Memory Issues with Final Cut Pro at DVinfo.net

Lucinda Luvaas · November 6th, 2005, 02:24 PM

Hi There,

I don't know if this issue has been addressed previously, but I have an older version of Final Cut Pro 3.0 and want to know how much memory I should allocate to it.

It seems to render ok when I imported a movie, but when I made a green screen and rendered a very small section of the timeline it needed 35 minutes to render. That seems quite off to me.

I have a dual processor G4 and a gig of ram. This isn't the newest version of FCP, so it should be adequate.

I've been using Adobe Premiere and the rendering time isn't too bad. Altho' when I do motion or special effects using Commotion Pro or AE it can take time.

Help would be appreciated since I'm a newbie to Final Cut.

Boyd Ostroff · November 6th, 2005, 08:29 PM

Unfortunately FCP 3 is rather a "dog" compared to the newer version. It will want to render just about everything, and I doubt that adding RAM or even a faster CPU will help. The problem is, FCP 3 is really a MacOS 9 application which was upgraded to run under MacOS X. It isn't really MacOS X native and it isn't multi processor aware either.

FCP 4 introduced "real time extreme" and was a huge improvement. FCP 3 doesn't have true realtime capabilities. It can display some effects in low resolution realtime on your computer monitor, but it cannot send realtime previews over firewire to an external deck.

So IMO you would be pouring money down a hole trying to upgrade a system to improve FCP performance. If you can't afford FCP 5 then maybe you can find a used copy of FCP 4.5. It will give you a huge performance increase on the same hardware.

BTW, you can't "allocate memory" under MacOS X, the system does that itself. Or are you running FCP 3 under MacOS 9 perhaps?

Lucinda Luvaas · November 7th, 2005, 01:37 AM

Hi Boyd,

No, I'm running FCP 3.0 with OS X/I Mac, G5 and I also have it on my dual processor G4. I'm just learning a bit on it and plan to get FCP 5.0. I just am not too keen on upgrading to Tiger and Quicktime 7, have Panther now....this is a relatively new processor purchase, and I've heard not such good things about Quicktime 7.0....ugh.

I've been using Premiere 6.5 and have to render everytime I do anything. I was hoping that FCP would be an improvement.

Too bad about 3.0's rendering speed, etc.

Where can you get used copies of FCP 4.5? Ebay? I've never purchased anything on Ebay and I'm a bit scared to.

One more thing: I don't have an external production monitor on the G5 and I was wondering if I can get one that comes with a firewire connection so that I don't need to purchase a converter. Do you know if I can do that?

Thanks for your help Boyd!

Lucinda

Dave Perry · November 7th, 2005, 07:25 AM

QT 7 and Tiger are fine. A properly maintained system will have no problem with it and FCP 5 works better with both.

Boyd Ostroff · November 7th, 2005, 09:41 AM

I don't use eBay either for those same reasons. Maybe you can google up a company that is still selling sealed boxes of FCP 4.5 though? Really it would make more sense to just get FCP 5 though.

I saw a cheap monitor with firewire somewhere - maybe Marketek? Didn't look like it was very good quality though. I believe there are some very expensive ones too. Or you could get something like this:

http://www.adstech.com/products/API-...sp?pid=API-555

Lucinda Luvaas · November 7th, 2005, 07:01 PM

Dave,

If there's no compatibility issues with quicktime 7 and tiger, etc., why do so many people whine about it?

Boyd,

I know about converters. I already have one for my G4, I was just hoping I could find an lcd monitor that had a firewire capability that wasn't too cher.

i also could use my cam and go from the processor to the cam and then out to the monitor.

Lucinda

Zach Mull · November 8th, 2005, 11:05 AM

People whine about QT7 and Tiger because they are lazy and do upgrade installs instead of clean installs. With a clean install, everything worked fine on my home system with OS 10.4.1 and FCP 4.5, and I have used FCP 5 on other people's systems with much success. But everyone who does an upgrade install complains and blames Tiger and QT7 for their troubles. If you back up your files and do an erase and install with Tiger then your system will work beautifully.

Lucinda Luvaas · November 8th, 2005, 10:42 PM

Zach,

Not sure I understand what you're saying here....you mean erase the existing OS and then put in Tiger rather than installing Tiger over say Panther which is what I currrently have?

