An open letter to Heath and Chris at DVinfo.net

Mark Kubat · January 18th, 2005, 10:49 PM

Hi guys.

I'm writing to ask why the insightful thread that I started discussing a very workable, bona-fide method in post to get workable 24p film-type look with Sony HDV has now been ENTIRELY DELETED as a result preventing our valued members from getting some good information and insight? Perhaps there was some error made? I've got some crucial updates on this topic and unless I've got some browser issues, I don't seem to find the thread.

Our users will remember - it was called "Finally - getting a film-look similar to 24p" or something like that.

It's really a shame this thread was lost....

Can you explain? Do posts here sometimes go AWOL? What is the point of trying to share valuable information in a community such as this if the forum is prone to errors such as this?

Unless... is there censorship here?

And now I see that if you go into "Sony HDR-FX1/Z1" subforum, half-way down you can in fact see where my thread was originally started - so I'm not dreaming after all...

Guys?

Should I call my good pal Michael Moore?

Chris Hurd · January 18th, 2005, 11:17 PM

Relax, Mark, it hasn't been deleted.

It's been temporarily removed from public view until I can prune it. There's some serious flaming in that thread, some pretty hurtful stuff which is entirely opposed to what we're all about here. Besides, the flames get in the way of the technical information. This board is all about technical information and NOT about personal attacks. So I'm going to excise the flames while preserving the info, first chance I get. It should be back in public view within 24 hours hopefully.

Our policy is that we don't delete threads. Also, our policy is to forbid personal attacks completely. So when that happens, a thread is pulled out of public view, pruned, and then restored to public view (assuming the whole thing wasn't garbage to begin with; in which case, it isn't restored, but left intact for our moderators to gawk at and learn from). I'm not interested in finger pointing or who-started-what. I'm interested only in restoring some order and clarity to a technical discussion. If somebody wants knock-down drag-outs, there's plenty of that junk at other message boards.

There is no censorship here. There's only quality control. The vast majority of our members understand and appreciate that difference. Hope this helps,

Mark Kubat · January 19th, 2005, 12:11 AM

Chris, your response, very quick, is greatly appreciated - I really am glad to have gotten your clarification - I am excited to share our developments here with the tremendously talented people we have in our community and am glad that you feel the way you do about how this place should be maintained...

I am on assignment this week but upon my return, I will email you some exciting footage - I've shared the Sony HDV treated footage with a number of industry experts so far who agree that the look is superior if not equal to the quality/cadence of 24p a la Panasonic DVX/Canon XL2 24p.

Thanks for the reply - this place IS great!

Best regards,
Mark

Davi Dortas · January 19th, 2005, 01:26 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by Chris Hurd : There's some serious flaming in that thread, some pretty hurtful stuff which is entirely opposed-->>>

It not hurts. It only hurts if you allow it to yourself. No one can type some letters on a screen that can hurt you. You allow yourself to be hurt by their words. Sorry I see this as censorship.

Chris Hurd · January 19th, 2005, 01:42 AM

If you see it as censorship then this is not the right place for you, and my advice is to leave immediately. I started this message board as an alternative to all of the flaming and personal attacks posted at other online forums. This is what makes DV Info Net different from other message boards and I am interested in attracting only those people who appreciate this concept.

When you joined this community, you indicated your agreement to abide by its policies, which clearly state that personal attacks, flames, trolling posts, meta discussions etc. may be removed at the administrator's discretion without delay or explanation. And once again: these undesirable elements serve only to pollute the flow of discussion and inhibit an otherwise smooth exchange of useful technical information.

That is not censorship. It is quality control. If you do not understand this difference then you have no business being here. This is a private community, it is exclusive, it is not intended to appeal to everyone. It may be viewable by the public, but actual participation is strictly regulated by a voluntary registration process which requires a firm understanding of and agreement with a clearly described and intentionally rigid policy governing what is and is not appropriate to post.

There are many other online communities which cover the same topics that we do. For anybody who does not agree with the way this message board is operated, you need to understand that you have other alternatives on the web and you should seek those out -- instead of trying to change things around here, because that ain't happening.

Direct all hate mail to chris@dvinfo.net -- hope this helps,

Heath McKnight · January 19th, 2005, 10:59 PM

Thanks, Chris, for clarifying our position in this matter.

