Commotion at DVinfo.net

Steve Nunez · February 15th, 2003, 01:48 PM

Anyone here using Commotion Dv or Pro 4.1 for OS X? How do you like it?

Any online resources for Commotion users?

Robert Poulton · February 15th, 2003, 03:25 PM

I saw a demo of it. Amazing. Puffin use to own it. Scott Squires I think was the one who developed it. He has worked at ILM for years. He was the first to do the Cloud tank. When you use paint in a fishtank and light the paint when it expells from the pipes. First used in Close Encounters.
Off topic.
Commotion works and is made for the Mac.
I have used the PC version and it lags behind.
You have a great set of tools that include Rotosplines.....I hear they are amazing. Then you have wire removal. It can either Pinch the image together or take a Clean Plate and replace those Pixels. Then you got the Ultimatte and wrap lights (takes the existing color in the image and adjust the color to the comped subject. Then you also have a great picker for Ultimatte...It is a like a marque that allows you to sellect a range of a color to matte out.
Great program and helpful toolset to add to After Effects.

Rob
PS- DV version doesnt have all the tools.

Steve Nunez · February 15th, 2003, 04:15 PM

I have Commotion 2.0 for OS9 and like it alot (although not proficient with it)...

I bought a complete Commotion 3.0 software and manual kit from a seller on Ebay- all original software (not copied/pirated)...but it wouldn't work w/o a dongle which was missing in the purchase- so I have a fully operational Commotion with original CD's and manual documentation- but will not work w/o the dongle...sadly it sits on my shelf unuseable. I contacted Puffin but they say I am out of luck b/c they can't/wont sell a dongle for it. I believe they frowned on the purchase because it was via eBay- despite the fact I bought it 100% legitimately with documentation and serial #, CD's etc.....

I am planning on getting Commotion Pro 4.1 which works in OS X.....

I have the demo CD- it's an awesome piece of software with unlimited potential- I like it almost as much as Final Cut Pro

Robert Poulton · February 15th, 2003, 06:38 PM

What you might need to do is ask about form called "transfer of ownership"
They should have one. I know adobe does. Then all you would need to do is have the person you bought the program from sign it and then pinnicle can check and see if the serial has been registered. If so they should give you a dongle. If not forget them. I hate programs with dongles.

Get out of the stoneage, are what dongles are.

Rob

Ken Tanaka · February 15th, 2003, 10:58 PM

Steve,
As you may recall, I am a Commotion user and currently have Pro 4.1.

Surprisingly, Commotion 4.0+ doesn't require a dongle. I suppose that Pinnacle discovered what dozens of other companies discovered many years ago: dongles cause more troubles and cost more to support than they theoretically save in piracy risks.

I really cannot claim to be expert, or even completely facile, with Commotion. As you noted, its potential is great. But I've just not had much opportunity/excuse to use it deeply yet. If I had the original purchase to do over again I probably would have forgone it. I use AfterEffects 5.5 far more than Commotion.

Steve Nunez · February 16th, 2003, 08:37 AM

Thanks guys...

Ken, I'd gladly buy your Commotion if it works natively in OSX- would you know? (don't want to use Classic)

Do you have Commotion Pro or Commotion DV?

If all else fails I'll have to buy it at B&H.

Thanks again guys.

Ken Tanaka · February 16th, 2003, 10:50 AM

I plan to hang onto Commotion. It's always nice to have a tool at the ready, even if it's seldom needed.

Yes, Commotion Pro 4.x+ does work natively in OS X.

Dean Sensui · February 16th, 2003, 02:29 PM

I use commotion Pro v4 and am learning more about it all the time.

Some of the useful tools include rotosplines, motion tracking and, of course, the ability to composite layers of video.

I haven't used the keying all that much but wouldn't mind experimenting with doing chromakey mattes if I could get material properly shot.

The rotospline feature saved a shot from becoming a total disaster. The guy who shot it didn't bother to check exposure and the view out a window was absolutely useless. I replaced it, using motion tracking to lock the exterior plate to the scene inside the room. The result, my first attempt to use Commotion, was quite good.

I'm starting to experiment with Commotion to do spot corrections for shots. Again, the rotospline and motion tracking features would be invaluable.

