Any way to complete buffer before playing? at DVinfo.net

Brad Simmons · October 31st, 2002, 12:54 PM

I've put a few of my clients 30 sec. spots up on their web site. I converted the files with the Windows Media Encoder - 256 kbps @ 30 fps, 320x240. Even with these tiny files, they still tend to pause once or twice. I tried streaming them from the server, but it's a wash.

Is there any way to buffer the whole video (should take just a few seconds) before it begins to play? I could compress them even more, but the quality is already pretty bad.

James Emory · October 31st, 2002, 10:09 PM

Bump the data rate up to 300K and try frame rates from 20-25. 30 is way to high for streaming right now. 30 might work over an intranet but as you see not the internet. Also, there is a field in the ecoder to set your buffer time. I believe the default is 3 seconds.

Brad Simmons · November 1st, 2002, 05:19 AM

ok thanks!

Rob Lohman · November 1st, 2002, 07:49 AM

I would try 10 - 15 fps... and I think 256 kbps or 300 might be
a tad too much for the "normal" user... That is 25 - 30 KB/s. Most
people cannot sustain such a rate... That is why most streaming
sites let you choose multiple rates. So that modem users or
users on slow cable/DSL lines (or just slow at that moment)
can watch as well.

We have company leased line here that can do 2 mbit, which
comes down to something like 200 KB/s. I sometimes have
trouble streaming a 300 kbps movie! That might be due to a
slow server (or heavy server load on the other way). Too busy
ISP. Too busy junctions etc.

The internet is a hard to control and uncertain place....

James Emory · November 1st, 2002, 06:38 PM

Oh yes. I agree that mutiple data rates should be available for both types of viewers, high speed & dial up. I provide both for all of my streaming files. From his post though, it looked as though he was only speaking of high speed because of that 256 kbps so that's why I didn't mention the dial up. Even though you have the ability on your company line (intranet) to achieve 2 mb/sec that doesn't mean your going to achieve that over the internet. I have tried encoding at data rates slighlty above 300K and cannot view the files on a cable modem. Just think of all the thousands of miles of cable and multiple servers that this data has to travel through. It doesn't help that the internet is not the same everyday to ensure constant data rates. After reading pages and pages of streaming technology information, it is possible that you are experiencing less than satisfactory results in viewing because of congestion, processor speed, firewalls and on and on......... I am in Georgia and have a dedicated streaming server in California or Florida and my files usually take less than 5 seconds to load and then play and are being view all around the world. It is VERY important to have a supply pipeline that can provide the data efficiently as well as a server that can handle the load and that's what these hosting companies offer. This could be a reason for bad transmissions resulting in viewing problems. Most well known sites with a lot of streaming files use a reputable provider that can handle the traffic, and they PAY for it! I have tried those frame rates that you speak of and it will not play smoothly. There are many different factors to input when encoding and getting the right combination is the key. It took me hours and hours of trial and error to figure out a suitable combination of settings before I was satisfied with a final output to use on every file. I will tell you this, film sources look a whole lot better than video.

Please visit this site and let me know how these files stream

http://community.webtv.net/JEFCom/JEFCOMSTREAMINGMEDIA

James Emory · November 15th, 2002, 01:04 AM

Well, I just had to try it again just to see. The results surprised me. I encoded a six minute file at 1000 Kbps and it streamed over the net just fine on the cable modem. So, what I said above is obviously incorrect. What is obviously different is that the file size tripled the 300 Kbps version of the same file. So a bunch of those would kill you on disk space. The picture quality was noticibly clearer but I don't think enough to justify the increased file size. I'm not even going to try to understand it anymore. If it works, then just do it.

October 31st, 2002, 12:54 PM	#1
Brad Simmons Major Player Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Washington DC Posts: 304	Any way to complete buffer before playing? I've put a few of my clients 30 sec. spots up on their web site. I converted the files with the Windows Media Encoder - 256 kbps @ 30 fps, 320x240. Even with these tiny files, they still tend to pause once or twice. I tried streaming them from the server, but it's a wash. Is there any way to buffer the whole video (should take just a few seconds) before it begins to play? I could compress them even more, but the quality is already pretty bad.

October 31st, 2002, 10:09 PM	#2
James Emory Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Atlanta, Georgia Posts: 1,892	Possible Fixes Bump the data rate up to 300K and try frame rates from 20-25. 30 is way to high for streaming right now. 30 might work over an intranet but as you see not the internet. Also, there is a field in the ecoder to set your buffer time. I believe the default is 3 seconds.

November 1st, 2002, 07:49 AM	#4
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	I would try 10 - 15 fps... and I think 256 kbps or 300 might be a tad too much for the "normal" user... That is 25 - 30 KB/s. Most people cannot sustain such a rate... That is why most streaming sites let you choose multiple rates. So that modem users or users on slow cable/DSL lines (or just slow at that moment) can watch as well. We have company leased line here that can do 2 mbit, which comes down to something like 200 KB/s. I sometimes have trouble streaming a 300 kbps movie! That might be due to a slow server (or heavy server load on the other way). Too busy ISP. Too busy junctions etc. The internet is a hard to control and uncertain place.... __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

November 1st, 2002, 06:38 PM	#5
James Emory Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Atlanta, Georgia Posts: 1,892	Data Rates & fps Oh yes. I agree that mutiple data rates should be available for both types of viewers, high speed & dial up. I provide both for all of my streaming files. From his post though, it looked as though he was only speaking of high speed because of that 256 kbps so that's why I didn't mention the dial up. Even though you have the ability on your company line (intranet) to achieve 2 mb/sec that doesn't mean your going to achieve that over the internet. I have tried encoding at data rates slighlty above 300K and cannot view the files on a cable modem. Just think of all the thousands of miles of cable and multiple servers that this data has to travel through. It doesn't help that the internet is not the same everyday to ensure constant data rates. After reading pages and pages of streaming technology information, it is possible that you are experiencing less than satisfactory results in viewing because of congestion, processor speed, firewalls and on and on......... I am in Georgia and have a dedicated streaming server in California or Florida and my files usually take less than 5 seconds to load and then play and are being view all around the world. It is VERY important to have a supply pipeline that can provide the data efficiently as well as a server that can handle the load and that's what these hosting companies offer. This could be a reason for bad transmissions resulting in viewing problems. Most well known sites with a lot of streaming files use a reputable provider that can handle the traffic, and they PAY for it! I have tried those frame rates that you speak of and it will not play smoothly. There are many different factors to input when encoding and getting the right combination is the key. It took me hours and hours of trial and error to figure out a suitable combination of settings before I was satisfied with a final output to use on every file. I will tell you this, film sources look a whole lot better than video. Please visit this site and let me know how these files stream http://community.webtv.net/JEFCom/JEFCOMSTREAMINGMEDIA

November 15th, 2002, 01:04 AM	#6
James Emory Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Atlanta, Georgia Posts: 1,892	Update on Data Rates Well, I just had to try it again just to see. The results surprised me. I encoded a six minute file at 1000 Kbps and it streamed over the net just fine on the cable modem. So, what I said above is obviously incorrect. What is obviously different is that the file size tripled the 300 Kbps version of the same file. So a bunch of those would kill you on disk space. The picture quality was noticibly clearer but I don't think enough to justify the increased file size. I'm not even going to try to understand it anymore. If it works, then just do it.

November 1st, 2002, 05:19 AM	#3
Brad Simmons Major Player Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Washington DC Posts: 304	ok thanks!