JVC Pro HD with FCP / FCE

Wolfgang Schumacher · October 26th, 2006, 09:44 AM

Ladies & Gentlemen-
I wanted to digitize HDPro footage I shot with my new JVC GY-100A to my FCP HD 4.5. I set all the items I could set in FCP digitizing window and Easy set up, indication HD 60/30 footage. I also use the menu in my camera to set all the playback outputs to HD720/30.
I also switched the IEEE 1394 switch on my camera.
Yet, FCP refused to see my camera, couldn't make a connection.
Under "View" in FCP - Etxernal device- all the options were grayed out.
What the heck am I doing wrong?
Can anybody help?
Thanks,
Wolfgang Schumacher
PS: I have no problem digitizing normal DV footage.

Jay Kavi · October 26th, 2006, 11:33 AM

I believe you need to upgrade FCP from 4.5 to 5.1

Carl Hicks · October 26th, 2006, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfgang Schumacher

Ladies & Gentlemen-
I wanted to digitize HDPro footage I shot with my new JVC GY-100A to my FCP HD 4.5. I set all the items I could set in FCP digitizing window and Easy set up, indication HD 60/30 footage. I also use the menu in my camera to set all the playback outputs to HD720/30.
I also switched the IEEE 1394 switch on my camera.
Yet, FCP refused to see my camera, couldn't make a connection.
Under "View" in FCP - Etxernal device- all the options were grayed out.
What the heck am I doing wrong?
Can anybody help?
Thanks,
Wolfgang Schumacher
PS: I have no problem digitizing normal DV footage.

Are you sure that FCP ver 4.5 supports HDV? In easy set-up, do you see a setting for " 720p/30 HDV"? This is dfferent than "HD720/30"

I seem to recall that HDV support from FCP came on version 5 or higher.

Regards,

Jemore Santos · October 26th, 2006, 07:33 PM

As I remembered FCP 4.5 "HD" had 720p30 on AIC only not native HDV,
IT also had the DVCProHD format too. But no Native HDV.

Wolfgang Schumacher · October 26th, 2006, 07:39 PM

Jay & Karl-
Thanks for the fast reply and your willingness to help me.
I went back to FCP and Easy set up and notized that, indeed, FCP lists
DVCPro HD-720p30 as well as DVCPro HD-720p60.
Yet, while the format changes in the window to 16x9 after selecting HD-720p30, it did not do the trick.
Is this a FCP or JVC thing?
Any ideas?
Thanks,
Wolfgang Schumacher

Wolfgang Schumacher · October 26th, 2006, 07:51 PM

Jay & Karl-
Thanks for the fast reply and your willingness to help me.
I went back to FCP and Easy set up and notized that, indeed, FCP lists
DVCPro HD-720p30 as well as DVCPro HD-720p60.
Yet, while the format changes in the window to 16x9 after selecting HD-720p30, it did not do the trick.
Is this a FCP or JVC thing?
Any ideas?
Thanks,
Wolfgang Schumacher

Wolfgang Schumacher · October 26th, 2006, 07:56 PM

Thanks, Jemore-
It looks like I need to bite the bullet and upgrade my FCP 4.5 to the next higher number. Your hunch maybe right. All replies point into the same direction.
Thanks,
Wolfgang Schumacher

Carl Hicks · October 26th, 2006, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfgang Schumacher

Thanks, Jemore-
It looks like I need to bite the bullet and upgrade my FCP 4.5 to the next higher number. Your hunch maybe right. All replies point into the same direction.
Thanks,
Wolfgang Schumacher

You should be able to verify this easily with Apple.

Regards, Carl

Jemore Santos · October 26th, 2006, 08:42 PM

Wolfgang If you open up "easy set up" do you see AIC 720p30?
If you can then you can use that for sequence and capture instead of HDV. It is an intermediate codec which is a work around until you upgrade, some like the AIC codec more because it is an intra-frame solution to HDVs' inter-frame set up.