I picked up After Effects recently but hadn't had the time to learn it yet. But having both is a good idea as each software package has features the other doesn't.

Dean Sensui
Base Two Productions

Steve Nunez · February 16th, 2003, 05:51 PM

Commotion seems to be the biggest hit in NLE special effects.....I went to B&H today to purchase the DVD Training set ($299)- unfortunately although they stated they had one set left in stock- they couldn't find it....

I'll be ordering it online this week.

Commotion rules.

( PS- The movie "Gladiator" made extensive use of Commotion- in fact the stadium scenes were heavily modified with Commotion-- at the end of the DVD- if you watch the director's cut- you'll see Mac's in the background with Commotion going.....Scott Squires is from ILM and he designed it- it's definitely a hit! )

Dean Sensui · February 16th, 2003, 07:32 PM

Steve...

If you get a chance, take a look at the extended version of Lord of the Rings. They show how they did spot color and density corrections (under the topic of "color grading").

Of course they're not using Commotion, but the fundamentals are the same: Motion track someone's face, select that as the area to lighten, then apply the motion track to the lightened area so that it moves with the face. The background retains its density and saturation while allowing the details in the shadows to show up.

I did the same with Commotion on a 30-second commercial just to see if it would work: one layer for the background, one for the face. Motion tracked the person's nostrils (his eyes blinked which made motion tracking the pupils difficult). Rotosplined the face and had that layer show through while the rest of the background was darkened down a bit. Worked well. It added just a little bit of drama to an otherwise bland shot in an office (the videographer didn't use any lights at all, just the fluorescents overhead).

I'm hoping to use a lot more of this technique for documentaries and other projects.

Dean Sensui
Base Two Productions

Steve Nunez · February 16th, 2003, 08:00 PM

That's pretty much my dream- to master Commotion.

....opens up an entire world of possibilities.

February 15th, 2003, 01:48 PM	#1
Steve Nunez Trustee Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Pembroke Pines, Florida Posts: 1,418	Commotion Anyone here using Commotion Dv or Pro 4.1 for OS X? How do you like it? Any online resources for Commotion users? __________________ Steve Nunez-New York City www.stevenunez.com

February 15th, 2003, 04:15 PM	#3
Steve Nunez Trustee Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Pembroke Pines, Florida Posts: 1,418	I have Commotion 2.0 for OS9 and like it alot (although not proficient with it)... I bought a complete Commotion 3.0 software and manual kit from a seller on Ebay- all original software (not copied/pirated)...but it wouldn't work w/o a dongle which was missing in the purchase- so I have a fully operational Commotion with original CD's and manual documentation- but will not work w/o the dongle...sadly it sits on my shelf unuseable. I contacted Puffin but they say I am out of luck b/c they can't/wont sell a dongle for it. I believe they frowned on the purchase because it was via eBay- despite the fact I bought it 100% legitimately with documentation and serial #, CD's etc..... I am planning on getting Commotion Pro 4.1 which works in OS X..... I have the demo CD- it's an awesome piece of software with unlimited potential- I like it almost as much as Final Cut Pro __________________ Steve Nunez-New York City www.stevenunez.com

February 15th, 2003, 10:58 PM	#5
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Steve, As you may recall, I am a Commotion user and currently have Pro 4.1. Surprisingly, Commotion 4.0+ doesn't require a dongle. I suppose that Pinnacle discovered what dozens of other companies discovered many years ago: dongles cause more troubles and cost more to support than they theoretically save in piracy risks. I really cannot claim to be expert, or even completely facile, with Commotion. As you noted, its potential is great. But I've just not had much opportunity/excuse to use it deeply yet. If I had the original purchase to do over again I probably would have forgone it. I use AfterEffects 5.5 far more than Commotion. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

February 16th, 2003, 08:37 AM	#6
Steve Nunez Trustee Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Pembroke Pines, Florida Posts: 1,418	Thanks guys... Ken, I'd gladly buy your Commotion if it works natively in OSX- would you know? (don't want to use Classic) Do you have Commotion Pro or Commotion DV? If all else fails I'll have to buy it at B&H. Thanks again guys. __________________ Steve Nunez-New York City www.stevenunez.com