I've never done that before and I do admit I'm a bit spooked to do it for some reason.

Lucinda

Zach Mull · November 9th, 2005, 01:18 AM

Yes, that's what I'm saying. Tiger will not work properly unless you do a clean install - this is what most people have reported. Just make sure you have a good backup. If you have enough external storage to copy your system disk then it's easy to make a backup. You can use PsyncX and it will even make the backup bootable. Or you can pick and choose. But once you have a good backup it's easy to do the clean install and not worry. When you install the new OS, choose Erase and Install. Definitely do not choose upgrade. If you want to ensure that everything is clean then you can install Mac OS on a firewire drive (like an iPod), boot from that, use Disk Utility to write all zeroes to the system disk and then boot from the CD to install Tiger on a completely clear drive. This is what I do, but I will admit it is probably overkill.

If you want to install 10.4 then you will need to do this. I don't think it's given people as many errors as upgrading from Windows 98 to Windows XP, but it causes problems. It's annoying but generally good practice to wipe your system disk before you install any new OS.

Lucinda Luvaas · November 10th, 2005, 12:02 AM

OK Zach, I understand all this. I could put the current OS on another drive and erase on the internal drive and then install Tiger. What I wonder is do I really need Tiger to run FCP 5.0? I just purchased this IMAC with Panther and hate to have to upgrade the OS already.

Lucinda

Zach Mull · November 10th, 2005, 02:52 AM

You definitely do not need Tiger to run FCP5. You just have to have OS 10.3.9 and QuickTime 7 installed. Just a suggestion: it would be much easier for you to upgrade the OS now than after you begin working on projects. Unless you plan on sticking with Panther for a long time, it would be much easier to install Tiger before you get going. Good luck.

Lucinda Luvaas · November 10th, 2005, 12:42 PM

Thanks Zach. I think I'd like to just make the small upgrade for now even tho' it might be easier for later.

I've heard there are problems with OS 10.3.9 .....will I run into the dreaded problems with Quicktime 7.0 if I just do this minor upgrade?

Thanks for your help!

Lucinda

Zach Mull · November 10th, 2005, 03:17 PM

I have no problems with 10.3.9, and it's running on all three of the Macs at my company. I am still on FCP4.5 so I don't know from personal experience whether FCP5 is solid running on 10.3.9, but Larry Jordan wrote a bunch of positive stuff about that configuration on his website. I think you are safe with it.

If you do run into problems with QT7 then just look at this thread on Apple Discussions: http://discussions.info.apple.com/we...Yb.1@.68b24d63. You'll be able to fix it without too much trouble, and this does work. I had this problem on one of my machines before the latests QuickTime update came out, and this solution worked. I would be hesistant only if you plan to capture directly from Canon camcorders. Those seem to like QT7 even less than they did QT6, and they have plenty of other known issues with firewire protocol.

Lucinda Luvaas · November 11th, 2005, 06:28 PM

I would be hesistant only if you plan to capture directly from Canon camcorders. Those seem to like QT7 even less than they did QT6, and they have plenty of other known issues with firewire protocol.

I definitely always use my Canons for capture...... I haven't had any trouble with Quicktime 6+.

What is the problem with 7 anyway? did Apple fix this yet?

Lucinda Luvaas · November 11th, 2005, 06:31 PM

One last question.....

I have this computer, an IMac and a G4. This one has 1 gig of memory, an internal 80 gig that came with it and an external Maxtor 160 gig. I only want to purchase FCP 5.0, or 4.5 which I don't seem to be able to find, I don't want to use Motion or the Audio program with the Suite because I already have good motion programs and Audio too.....so what I'm wondering is will FCP 5.0 work adequately on my IMac if most of what I'll do is import quicktime files that have animation, etc., in them done in other apps? This is what I do with Premiere, just use it basically to do the timeline, bringing all my files from other apps into it and then doing final tweaking there.

Any advice would be appreciated. I don't want to get FCP if this computer will be too slow...I'd rather wait until I have a new dual processor customized G5.