Tim Dashwood · October 27th, 2006, 01:04 AM

FCP 4.5 HD was not HDV compatible. You will need version 5 and higher.
I suggest buying the Universal Final Cut Studio v5.1 update. As an owner of FCP 4.5 it will only cost you $199US and you will also get Compressor 2, Motion 2, DVD Studio Pro 4, Quicktime 7 Pro & Soundtrack Pro as part of the deal.

http://www.apple.com/universal/crossgrade/

In the meantime, if you want to capture and edit HDV material from your HD100, you can use one of the tried and true intermediate codec methods.

Here's an exerpt from something I posted ages ago:

So, does FCP 5 edit HDV 720P30 natively? The answer is yes. It maintains timecode, you can use log and capture, it will batch capture, you can edit in native resolution, it will export and it works beautifully.

Does FCP 5 edit HDV 720P24 or 720P25 natively? Yes, as of FCP v5.1.2.

Does FCP 4.5 or 5 edit HDV 720P24 or 720P25 non-natively? Absolutely. There are at least three separate workflows that work quite well. We have discussed the various methods at length in this forum and in our FCP for HDV forum.

The M.O.S. AIC method: (additional cost: $0)
If you have FCP5, you can set the Easy Setup to "HDV 720P30 Apple Intermediate Codec" and digitize, without TC, video in any JVC format.
You can also use iMovieHD to do exactly the same thing. THe AIC digitizer captures everything on the tape and makes a new clip every time it detects a new scene (start/stop.)
The AIC digitizer is not smart enough to know that the frame rate is set for 24 or 25, so instead it throws away the repeat flagged frames, but maintains a 59.94 fps frame rate for the quicktime file.
Therefore, 720P24 and 720P25 will require the use of Cinema Tools to conform the frame rate to 23.98 or 25 respectively. This method works well for M.O.S. projects like music videos, but is not ideal for sync sound situations unless you used a slate and want to capture the sound separately.

The DVHSCAP and MPEGStreamclip Method (additional cost: $0)
This method is now the most popular because of its reliability and low cost.
Download two free programs. First, DVHSCap from Apple's Firewire SDK (install the kit and then drag the DVHSCap app from your Macintosh HD/Developer/Firwire SDK22/ to your applications folder.)
ftp://ftp.apple.com/developer/Develo...eWireSDK22.dmg
Next, download the latest version of MPEG Streamclip from Squared5.com.

Now use DVHSCap to capture m2t streams from your camera via firewire. The program is pretty straightforward.

When you have captured your clips, open MpegStreamclip. The select Batch list from the list menu. Drag in your m2t clips.
Select "Export to Quicktime." In the QT settings window, select Apple Intermediate Codec for compression. Turn the quality up to 100%, set the frame size to 1280x720 (unscaled) and deselect Interlaced scaling and Reinterlace chroma. Type "23.98" into the frame rate box, and set the sound to 48Khz, stereo.
Click "Make movie" and set your destination.
Click "Go" when your batch list is ready and wait for the transcoding to take place.
In FCP4.5, you can create a new sequence preset that uses Apple Intermediate codec, 1280x720, square pixels, 23.98 fps. You can also go into options for the codec and select 720P for the optimizer.
You can now import your new clips and get right to work.

The HDVxDV method (additional cost: $80)
HDVxDV now supports 720P24 capture from the HD100. The interface is not as easy to use as FCP's built in Log & Capture because it has no live video/audio preview, and there are no search buttons, just FF, REW, STOP & PLAY.
However, it is simple and easy to understand. Brad Wright, the developer, has attempted to facilitate the capture of source TC, but it does not work well yet.
Simply put, you capture clips straight from the camera, then export them to a secondary codec of your choice for editing in FCP 4.5 or 5. I suggest Apple Intermediate Codec. There is one little inconvience in the software (v1.24) that creates 24fps files instead of 23.98fps files. Either one seems to work in a 23.98 sequence without rendering, so I guess it isn't a big deal, unless it is the root of the problem of sync issues some people have reported on long clips. If the sync issue is created during the export, then changing the frame rate to 23.98 in Cinema Tools won't fix it. Maybe Brad Wright can inform us of what is going on with regard to 23.98 vs 24fps.

