Final Cut 5.1.2 & 720p25 problems? at DVinfo.net

Sergio Barbosa · October 13th, 2006, 02:44 AM

Hi!
Just to make something clear...
Is there anyone NOT having trouble in capturing 720p25 in Final Cut 5.1.2?
I mean clips braking in half,etc...
Thanks.

Andy Graham · October 13th, 2006, 05:40 AM

its doing the same thing with me, it's a pain in the ass.

The longest capture i've managed to get so far is 2min 13sec.

Andy.

Drew Curran · October 13th, 2006, 06:48 AM

Its happening to me to. I realised that if I stop capturing before the end of a clip it captures ok. If I let it go past a TC break, it throws up an error when I hit escape to end capture and captures nothing.

I'm starting to like the old way of capturing and converting!

Andrew

Andy Graham · October 13th, 2006, 02:17 PM

Im just trying to get to grips with capturing HDV25p from my hd100,

Am i right in saying that whenever you cut the camera between takes FCP creates another clip?

And that everything should be ok if at the start of each take you make sure you roll at least 5 or 6 sec to account for FCP's pre roll time?.

If thats all thats going on then iit's not that big a problem, it would be a problem if it chops up clips randomly.As long as i can capture a whole take whatever the length im happy......(i get the feeling i'm in for bad news)

Andy.

Robert Castiglione · October 13th, 2006, 08:12 PM

I am shooting a project in 25p and digitised my first tape. Used easy set up and it would not read timecode. Used capture now setting and it captured it all only creating clips with every new take. I did not experience any breaks at all mid take or when there should not be a break.

I gather that it is better not to use easy set up and I will give this a go with my next tape.

I really love the specific look of 25p. I shot another project with 30p and it was right for that project - kind of smoother "video" look but still great (dont want to get into a debate about film vs video look).

Rob

Alister Chapman · October 14th, 2006, 02:30 AM

I had a similar problem with a HD100 and cineform connect HD. The problem turned out to be dirty heads on the HD100 causing errors with the timecode that made the software think there was a break in the clip. I find many HD100 issues are down to dirty heads, they do seem to clog easily.

Eric Darling · October 14th, 2006, 09:52 AM

If you think the HD100 clogs easily, you should try using the BR-50 on a long project! After about three months of on and off use, the deck has had to be cleaned three times already - this was all on new JVC Pro tape stock with only a single record pass in the camera. It might be a tape stock issue.

Nigel Cooper · October 25th, 2006, 04:35 AM

I've posted this elsewhere on here already, but is seems relevent to this thread also.

Annoyed with JVC import problem; will they ever fix this?

I've shot footage on JVC GY-HD111E in the UK in 720p/25p PAL mode.

I'm trying to import lots of short clips (average 10 seconds) into Final Cut Pro (latest version with 720p/25p support) with a new Mac Pro maxed out with ram and 3 extra internal HDs.

Problem is, on a scene-break i.e. pause/stop, Final Cut detects this and creates a new clip, but it takes about 5 seconds to 'searching for media" before it starts the new clip. Because some clips are only very short, this 5 second delay sometimes means I only get the final few frames of a clip, rather than the entire 5 seconds or so of it.

JVC UK are blaming Apple and are saying it is up to them to fix it as Premiere and Edius does not have this problem.

However, Symbiosis in the UK (who do HD-Connect box) say that the JVC ProHD cameras do not wrap the shots up properly at the end, they are kind of left open and this creates problems on scene-breaks.

I've tried turning off the "create new clip on timecode break" etc, but it does not make any difference, when I do this it simply quits capturing on a scene break. Besides I have about 300 cutaways like this and I don't want to spend the rest of the year breaking them up on the timeline as this would be a futile and long workflow.

I'm importing and working on a native HDV 720p/25p timeline and this is the way I want to work. I've already imported and edited 4 hours of footage, but these 4 hours were easy as all 4 tapes had no start/stop points, they were recorded continuously from beginning to end of tape for 64 minutes each time so importing was no problem; 1 clip per tape.

But now I've come to my 5 tapes containing hundreds of cutaways I'm kind of screwed and need some advise on how I can import them natively in HDV without losing this 5 seconds off the beginning of each clip whilst FCP searches for the media each time.

Is it a JVC issue or a FCP issue, any ideas how I can get around this?

Gunleik Groven · October 25th, 2006, 05:28 AM

Aparently you can turn off the preroll in FCP. You'll still lose 1 sec, but at least not 5.

Gunleik

Nigel Cooper · October 25th, 2006, 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gunleik Groven

Aparently you can turn off the preroll in FCP. You'll still lose 1 sec, but at least not 5.

Checked settings and can't find this option. How do I do this Gunleik?

Scott Shuster · November 15th, 2006, 10:52 AM

We have had the problem only a little, really, but of course we are always terrified about it. It is literally scaring us back to our Sony Z1U. We don't want to use the JVC GY-HD100UA until this problem is fixed.