November 6th, 2005, 02:24 PM	#1
Lucinda Luvaas Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 233	Memory Issues with Final Cut Pro Hi There, I don't know if this issue has been addressed previously, but I have an older version of Final Cut Pro 3.0 and want to know how much memory I should allocate to it. It seems to render ok when I imported a movie, but when I made a green screen and rendered a very small section of the timeline it needed 35 minutes to render. That seems quite off to me. I have a dual processor G4 and a gig of ram. This isn't the newest version of FCP, so it should be adequate. I've been using Adobe Premiere and the rendering time isn't too bad. Altho' when I do motion or special effects using Commotion Pro or AE it can take time. Help would be appreciated since I'm a newbie to Final Cut.

November 7th, 2005, 07:25 AM	#4
Dave Perry Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Roanoke, VA Posts: 796	QT 7 and Tiger are fine. A properly maintained system will have no problem with it and FCP 5 works better with both. __________________ Dave Perry Cinematographer LLC Director of Photography • Editor • Digital Film Production • 540.915.2752 • daveperry.net

November 6th, 2005, 08:29 PM	#2
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	Unfortunately FCP 3 is rather a "dog" compared to the newer version. It will want to render just about everything, and I doubt that adding RAM or even a faster CPU will help. The problem is, FCP 3 is really a MacOS 9 application which was upgraded to run under MacOS X. It isn't really MacOS X native and it isn't multi processor aware either. FCP 4 introduced "real time extreme" and was a huge improvement. FCP 3 doesn't have true realtime capabilities. It can display some effects in low resolution realtime on your computer monitor, but it cannot send realtime previews over firewire to an external deck. So IMO you would be pouring money down a hole trying to upgrade a system to improve FCP performance. If you can't afford FCP 5 then maybe you can find a used copy of FCP 4.5. It will give you a huge performance increase on the same hardware. BTW, you can't "allocate memory" under MacOS X, the system does that itself. Or are you running FCP 3 under MacOS 9 perhaps?

November 7th, 2005, 01:37 AM	#3
Lucinda Luvaas Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 233	Hi Boyd, No, I'm running FCP 3.0 with OS X/I Mac, G5 and I also have it on my dual processor G4. I'm just learning a bit on it and plan to get FCP 5.0. I just am not too keen on upgrading to Tiger and Quicktime 7, have Panther now....this is a relatively new processor purchase, and I've heard not such good things about Quicktime 7.0....ugh. I've been using Premiere 6.5 and have to render everytime I do anything. I was hoping that FCP would be an improvement. Too bad about 3.0's rendering speed, etc. Where can you get used copies of FCP 4.5? Ebay? I've never purchased anything on Ebay and I'm a bit scared to. One more thing: I don't have an external production monitor on the G5 and I was wondering if I can get one that comes with a firewire connection so that I don't need to purchase a converter. Do you know if I can do that? Thanks for your help Boyd! Lucinda

November 7th, 2005, 09:41 AM	#5
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	I don't use eBay either for those same reasons. Maybe you can google up a company that is still selling sealed boxes of FCP 4.5 though? Really it would make more sense to just get FCP 5 though. I saw a cheap monitor with firewire somewhere - maybe Marketek? Didn't look like it was very good quality though. I believe there are some very expensive ones too. Or you could get something like this: http://www.adstech.com/products/API-...sp?pid=API-555

November 7th, 2005, 07:01 PM	#6
Lucinda Luvaas Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 233	Dave, If there's no compatibility issues with quicktime 7 and tiger, etc., why do so many people whine about it? Boyd, I know about converters. I already have one for my G4, I was just hoping I could find an lcd monitor that had a firewire capability that wasn't too cher. i also could use my cam and go from the processor to the cam and then out to the monitor. Lucinda

November 8th, 2005, 11:05 AM	#7
Zach Mull Major Player Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 273	People whine about QT7 and Tiger because they are lazy and do upgrade installs instead of clean installs. With a clean install, everything worked fine on my home system with OS 10.4.1 and FCP 4.5, and I have used FCP 5 on other people's systems with much success. But everyone who does an upgrade install complains and blames Tiger and QT7 for their troubles. If you back up your files and do an erase and install with Tiger then your system will work beautifully.