The Lumiere HD method (additional cost: $179)
Lumiere HD now "supports" 720P24 and 720P25 capture. The interface is basically the same as HDVxDV (I believe both originated from Apple's DVHSCap) but Lumiere HD has added space for description, scene and take with auto-incrementation. The workflow can seem daunting at first (and definitely takes the most time overall) but there can be some distinct advantages for proxy offline editing.
However, TC is not captured and batch recapturing is not supported.
I have been testing the latest version of Lumiere HD (v1.6b6) for a couple of weeks and it is working MUCH BETTER than 1.6b2 ever did. The workflow remains unchanged, but you can output 720P24 back to the HD100. Lumiere HD 1.6b6 is the only piece of software on the mac that will allow you to do that.

Capturing HDV-SD60P or HDV-SD50P for "overcranked" slow motion. (additional cost: $0)
You can use Apple's DVHSCap (or HDVxDV/Lumiere HD) to capture 480P60 or 576P50 HDV to m2t files. Then you can use MPegStreamclip to convert and uprez the m2t streams to Quicktime @ 59.94fps. Cinema Tools can then conform the frame rate down to 23.98 and you have instant overcranked slow-mo for use in FCP 4.5 or 5.[/QUOTE]

Wolfgang Schumacher · October 27th, 2006, 06:29 PM

Carl, Jemore, Tim-
You guys are awesome. I got more help than expected.
Many thanks. I will do as you guys suggested.
A gratefull,
Wolfgang

Scott Shuster · November 8th, 2006, 03:40 PM

We have the new ‘universal’ version of FCP installed now (in a G5, v5.1 and in a MacPro 3ghz, v5.1.2) and in both machines we find that the print-to-video feature is presenting a problem, however the problem appears to be confined to the JVC GY-HD100UA only. It does not occur when we are using our Sony Z1U...and it did not occur with the GY-HD100UA either UNTIL we upgraded to FCP 5.1 and 5.1.2.

Here is the problem:
When we 'print-to-video' a sequence that has been “conform to HDV” pre-rendered, FCP 5.1 and 5.1.2 now suddenly insist on starting the render all over again -- spending three hours to “conform-to-HDV” an hour-long sequence that was already pre-rendered “conform to HDV" earlier.

it does actually take the full three hours... and then it prompts us to proceed (press record on the camera) and the print-to-video occurs normally.

In the old version (non-universal, G5) FCP apparently used the “conform-to-HDV” render we did previously. It would take only about two minutes to prepare itself for print-to-video and issue the prompt for us to roll-tape-and-record. In 5.1 and 5.1.2 this takes three hours, executing first a full conform to HDV render.

We observe this problem with our JVC GY-HD100UA - not our Sony Z1U. When we try to do the same process with 5.1.2 in the MacPro using the Sony Z1U, the prior render is recognized and we are prompted to begin tape recording after the usual 1-to-2 minutes. So this would appear to be a JVC support issue in 5.1 and 5.1.2 only -- as print-to-video into our JVC camera used to be just as speedy as print-to-video to the Z1U -- until we upgraded to 5.1, and 5.1.2.

Is anyone else experiencing this anomaly? Could we be missing something...?

Scott Shuster · November 9th, 2006, 07:45 PM

49 views...no replies: OK, I'm going to reply to my own post!! We have found the problem. This anomaly occurs when making use of a sequence originally prepared in the pre-FCP v.5.1 era -- which for us means last week! Everything described above occurs when using an old render. If we re-render in the new v5.1.2 everything operates normally. Indeed, the MacPro makes that render ready for print in about 5 seconds - !!

Matt Setnes · February 9th, 2007, 07:32 PM

Via firewire...I tried loading the videoscope and nothing would come on. I do not currently have the mac with me, but what are the steps with FCP Pro studio in getting a live feed from a JVC HD100 HDV signal via Firewire? I need the waveform tool to evenly light a greenscreen tomorrow. Any help soon would be helpfull, thanks!

William Hohauser · February 9th, 2007, 08:22 PM

That will not work. The HDV FireWire feed only works with a m2t transport stream from tape.

Here's a suggestion. Take the composite video out and send it to an A/D converter (Canopus, DV deck, DV camera, etc.) and send that into FCP or a waveform program like ScopeBox. The waveform will be good enough to set the green screen.