Heath

Chris Hurd · January 28th, 2005, 01:43 PM

By the way, this thread has been restored to the HDV Editing forum. The direct link is http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...threadid=37972. Thanks,

January 18th, 2005, 10:49 PM	#1
Mark Kubat Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 375	An open letter to Heath and Chris Hi guys. I'm writing to ask why the insightful thread that I started discussing a very workable, bona-fide method in post to get workable 24p film-type look with Sony HDV has now been ENTIRELY DELETED as a result preventing our valued members from getting some good information and insight? Perhaps there was some error made? I've got some crucial updates on this topic and unless I've got some browser issues, I don't seem to find the thread. Our users will remember - it was called "Finally - getting a film-look similar to 24p" or something like that. It's really a shame this thread was lost.... Can you explain? Do posts here sometimes go AWOL? What is the point of trying to share valuable information in a community such as this if the forum is prone to errors such as this? Unless... is there censorship here? And now I see that if you go into "Sony HDR-FX1/Z1" subforum, half-way down you can in fact see where my thread was originally started - so I'm not dreaming after all... Guys? Should I call my good pal Michael Moore?

January 18th, 2005, 11:17 PM	#2
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Relax, Mark, it hasn't been deleted. It's been temporarily removed from public view until I can prune it. There's some serious flaming in that thread, some pretty hurtful stuff which is entirely opposed to what we're all about here. Besides, the flames get in the way of the technical information. This board is all about technical information and NOT about personal attacks. So I'm going to excise the flames while preserving the info, first chance I get. It should be back in public view within 24 hours hopefully. Our policy is that we don't delete threads. Also, our policy is to forbid personal attacks completely. So when that happens, a thread is pulled out of public view, pruned, and then restored to public view (assuming the whole thing wasn't garbage to begin with; in which case, it isn't restored, but left intact for our moderators to gawk at and learn from). I'm not interested in finger pointing or who-started-what. I'm interested only in restoring some order and clarity to a technical discussion. If somebody wants knock-down drag-outs, there's plenty of that junk at other message boards. There is no censorship here. There's only quality control. The vast majority of our members understand and appreciate that difference. Hope this helps, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

January 19th, 2005, 12:11 AM	#3
Mark Kubat Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 375	thanks Chris! Chris, your response, very quick, is greatly appreciated - I really am glad to have gotten your clarification - I am excited to share our developments here with the tremendously talented people we have in our community and am glad that you feel the way you do about how this place should be maintained... I am on assignment this week but upon my return, I will email you some exciting footage - I've shared the Sony HDV treated footage with a number of industry experts so far who agree that the look is superior if not equal to the quality/cadence of 24p a la Panasonic DVX/Canon XL2 24p. Thanks for the reply - this place IS great! Best regards, Mark

January 19th, 2005, 01:42 AM	#5
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	If you see it as censorship then this is not the right place for you, and my advice is to leave immediately. I started this message board as an alternative to all of the flaming and personal attacks posted at other online forums. This is what makes DV Info Net different from other message boards and I am interested in attracting only those people who appreciate this concept. When you joined this community, you indicated your agreement to abide by its policies, which clearly state that personal attacks, flames, trolling posts, meta discussions etc. may be removed at the administrator's discretion without delay or explanation. And once again: these undesirable elements serve only to pollute the flow of discussion and inhibit an otherwise smooth exchange of useful technical information. That is not censorship. It is quality control. If you do not understand this difference then you have no business being here. This is a private community, it is exclusive, it is not intended to appeal to everyone. It may be viewable by the public, but actual participation is strictly regulated by a voluntary registration process which requires a firm understanding of and agreement with a clearly described and intentionally rigid policy governing what is and is not appropriate to post. There are many other online communities which cover the same topics that we do. For anybody who does not agree with the way this message board is operated, you need to understand that you have other alternatives on the web and you should seek those out -- instead of trying to change things around here, because that ain't happening. Direct all hate mail to chris@dvinfo.net -- hope this helps, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

January 19th, 2005, 10:59 PM	#6
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	Thanks, Chris, for clarifying our position in this matter. Heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

January 19th, 2005, 01:26 AM	#4
Davi Dortas Membership Suspended Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Brazil Posts: 78	<<<-- Originally posted by Chris Hurd : There's some serious flaming in that thread, some pretty hurtful stuff which is entirely opposed-->>> It not hurts. It only hurts if you allow it to yourself. No one can type some letters on a screen that can hurt you. You allow yourself to be hurt by their words. Sorry I see this as censorship.

January 28th, 2005, 01:43 PM	#7
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	By the way, this thread has been restored to the HDV Editing forum. The direct link is http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...threadid=37972. Thanks, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!