The 4 Second problem (HD100+FCP5.0.4)

[Trevor Allin]

Hi Sergio

Your suggestion about clogged heads seems interesting. How would I unclog them? I have used a head cleaning tape.

Also I have tried capturng it as AIC but had similar problems.

In terms of capturing on Windows this is the most success I have had but still problems. I capture with cineform then move the file to my Mac and use streamclip to convert it. Like I say though it is still a lottery.

Thanks

Trevor

[David Knaggs]

Originally Posted by Trevor Allin

Also I have tried capturng it as AIC but had similar problems.

Hi Trevor.

Did you try to capture as AIC using FCP, or did you use DVHSCap?

[Trevor Allin]

Hi David

I was using FCP.

Trevor

[David Knaggs]

I don't know if you've already tried this, but capturing with DVHSCap and then converting the resultant .m2t files into AIC Quicktimes with MPEG Streamclip gives uniformly excellent results. AIC is supposed to be visually lossless and the advantage of capturing with DVHSCap is that you can capture every single frame that has been recorded on your tape. No losses. No gaps. It eliminates the "lottery".

It might be worth a try until Apple updates FCP to capture HDV 720p25 properly.

I've given the full detailed workflow for capturing and working in AIC with 720p25 in this post:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showpost....47&postcount=5

[Trevor Allin]

Hi David

Thanks for this, very helpful.

I have tried installing DVHSCap through the firewire sdk from apple, someone also sent me just the app by email. However, I can't seem to get it to work.

I double click on the emailed file, it enlarges like its going to launch but does not. I cannot find it from the sdk installation.

If you can point me in the right direction that would be good!

Thanks.

Trevor

[Alexei Kidel]

Originally Posted by David Knaggs

I don't know if you've already tried this, but capturing with DVHSCap and then converting the resultant .m2t files into AIC Quicktimes with MPEG Streamclip gives uniformly excellent results. AIC is supposed to be visually lossless and the advantage of capturing with DVHSCap is that you can capture every single frame that has been recorded on your tape. No losses. No gaps. It eliminates the "lottery".

It might be worth a try until Apple updates FCP to capture HDV 720p25 properly.

I've given the full detailed workflow for capturing and working in AIC with 720p25 in this post:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showpost....47&postcount=5

Thank you so much for posting this solution. I have just started a documentary production and opted to shoot on the JVC. Given that the subject matter is unpredictable, I cannot always allow for pre-roll. Your method using DVHSCap and MPEG Streamclip has worked flawlessly.

My only question at the moment is whether there is any reason for transcoding to AIC as opposed to something like DVC PRO HD? I don't really have a storage space issues to worry about. What is going to give me best results?

I have shot in 720 25p. If all goes well I will be editing on a G5 with FCP (version 5.1.2).

[Alexei Kidel]

Originally Posted by Trevor Allin

Hi David

Thanks for this, very helpful.

I have tried installing DVHSCap through the firewire sdk from apple, someone also sent me just the app by email. However, I can't seem to get it to work.

I double click on the emailed file, it enlarges like its going to launch but does not. I cannot find it from the sdk installation.

If you can point me in the right direction that would be good!

Thanks.

Trevor

Hi there. I clicked on the link in David's post and after registering (for free) I was able to download the Firewire SDK kit.

Here's the link:

http://developer.apple.com/sdk/#FireWireX

Hope this helps.

[David Knaggs]

Originally Posted by Trevor Allin

I double click on the emailed file, it enlarges like its going to launch but does not. I cannot find it from the sdk installation.

If you can point me in the right direction that would be good!

Hi Trevor.

I installed mine about 18 months ago, so these following steps are from (possibly foggy) recall, but hopefully they will help you get there:

1/ Go to the link http://developer.apple.com/sdk/#FireWireX
2/ Scroll down the page until you get to "FireWire SDK 20 for Mac OS X (DMG)".
3/ Download that.
4/ From memory, I might have double-clicked the downloaded icon on my desktop. I think it then installed itself in a folder called "Developer" which is found under "Macintosh HD". (Failing that, just do a search in the Finder for "DVHSCap" and it should locate the right folder for it.)
5/ Locate the icon "DVHSCap" and drag it into the Dock.

You should be set to go.

[David Knaggs]

Originally Posted by Alexei Kidel

My only question at the moment is whether there is any reason for transcoding to AIC as opposed to something like DVC PRO HD? I don't really have a storage space issues to worry about. What is going to give me best results?

Hi Alexei.

When I first started using this camera (July 2005) I initially transcoded the .m2t files into DVCPRO HD Quicktimes and dragged them into an SD timeline (DVCPRO50 gave really good results with DVCPRO HD files).

I found DVCPRO HD to be an excellent codec.

However I changed to Apple Intermediate Codec (AIC) after Tim Dashwood posted his results from his tests into AIC (if you search this forum you will find them) about a year ago. Tim posted his results after Apple updated the AIC (codec). Apparently, the original AIC wasn't very good.

Points to note about AIC:

1. It is supposed to be visually lossless.
2. It gives best results with progressive footage (apparently there might be problems when using interlaced footage - 1080i) so it is perfect for the JVC GY-HD100 series of cameras.
3. It gives much smaller file sizes than DVCPRO HD (although that's not a concern in your case).
4. Most importantly, it allows you to work with the full 1280 X 720 pixels that your camera provides.