October 26th, 2006, 09:44 AM	#61
Wolfgang Schumacher New Boot Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Cumming - Georgia, USA Posts: 5	Problem digitizing HD from JVC GY-100A to FCP-4.5 Ladies & Gentlemen- I wanted to digitize HDPro footage I shot with my new JVC GY-100A to my FCP HD 4.5. I set all the items I could set in FCP digitizing window and Easy set up, indication HD 60/30 footage. I also use the menu in my camera to set all the playback outputs to HD720/30. I also switched the IEEE 1394 switch on my camera. Yet, FCP refused to see my camera, couldn't make a connection. Under "View" in FCP - Etxernal device- all the options were grayed out. What the heck am I doing wrong? Can anybody help? Thanks, Wolfgang Schumacher PS: I have no problem digitizing normal DV footage.

October 26th, 2006, 07:33 PM	#64
Jemore Santos Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Tokyo/Sydney Posts: 297	As I remembered FCP 4.5 "HD" had 720p30 on AIC only not native HDV, IT also had the DVCProHD format too. But no Native HDV. __________________ "eyes through a digital world"

October 26th, 2006, 07:39 PM	#65
Wolfgang Schumacher New Boot Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Cumming - Georgia, USA Posts: 5	Problem digitizing HD 720p/30 with FCP Jay & Karl- Thanks for the fast reply and your willingness to help me. I went back to FCP and Easy set up and notized that, indeed, FCP lists DVCPro HD-720p30 as well as DVCPro HD-720p60. Yet, while the format changes in the window to 16x9 after selecting HD-720p30, it did not do the trick. Is this a FCP or JVC thing? Any ideas? Thanks, Wolfgang Schumacher

October 26th, 2006, 07:51 PM	#66
Wolfgang Schumacher New Boot Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Cumming - Georgia, USA Posts: 5	Problem digitizing HD 720p/30 with FCP Jay & Karl- Thanks for the fast reply and your willingness to help me. I went back to FCP and Easy set up and notized that, indeed, FCP lists DVCPro HD-720p30 as well as DVCPro HD-720p60. Yet, while the format changes in the window to 16x9 after selecting HD-720p30, it did not do the trick. Is this a FCP or JVC thing? Any ideas? Thanks, Wolfgang Schumacher

October 26th, 2006, 07:56 PM	#67
Wolfgang Schumacher New Boot Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Cumming - Georgia, USA Posts: 5	Problem digitizing HD 720p/30 with FCP Thanks, Jemore- It looks like I need to bite the bullet and upgrade my FCP 4.5 to the next higher number. Your hunch maybe right. All replies point into the same direction. Thanks, Wolfgang Schumacher

October 26th, 2006, 11:33 AM	#62
Jay Kavi Major Player Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 243	I believe you need to upgrade FCP from 4.5 to 5.1

October 26th, 2006, 08:42 PM	#69
Jemore Santos Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Tokyo/Sydney Posts: 297	Wolfgang If you open up "easy set up" do you see AIC 720p30? If you can then you can use that for sequence and capture instead of HDV. It is an intermediate codec which is a work around until you upgrade, some like the AIC codec more because it is an intra-frame solution to HDVs' inter-frame set up. __________________ "eyes through a digital world"