February 16th, 2003, 10:50 AM	#7
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	I plan to hang onto Commotion. It's always nice to have a tool at the ready, even if it's seldom needed. Yes, Commotion Pro 4.x+ does work natively in OS X. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

February 15th, 2003, 03:25 PM	#2
Robert Poulton Major Player Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 245	I saw a demo of it. Amazing. Puffin use to own it. Scott Squires I think was the one who developed it. He has worked at ILM for years. He was the first to do the Cloud tank. When you use paint in a fishtank and light the paint when it expells from the pipes. First used in Close Encounters. Off topic. Commotion works and is made for the Mac. I have used the PC version and it lags behind. You have a great set of tools that include Rotosplines.....I hear they are amazing. Then you have wire removal. It can either Pinch the image together or take a Clean Plate and replace those Pixels. Then you got the Ultimatte and wrap lights (takes the existing color in the image and adjust the color to the comped subject. Then you also have a great picker for Ultimatte...It is a like a marque that allows you to sellect a range of a color to matte out. Great program and helpful toolset to add to After Effects. Rob PS- DV version doesnt have all the tools.

February 15th, 2003, 06:38 PM	#4
Robert Poulton Major Player Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 245	What you might need to do is ask about form called "transfer of ownership" They should have one. I know adobe does. Then all you would need to do is have the person you bought the program from sign it and then pinnicle can check and see if the serial has been registered. If so they should give you a dongle. If not forget them. I hate programs with dongles. Get out of the stoneage, are what dongles are. Rob

February 16th, 2003, 02:29 PM	#8
Dean Sensui Inner Circle Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 2,054	I use commotion Pro v4 and am learning more about it all the time. Some of the useful tools include rotosplines, motion tracking and, of course, the ability to composite layers of video. I haven't used the keying all that much but wouldn't mind experimenting with doing chromakey mattes if I could get material properly shot. The rotospline feature saved a shot from becoming a total disaster. The guy who shot it didn't bother to check exposure and the view out a window was absolutely useless. I replaced it, using motion tracking to lock the exterior plate to the scene inside the room. The result, my first attempt to use Commotion, was quite good. I'm starting to experiment with Commotion to do spot corrections for shots. Again, the rotospline and motion tracking features would be invaluable. I picked up After Effects recently but hadn't had the time to learn it yet. But having both is a good idea as each software package has features the other doesn't. Dean Sensui Base Two Productions

February 16th, 2003, 05:51 PM	#9
Steve Nunez Trustee Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Pembroke Pines, Florida Posts: 1,418	Commotion seems to be the biggest hit in NLE special effects.....I went to B&H today to purchase the DVD Training set ($299)- unfortunately although they stated they had one set left in stock- they couldn't find it.... I'll be ordering it online this week. Commotion rules. ( PS- The movie "Gladiator" made extensive use of Commotion- in fact the stadium scenes were heavily modified with Commotion-- at the end of the DVD- if you watch the director's cut- you'll see Mac's in the background with Commotion going.....Scott Squires is from ILM and he designed it- it's definitely a hit! ) __________________ Steve Nunez-New York City www.stevenunez.com

February 16th, 2003, 07:32 PM	#10
Dean Sensui Inner Circle Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 2,054	Steve... If you get a chance, take a look at the extended version of Lord of the Rings. They show how they did spot color and density corrections (under the topic of "color grading"). Of course they're not using Commotion, but the fundamentals are the same: Motion track someone's face, select that as the area to lighten, then apply the motion track to the lightened area so that it moves with the face. The background retains its density and saturation while allowing the details in the shadows to show up. I did the same with Commotion on a 30-second commercial just to see if it would work: one layer for the background, one for the face. Motion tracked the person's nostrils (his eyes blinked which made motion tracking the pupils difficult). Rotosplined the face and had that layer show through while the rest of the background was darkened down a bit. Worked well. It added just a little bit of drama to an otherwise bland shot in an office (the videographer didn't use any lights at all, just the fluorescents overhead). I'm hoping to use a lot more of this technique for documentaries and other projects. Dean Sensui Base Two Productions

February 16th, 2003, 08:00 PM	#11
Steve Nunez Trustee Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Pembroke Pines, Florida Posts: 1,418	That's pretty much my dream- to master Commotion. ....opens up an entire world of possibilities. __________________ Steve Nunez-New York City www.stevenunez.com