By the way: While much of the discussion here has centered on acquisition ('pre-roll' wait 5-seconds, log-and-capture, etc.) we can confirm that the scene-break anomaly also happens during activities that do not involve acquisition at all.

We did a 'print-to-video' archiving of a completely finished FCP HDV project from Final Cut Pro back to the JVC GY-HD100UA: The tape of the exported project plays perfectly in the camera, but when re-imported back to Final Cut Pro, these hated interruptions happen. Playing back again and again from the camera into FCP we see the interruptions always in exactly the same places. It's not 'random.' Something in the system is setting them off, again and again, in an identical manner each time the tape is played from the camera into FCP.

David Knaggs · November 15th, 2006, 02:02 PM

Hi Scott.

Which frame rates are you having trouble capturing with? I'm familiar with the 25p problems (and to be honest I haven't even tried to capture in 24p yet). I noticed that you are in NYC. Does that mean you were having trouble capturing 30p or 24p?

Scott Shuster · November 15th, 2006, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Knaggs

Hi Scott.

Which frame rates are you having trouble capturing with? I'm familiar with the 25p problems (and to be honest I haven't even tried to capture in 24p yet). I noticed that you are in NYC. Does that mean you were having trouble capturing 30p or 24p?

thanks David - We are working in 30p at the moment, only because 24p was not yet available in Final Cut Pro when we started shooting the things we are working on now. We would love to go to 24p as soon as FCP and JVC iron out this glitch.

Drew Curran · November 17th, 2006, 07:41 AM

This 5 sec pre roll thing is easy to get round WHEN you can allow for this when shooting. However, I shoot mainly drama, so I can tell the talent to wait a few seconds before starting to act so I can leave at least 5 seconds of pre roll. Same at the end of the take. Within this controlled environment the HD100 and FCP work flawlessly.

I realise that wedding and events shooters can't do this, and so this is a right pain. Hopefully its a software update fix.

Regards,

Andrew

David Scattergood · November 17th, 2006, 10:41 AM

Quote:

However, I shoot mainly drama, so I can tell the talent to wait a few seconds before starting to act so I can leave at least 5 seconds of pre roll. Same at the end of the take. Within this controlled environment the HD100 and FCP work flawlessly.
I realise that wedding and events shooters can't do this, and so this is a right pain.

Are you using the native HDV editing (24/25p) Drew or one of the few workflows knocking around? It is a bit of a pain and considering the money spent on these systems it's not entirely acceptable...for the most part we now know we can get around these issues, but we'd all be happier were these things to work as they should! Must admit, this knocked out a little of the excitement I had in looking forward to working with this JVC's HDV capabilities and FCP.

Quote:

Hopefully its a software update fix.

Any idea how this would be announced should a fix to be made available? I'd hate to miss it! I presume you would have to ship your camera in depending on the model? Did you read Roberts' timecode setting post by the way (post 86...):

http://dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=75138&page=6

October 13th, 2006, 02:44 AM	#1
Sergio Barbosa Regular Crew Join Date: May 2006 Location: Portugal Posts: 140	Final Cut 5.1.2 & 720p25 problems? Hi! Just to make something clear... Is there anyone NOT having trouble in capturing 720p25 in Final Cut 5.1.2? I mean clips braking in half,etc... Thanks.

October 13th, 2006, 05:40 AM	#2
Andy Graham Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Lanark,Scotland Posts: 736	its doing the same thing with me, it's a pain in the ass. The longest capture i've managed to get so far is 2min 13sec. Andy. __________________ Actor: "where would that light be coming from?" DP: "same place as the music" -Andrew Lesnie- Last edited by Andy Graham; October 13th, 2006 at 06:21 AM.

October 13th, 2006, 02:17 PM	#4
Andy Graham Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Lanark,Scotland Posts: 736	Im just trying to get to grips with capturing HDV25p from my hd100, Am i right in saying that whenever you cut the camera between takes FCP creates another clip? And that everything should be ok if at the start of each take you make sure you roll at least 5 or 6 sec to account for FCP's pre roll time?. If thats all thats going on then iit's not that big a problem, it would be a problem if it chops up clips randomly.As long as i can capture a whole take whatever the length im happy......(i get the feeling i'm in for bad news) Andy. __________________ Actor: "where would that light be coming from?" DP: "same place as the music" -Andrew Lesnie-

October 14th, 2006, 02:30 AM	#6
Alister Chapman Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Bracknell, Berkshire, UK Posts: 4,957	I had a similar problem with a HD100 and cineform connect HD. The problem turned out to be dirty heads on the HD100 causing errors with the timecode that made the software think there was a break in the clip. I find many HD100 issues are down to dirty heads, they do seem to clog easily. __________________ Alister Chapman, Film-Maker/Stormchaser http://www.xdcam-user.com/alisters-blog/ My XDCAM site and blog. http://www.hurricane-rig.com

October 25th, 2006, 05:28 AM	#9
Gunleik Groven Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Espa - Norway Posts: 151	Aparently you can turn off the preroll in FCP. You'll still lose 1 sec, but at least not 5. Gunleik __________________ Red? Sure!