November 8th, 2005, 10:42 PM	#8
Lucinda Luvaas Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 233	Zach, Not sure I understand what you're saying here....you mean erase the existing OS and then put in Tiger rather than installing Tiger over say Panther which is what I currrently have? I've never done that before and I do admit I'm a bit spooked to do it for some reason. Lucinda

November 9th, 2005, 01:18 AM	#9
Zach Mull Major Player Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 273	Yes, that's what I'm saying. Tiger will not work properly unless you do a clean install - this is what most people have reported. Just make sure you have a good backup. If you have enough external storage to copy your system disk then it's easy to make a backup. You can use PsyncX and it will even make the backup bootable. Or you can pick and choose. But once you have a good backup it's easy to do the clean install and not worry. When you install the new OS, choose Erase and Install. Definitely do not choose upgrade. If you want to ensure that everything is clean then you can install Mac OS on a firewire drive (like an iPod), boot from that, use Disk Utility to write all zeroes to the system disk and then boot from the CD to install Tiger on a completely clear drive. This is what I do, but I will admit it is probably overkill. If you want to install 10.4 then you will need to do this. I don't think it's given people as many errors as upgrading from Windows 98 to Windows XP, but it causes problems. It's annoying but generally good practice to wipe your system disk before you install any new OS.

November 10th, 2005, 12:02 AM	#10
Lucinda Luvaas Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 233	OK Zach, I understand all this. I could put the current OS on another drive and erase on the internal drive and then install Tiger. What I wonder is do I really need Tiger to run FCP 5.0? I just purchased this IMAC with Panther and hate to have to upgrade the OS already. Lucinda

November 10th, 2005, 02:52 AM	#11
Zach Mull Major Player Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 273	You definitely do not need Tiger to run FCP5. You just have to have OS 10.3.9 and QuickTime 7 installed. Just a suggestion: it would be much easier for you to upgrade the OS now than after you begin working on projects. Unless you plan on sticking with Panther for a long time, it would be much easier to install Tiger before you get going. Good luck.

November 10th, 2005, 12:42 PM	#12
Lucinda Luvaas Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 233	Thanks Zach. I think I'd like to just make the small upgrade for now even tho' it might be easier for later. I've heard there are problems with OS 10.3.9 .....will I run into the dreaded problems with Quicktime 7.0 if I just do this minor upgrade? Thanks for your help! Lucinda

November 10th, 2005, 03:17 PM	#13
Zach Mull Major Player Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 273	I have no problems with 10.3.9, and it's running on all three of the Macs at my company. I am still on FCP4.5 so I don't know from personal experience whether FCP5 is solid running on 10.3.9, but Larry Jordan wrote a bunch of positive stuff about that configuration on his website. I think you are safe with it. If you do run into problems with QT7 then just look at this thread on Apple Discussions: http://discussions.info.apple.com/we...Yb.1@.68b24d63. You'll be able to fix it without too much trouble, and this does work. I had this problem on one of my machines before the latests QuickTime update came out, and this solution worked. I would be hesistant only if you plan to capture directly from Canon camcorders. Those seem to like QT7 even less than they did QT6, and they have plenty of other known issues with firewire protocol.

November 11th, 2005, 06:28 PM	#14
Lucinda Luvaas Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 233	I would be hesistant only if you plan to capture directly from Canon camcorders. Those seem to like QT7 even less than they did QT6, and they have plenty of other known issues with firewire protocol. I definitely always use my Canons for capture...... I haven't had any trouble with Quicktime 6+. What is the problem with 7 anyway? did Apple fix this yet?

November 11th, 2005, 06:31 PM	#15
Lucinda Luvaas Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 233	One last question..... I have this computer, an IMac and a G4. This one has 1 gig of memory, an internal 80 gig that came with it and an external Maxtor 160 gig. I only want to purchase FCP 5.0, or 4.5 which I don't seem to be able to find, I don't want to use Motion or the Audio program with the Suite because I already have good motion programs and Audio too.....so what I'm wondering is will FCP 5.0 work adequately on my IMac if most of what I'll do is import quicktime files that have animation, etc., in them done in other apps? This is what I do with Premiere, just use it basically to do the timeline, bringing all my files from other apps into it and then doing final tweaking there. Any advice would be appreciated. I don't want to get FCP if this computer will be too slow...I'd rather wait until I have a new dual processor customized G5.