October 27th, 2006, 01:04 AM	#70
Tim Dashwood Wrangler Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Toronto, ON, Canada Posts: 3,637	FCP 4.5 HD was not HDV compatible. You will need version 5 and higher. I suggest buying the Universal Final Cut Studio v5.1 update. As an owner of FCP 4.5 it will only cost you $199US and you will also get Compressor 2, Motion 2, DVD Studio Pro 4, Quicktime 7 Pro & Soundtrack Pro as part of the deal. http://www.apple.com/universal/crossgrade/ In the meantime, if you want to capture and edit HDV material from your HD100, you can use one of the tried and true intermediate codec methods. Here's an exerpt from something I posted ages ago: So, does FCP 5 edit HDV 720P30 natively? The answer is yes. It maintains timecode, you can use log and capture, it will batch capture, you can edit in native resolution, it will export and it works beautifully. Does FCP 5 edit HDV 720P24 or 720P25 natively? Yes, as of FCP v5.1.2. Does FCP 4.5 or 5 edit HDV 720P24 or 720P25 non-natively? Absolutely. There are at least three separate workflows that work quite well. We have discussed the various methods at length in this forum and in our FCP for HDV forum. The M.O.S. AIC method: (additional cost: $0) If you have FCP5, you can set the Easy Setup to "HDV 720P30 Apple Intermediate Codec" and digitize, without TC, video in any JVC format. You can also use iMovieHD to do exactly the same thing. THe AIC digitizer captures everything on the tape and makes a new clip every time it detects a new scene (start/stop.) The AIC digitizer is not smart enough to know that the frame rate is set for 24 or 25, so instead it throws away the repeat flagged frames, but maintains a 59.94 fps frame rate for the quicktime file. Therefore, 720P24 and 720P25 will require the use of Cinema Tools to conform the frame rate to 23.98 or 25 respectively. This method works well for M.O.S. projects like music videos, but is not ideal for sync sound situations unless you used a slate and want to capture the sound separately. The DVHSCAP and MPEGStreamclip Method (additional cost: $0) This method is now the most popular because of its reliability and low cost. Download two free programs. First, DVHSCap from Apple's Firewire SDK (install the kit and then drag the DVHSCap app from your Macintosh HD/Developer/Firwire SDK22/ to your applications folder.) ftp://ftp.apple.com/developer/Develo...eWireSDK22.dmg Next, download the latest version of MPEG Streamclip from Squared5.com. Now use DVHSCap to capture m2t streams from your camera via firewire. The program is pretty straightforward. When you have captured your clips, open MpegStreamclip. The select Batch list from the list menu. Drag in your m2t clips. Select "Export to Quicktime." In the QT settings window, select Apple Intermediate Codec for compression. Turn the quality up to 100%, set the frame size to 1280x720 (unscaled) and deselect Interlaced scaling and Reinterlace chroma. Type "23.98" into the frame rate box, and set the sound to 48Khz, stereo. Click "Make movie" and set your destination. Click "Go" when your batch list is ready and wait for the transcoding to take place. In FCP4.5, you can create a new sequence preset that uses Apple Intermediate codec, 1280x720, square pixels, 23.98 fps. You can also go into options for the codec and select 720P for the optimizer. You can now import your new clips and get right to work. The HDVxDV method (additional cost: $80) HDVxDV now supports 720P24 capture from the HD100. The interface is not as easy to use as FCP's built in Log & Capture because it has no live video/audio preview, and there are no search buttons, just FF, REW, STOP & PLAY. However, it is simple and easy to understand. Brad Wright, the developer, has attempted to facilitate the capture of source TC, but it does not work well yet. Simply put, you capture clips straight from the camera, then export them to a secondary codec of your choice for editing in FCP 4.5 or 5. I suggest Apple Intermediate Codec. There is one little inconvience in the software (v1.24) that creates 24fps files instead of 23.98fps files. Either one seems to work in a 23.98 sequence without rendering, so I guess it isn't a big deal, unless it is the root of the problem of sync issues some people have reported on long clips. If the sync issue is created during the export, then changing the frame rate to 23.98 in Cinema Tools won't fix it. Maybe Brad Wright can inform us of what is going on with regard to 23.98 vs 24fps. The Lumiere HD method (additional cost: $179) Lumiere HD now "supports" 720P24 and 720P25 capture. The interface is basically the same as HDVxDV (I believe both originated from Apple's DVHSCap) but Lumiere HD has added space for description, scene and take with auto-incrementation. The workflow can seem daunting at first (and definitely takes the most time overall) but there can be some distinct advantages for proxy offline editing. However, TC is not captured and batch recapturing is not supported. I have been testing the latest version of Lumiere HD (v1.6b6) for a couple of weeks and it is working MUCH BETTER than 1.6b2 ever did. The workflow remains unchanged, but you can output 720P24 back to the HD100. Lumiere HD 1.6b6 is the only piece of software on the mac that will allow you to do that. Capturing HDV-SD60P or HDV-SD50P for "overcranked" slow motion. (additional cost: $0) You can use Apple's DVHSCap (or HDVxDV/Lumiere HD) to capture 480P60 or 576P50 HDV to m2t files. Then you can use MPegStreamclip to convert and uprez the m2t streams to Quicktime @ 59.94fps. Cinema Tools can then conform the frame rate down to 23.98 and you have instant overcranked slow-mo for use in FCP 4.5 or 5.[/QUOTE] __________________ Tim Dashwood