This last point is crucial for me. I am certainly not a codec expert (such as a Graeme Nattress or an Adam Wilt) but my understanding of DVCPRO HD is that it works with 960 X 720 pixels. This is perfect for the Panasonic cameras for which this codec was designed. I believe (feel free to correct me if I have incorrect data about this) that the Varicam sensor is 960 X 720 pixels. I imagine that the DVCPRO HD codec then "stretches" the 960 and makes it 1280 for editing.

And I remember reading that the HVX200 has a sensor size of 960 X 540. Perhaps the camera then uses pixel shifting or "spacial offset" technology to then record the image at 960 X 720 (same as the Varicam) which is then perfect for the DVCPRO HD codec.

In my opinion (and I stress that it is purely an opinion) DVCPRO HD gives excellent results with the JVC camera and is PERFECT for the 960-pixels-wide sensors of the Panasonic HD cameras. But AIC is a "better fit" for the JVC camera (GY-HD100 series) because it uses ALL of the pixels which the camera is recording. Why record 1280 pixels of width only to throw 320 of them away?

Looking at it in terms of total pixels:
Apple Intermediate Codec = 1280 X 720 = 921,600 pixels
DVCPRO HD codec = 960 X 720 = 691,200 pixels

So you are "throwing away" nearly a quarter of a million pixels (230,400 pixels, to be precise). This is a loss of 25% of your pixels.

That's why, as a JVC user, I now prefer AIC over DVCPRO HD. And, if I were using one of Panasonic's excellent range of HD cameras, I would exclusively work with DVCPRO HD. It's purely a matter of "horses for courses".

Mind you, this only applies when I'm transcoding. These days I prefer to work in native HDV 720p25 and export my DVD assets (my current 720p25 projects are for DVD) directly from the timeline using Compressor.

[Trevor Allin]

Great thanks!

I have found dvhscap and have used it, it seemed to record fine. I then took it into streamclip and fixed the time code breaks (1). Only trouble is that now when I try and convert it to hdv25p apple, stream clip says "error can't find the first frame!'

If I didn't know that my mac and software were inanimate objects I would think this was personal!

Trevor

[Drew Curran]

Originally Posted by Alexei Kidel

My only question at the moment is whether there is any reason for transcoding to AIC as opposed to something like DVC PRO HD? I don't really have a storage space issues to worry about. What is going to give me best results?

Alexei
DVCPRoHD reduces the size of your footage from 1280x720 to something like 990x720 (i forget the exact size). This is not noticable to everyone.

Andrew

edit: David beat me to it

[Drew Curran]

Originally Posted by David Knaggs

Mind you, this only applies when I'm transcoding. These days I prefer to work in native HDV 720p25 and export my DVD assets (my current 720p25 projects are for DVD) directly from the timeline using Compressor.

What do you mean "this only applies when I'm transcoding"?

Do you find HDV easier to work with? I tend to find it very slow to render out to SD DVD.


Andrew

[Sergio Barbosa]

Hi Trevor, that error in streamclip is nasty, I've had that happening to me once. Perhaps you started capturing too early on the tape, and at that point, the tape wasn't sufficiently stretched or so...
My advice #1 is not to convert it to Apple HDV25p, but to AIC instead, for the reasons David mentioned in the last post, and because the Apple HDV codec, in my opinion is not so good yet - eg. if you shot something with lots of motion, the hd100 might have actually recorded it just fine, but once you transcode it to the apple hdv codec, large compresion artifacts are going to start showing up...I've witnessed that. Of course, this even happens when you're editing nativeley on FCP, and, for instance, you apply color correction.
Advice #2 is: in streamclip, instead of selecting the entire clip to export, try to select for instance after the first 10 seconds until the end - you may have to search fot *that* portin of the footage that streamclip will let you convert... then rtecapture what's left.

I don't think it's personal, but it sure feels like it, somtimes!
Sergio.

[Trevor Allin]

Hi

Ok, the googly has left the computer and I am now converting thefile in stream clip. I fixed the timed code before exporting but it still says that there are four data breaks.

Does this mean that there might be a camera problem as well as a capture problem?

Thanks

Trevor

[David Knaggs]

Originally Posted by Trevor Allin

Only trouble is that now when I try and convert it to hdv25p apple, stream clip says "error can't find the first frame!'

Hang in there, Trevor, you are almost there.

Perhaps you could try moving your "in" point on MPEG Streamclip and see if that makes a difference. Failing that, you could eliminate the in and out points and just transcode the entire clip.

Or you could use "Apple Intermediate Codec" rather than "Apple HDV 720p25".

Otherwise, just carefully re-check over each step I gave in the original workflow and verify that you have followed it correctly.

Good luck.

By the way, I don't recommend exporting from MPEG Streamclip by transcoding into HDV 720p25. Your image has already suffered degradation when the camera's encoder applied MPEG-2 as it recorded the tape. MPEG-2 is a very aggressive codec and putting it through a second bout of MPEG-2 compression when exporting from MPEG Streamclip (as Apple HDV 720p25) will introduce more artifacts and a general image degradation. It's better to use another codec when exporting from MPEG Streamclip such as AIC, Uncompressed, DVCPRO HD or even an SD codec (if your final output is going to be in SD).