Cheap HDMI recorder?

[Marcello Mazzilli]

Hi,
I am looking for a cheap HD HDMI recorder. I am talking ow one of those little black boxes you keep under your TV sets. I had HM350 from O2 and it was brat... But only SD.. Now is the time to get an HD one but seems very difficult to find....
I can find professional Blackmagic or AJA recorders.. but no home user. Obviously.. HDMI is HDMI so I would use it as a backup for professional use.
The only one that I found is HAUPPAGE HD PVR 2 but as I understand is not really standalone. You need to connect it to a PC/MAC to switch on. I really need just a standalone equipment.. something to bring with me and record a second copy of my live works.
Any idea?
Whu this thing seems so difficult? Is there some sort of agreement to keep the HDMI HD recording broadcast because a non professional user will not really need it (cameras record HD on cards and TV is copyright protected) ?
Any ideas..?

[Shaun Roemich]

BlackMagic Design makes the HyperDeck Shuttle which records to SSD drives using Uncompressed, ProRes or DNxHD for $345USD.

But as you suspect, the HDCP in the HDMI signal will likely keep you from being able to record an HDMI feed from your cable box or other consumer device.

[Marcello Mazzilli]

That was my first choice... I mean... I am getting the dual hyperdeck as a main recorder... But I want a low cost backup... Should record in H264 probably like the hauppage I was speaking above.
I just find it strange that there is nothing around with Hdmi input... Just hd component.

[Chris Medico]

The main reason for that is that with the content protection system built into HDMI the ability to record to a non secure device is prohibited. You may find that even with a recorder connected correctly there will be virtually nothing it will record due to content protection flags.

[Marcello Mazzilli]

I understand that... i DON'T NEED to record TV... but I think the copyright on one side and the fact that digital cameras have digital recordings on cards on the other... leaves small demand in consumer sector for an HDMI recorder.... Hauppage HD PVR 2 is around 160$ (the kind of price I am looking for) and is sold as a Videogame recorder.. to record videogame matches... This tells it all... They don't even say that I can link my camera and record from there ! While they explain 3-4 times that is not possible to record protected tv shows... Nobody seems interested in recording from camera (or in my case from switcher) I assume.... or if people are it's only professionals and not consumers.... I still find it very strange though and I think there might be some sort of agreement to leave out HDMI input recorders from the consumer market (even with copyright protection)

[Marcello Mazzilli]

Anyway.. regarding the HYPERDECK STUDIO (maybe I should do a new thread?)...

I know you can continuosly record from one deck to the other.. but.... Does anybody know if...

1) You can continuously PLAY from one deck to another (will it recognise the end and jump on the other one)
2) You can RECORD on one deck and play on the other.
3) RECORD or PLAY the two independently
4) Use 2,5*HDD instead of 2.5*SSD (maybe at a smaller rate)

Because.. for some uses... it just could be better to get TWO Shuttles (cheaper) than one Studio. The rack mount, the LDC, etc.. is a plus obviously.. but the lack of separations (if needed) could push me towards the TWIN Studio Option

[Giroud Francois]

currently the cheapest is the hyperdeck from blackmagic, provided you are not recording too long.
the problem with the hyperdeck is there is no battery or monitor and memory is very expensive, so you need to add this to the price.
panasonic is doing a really nice little stuff AG-HMR10, but it has only HD-SDI input.

[Giroud Francois]

if you can accept DnxHD codec to work with, the hyperdeck is very interesting, since a 128 gig SSD gives you 1.5 hours, and you can reach more than 3 hours with a 256gig SSD.

[Marcello Mazzilli]

can you set lower quality and record on standard 2.5 drives.. hhd not ssd... ?

[Giroud Francois]

since a 128gig ssd is cheap, you could try to go SSD anyway.
Blackmagic is giving the bandwidth required for both dnxHD and Prores (another codec that is nice if you edit on Mac).
it is about 80-100 so it is well under what almost any SSD can give, but it is on the high side for an HDD.
(remember it must be sustained poerformance, not peak) and it is 2.5" disk that are usually a lot slower than 3.5".
But i think some cheap drives can go up to 120, so they should be ok.
My concern would be more about the solid state versus spinning platter when speaking about mobile device. I would really spend more for a SSD and not worry about that.

[Shaun Roemich]

1) You can continuously PLAY from one deck to another (will it recognise the end and jump on the other one)
2) You can RECORD on one deck and play on the other.
3) RECORD or PLAY the two independently
4) Use 2,5*HDD instead of 2.5*SSD (maybe at a smaller rate)

1) I just tried and the answer is no.
2) No
3) No
4) BlackMagic Design says there is an inherent issue with hard drives having exposed electrical connections that make this unwise. Frankly, it is hard enough to get an SSD drive that performs adequately even in ProRes/DNxHD so I'v e never tried. You NEED to use a drive qualified by BMD - and I mean an EXACT match, not just "oh, this model of OCZ drive is newer than the certified drive so it should work fine..." NOPE.

[Marcello Mazzilli]

Thank you very much fro your answers.. Blackmagic should be more clear about these things on the internet site.. prior to purchase.

[Thomas Smet]

You may want to look into a Ninja. Yeah they cost more for the unit but they work perfectly with standard 2.5" 7200rpm drives. They may even work with lesser quality ProRes formats with 5400rpm drives. Over the long run I think a Ninja would be cheaper and they don't seem to have as many limitations. Plus they have a screen and other goodies.