it will be in my hands on monday. three days before i pack up and head to brasil. when it came down to it PRICE turned out to be a deciding factor. I got the Z1U brand new with a 3 piece filter set, wide angle converter, telephoto converter and a hard and soft case, with a four year exended warranty with cleaning for $4500 dollars. i then bought 3 npf970 batteries, a quick charger, a senheiser me66 mic, and a 75 watt capable frezzi mini fill light with soft box and a 3hour 18v waist battery to run the light. ALL SAID AND DONE THE PACKAGE COST ME - $6,000 out the door. to get the same package with the hd100u and a comparable anton bauer battery set up the camera would cost me close to $8,000 Now I'm still not sure which camera will turn out to be thebetter CHOICE for low light documentary shooting, so i ended up going with the cheaper price point and getting the Z1u...i'm sure i can tweek it to fit me needs after i've really learned the finer points of the camera. I'm kinda sad that I won't have the option of the manual lens that the hd100u would provide me but I think the Z1u was the best choice given my circumstances. My gut feeling is that the Hd100u (or the canon xlh1) would perform much better than the z1u for a theatrical/predesigned camera set up type film esp. given the manual lens and 35mm option. But I can't think about that now. when the time comes to do the theatrical/controlable shoot I'll trade in my z1u and get the hd100 or the xlh1 or whatever else has come down the pipeline. I sure hope i made a good choice. I guess the proof will be in the pudding. now i can't wait to get out and start shooting........!!!!!

January 12th, 2006, 11:00 PM	#20
Panos Bournias Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 109	Low Light Hi Chris, I have never used the Sony Cam but I think that could perform better than the JVC for low light situations. (Normally Sonys do so). The JVC can be adjusted through the gamma and black settings, to perform better in low light in order not to use the gain that is always an imergency option. (I think that the final image that you get is more original than the sony one). For sure you will need some lights to get nice low light images, I think with any HDV camera, or DV camera, lights are nessessary for low light and night shots. But you can get, lets say, 4 YANIRO MINI SPOTS - 500W with Pinza support for less than 1000 usd. If you go second hand or try to find in Brazil you can make a 3-4 kw package of lights in the range of 1.000 usd. And this will be the most essential part of your low light approach. If you go for the HD100 you will need a better micro as well. The one on the camera is usable but it will not give you the best performance. Keep in mind that if you start a project far away from home, long time shooting etc. you must have solved before... in a basic way, light and sound use, camera support and camera storage. So all these will take you up, for the HD100, to ~ 10.000 USD. See it as an investment for the future, if your documentary succeeds this money will represent peanuts compaired to your final satisfaction. PS. In HDV mode you need a tripod that will not shake. In my opinion 100mm ball with fluid head like the miller 25 is the min required. HDV really shakes if it is not supported correctly. But if it is stable it really rocks. All the best - Panos b

January 13th, 2006, 01:06 PM	#21
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	Test the cameras, see which one is best, is HD or DV best FOR YOU, etc. And give yourself time--HDV isn't like DV...The biggest things are focus and audio. It's critical you know the camera, even if it's DV, but especially HDV. heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

January 12th, 2006, 07:41 PM	#16
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	The NP-F970 batteries run a pretty long time on the Z1. I haven't ever run one of mine completely dry, but I'd estimate that they're good for about 5 hours while rolling tape, zooming in an out and having the LCD panel on. I think they last even longer in a situation where you turn the camera on and off and let it rest awhile between takes.