October 27th, 2006, 06:29 PM	#71
Wolfgang Schumacher New Boot Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Cumming - Georgia, USA Posts: 5	Carl, Jemore, Tim- You guys are awesome. I got more help than expected. Many thanks. I will do as you guys suggested. A gratefull, Wolfgang __________________ CreativeWolf Media

November 8th, 2006, 03:40 PM	#72
Scott Shuster Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NYC Posts: 125	Print-To-Video w/Universal FCP, & JVC GY-HD100UA: Issue We have the new ‘universal’ version of FCP installed now (in a G5, v5.1 and in a MacPro 3ghz, v5.1.2) and in both machines we find that the print-to-video feature is presenting a problem, however the problem appears to be confined to the JVC GY-HD100UA only. It does not occur when we are using our Sony Z1U...and it did not occur with the GY-HD100UA either UNTIL we upgraded to FCP 5.1 and 5.1.2. Here is the problem: When we 'print-to-video' a sequence that has been “conform to HDV” pre-rendered, FCP 5.1 and 5.1.2 now suddenly insist on starting the render all over again -- spending three hours to “conform-to-HDV” an hour-long sequence that was already pre-rendered “conform to HDV" earlier. it does actually take the full three hours... and then it prompts us to proceed (press record on the camera) and the print-to-video occurs normally. In the old version (non-universal, G5) FCP apparently used the “conform-to-HDV” render we did previously. It would take only about two minutes to prepare itself for print-to-video and issue the prompt for us to roll-tape-and-record. In 5.1 and 5.1.2 this takes three hours, executing first a full conform to HDV render. We observe this problem with our JVC GY-HD100UA - not our Sony Z1U. When we try to do the same process with 5.1.2 in the MacPro using the Sony Z1U, the prior render is recognized and we are prompted to begin tape recording after the usual 1-to-2 minutes. So this would appear to be a JVC support issue in 5.1 and 5.1.2 only -- as print-to-video into our JVC camera used to be just as speedy as print-to-video to the Z1U -- until we upgraded to 5.1, and 5.1.2. Is anyone else experiencing this anomaly? Could we be missing something...? __________________ http://stratostream.com -- dance & fitness videos

November 9th, 2006, 07:45 PM	#73
Scott Shuster Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NYC Posts: 125	49 views...no replies: OK, I'm going to reply to my own post!! We have found the problem. This anomaly occurs when making use of a sequence originally prepared in the pre-FCP v.5.1 era -- which for us means last week! Everything described above occurs when using an old render. If we re-render in the new v5.1.2 everything operates normally. Indeed, the MacPro makes that render ready for print in about 5 seconds - !! __________________ http://stratostream.com -- dance & fitness videos

February 9th, 2007, 07:32 PM	#74
Matt Setnes Regular Crew Join Date: May 2006 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 114	Live Waveform from JVC HD100 Via firewire...I tried loading the videoscope and nothing would come on. I do not currently have the mac with me, but what are the steps with FCP Pro studio in getting a live feed from a JVC HD100 HDV signal via Firewire? I need the waveform tool to evenly light a greenscreen tomorrow. Any help soon would be helpfull, thanks!

February 9th, 2007, 08:22 PM	#75
William Hohauser Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: New York City Posts: 2,650	That will not work. The HDV FireWire feed only works with a m2t transport stream from tape. Here's a suggestion. Take the composite video out and send it to an A/D converter (Canopus, DV deck, DV camera, etc.) and send that into FCP or a waveform program like ScopeBox. The waveform will be good enough to set the green screen. __________________ William Hohauser - New York City Producer/Edit/Camera/Animation