October 13th, 2006, 06:48 AM	#3
Drew Curran Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: N. Ireland Posts: 370	Its happening to me to. I realised that if I stop capturing before the end of a clip it captures ok. If I let it go past a TC break, it throws up an error when I hit escape to end capture and captures nothing. I'm starting to like the old way of capturing and converting! Andrew

October 13th, 2006, 08:12 PM	#5
Robert Castiglione Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Fremantle, Western Australia Posts: 253	I am shooting a project in 25p and digitised my first tape. Used easy set up and it would not read timecode. Used capture now setting and it captured it all only creating clips with every new take. I did not experience any breaks at all mid take or when there should not be a break. I gather that it is better not to use easy set up and I will give this a go with my next tape. I really love the specific look of 25p. I shot another project with 30p and it was right for that project - kind of smoother "video" look but still great (dont want to get into a debate about film vs video look). Rob

October 14th, 2006, 09:52 AM	#7
Eric Darling Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Savannah, GA Posts: 463	If you think the HD100 clogs easily, you should try using the BR-50 on a long project! After about three months of on and off use, the deck has had to be cleaned three times already - this was all on new JVC Pro tape stock with only a single record pass in the camera. It might be a tape stock issue.

October 25th, 2006, 04:35 AM	#8
Nigel Cooper Major Player Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Cambridgeshire, UK Posts: 112	I've posted this elsewhere on here already, but is seems relevent to this thread also. Annoyed with JVC import problem; will they ever fix this? I've shot footage on JVC GY-HD111E in the UK in 720p/25p PAL mode. I'm trying to import lots of short clips (average 10 seconds) into Final Cut Pro (latest version with 720p/25p support) with a new Mac Pro maxed out with ram and 3 extra internal HDs. Problem is, on a scene-break i.e. pause/stop, Final Cut detects this and creates a new clip, but it takes about 5 seconds to 'searching for media" before it starts the new clip. Because some clips are only very short, this 5 second delay sometimes means I only get the final few frames of a clip, rather than the entire 5 seconds or so of it. JVC UK are blaming Apple and are saying it is up to them to fix it as Premiere and Edius does not have this problem. However, Symbiosis in the UK (who do HD-Connect box) say that the JVC ProHD cameras do not wrap the shots up properly at the end, they are kind of left open and this creates problems on scene-breaks. I've tried turning off the "create new clip on timecode break" etc, but it does not make any difference, when I do this it simply quits capturing on a scene break. Besides I have about 300 cutaways like this and I don't want to spend the rest of the year breaking them up on the timeline as this would be a futile and long workflow. I'm importing and working on a native HDV 720p/25p timeline and this is the way I want to work. I've already imported and edited 4 hours of footage, but these 4 hours were easy as all 4 tapes had no start/stop points, they were recorded continuously from beginning to end of tape for 64 minutes each time so importing was no problem; 1 clip per tape. But now I've come to my 5 tapes containing hundreds of cutaways I'm kind of screwed and need some advise on how I can import them natively in HDV without losing this 5 seconds off the beginning of each clip whilst FCP searches for the media each time. Is it a JVC issue or a FCP issue, any ideas how I can get around this?

November 15th, 2006, 10:52 AM	#11
Scott Shuster Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NYC Posts: 125	We have had the problem only a little, really, but of course we are always terrified about it. It is literally scaring us back to our Sony Z1U. We don't want to use the JVC GY-HD100UA until this problem is fixed. By the way: While much of the discussion here has centered on acquisition ('pre-roll' wait 5-seconds, log-and-capture, etc.) we can confirm that the scene-break anomaly also happens during activities that do not involve acquisition at all. We did a 'print-to-video' archiving of a completely finished FCP HDV project from Final Cut Pro back to the JVC GY-HD100UA: The tape of the exported project plays perfectly in the camera, but when re-imported back to Final Cut Pro, these hated interruptions happen. Playing back again and again from the camera into FCP we see the interruptions always in exactly the same places. It's not 'random.' Something in the system is setting them off, again and again, in an identical manner each time the tape is played from the camera into FCP. __________________ http://stratostream.com -- dance & fitness videos

November 15th, 2006, 02:02 PM	#12
David Knaggs Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 826	Hi Scott. Which frame rates are you having trouble capturing with? I'm familiar with the 25p problems (and to be honest I haven't even tried to capture in 24p yet). I noticed that you are in NYC. Does that mean you were having trouble capturing 30p or 24p?

November 17th, 2006, 07:41 AM	#14
Drew Curran Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: N. Ireland Posts: 370	This 5 sec pre roll thing is easy to get round WHEN you can allow for this when shooting. However, I shoot mainly drama, so I can tell the talent to wait a few seconds before starting to act so I can leave at least 5 seconds of pre roll. Same at the end of the take. Within this controlled environment the HD100 and FCP work flawlessly. I realise that wedding and events shooters can't do this, and so this is a right pain. Hopefully its a software update fix. Regards, Andrew