Apple announces HDV support via Final Cut Express HD and iMovie HD at DVinfo.net

Kyle Harmon · January 11th, 2005, 01:16 PM

iMovie will be part of the iLife '05 package and will ship on 1/22/05 for $79.

Final Cut Express HD will cost $299 or Final Cut Express version 1 or 2 users can upgrade for $99. It features HDV support and will also include LiveType and Soundtrack, and will Apple store is indicating 3-4 weeks on shipping.

Apple has not announced any HDV upgrades for Final Cut Pro HD yet.

http://www.apple.com/finalcut/

Jason Beaton · January 11th, 2005, 01:37 PM

But does it support both the HD-10 and FX-1 or just the FX-1 ? And why no FCP upgrade ?

Robert Mann Z. · January 11th, 2005, 01:45 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Jason Beaton : But does it support both the HD-10 and FX-1 or just the FX-1 ? And why no FCP upgrade ? -->>>

both

Kyle Harmon · January 11th, 2005, 01:46 PM

During his keynote, Steve Jobs demo'd it using the HDR-FX1 with the president of Sony on stage. He indicated support for both 1080i and 720p HDV, so I would assume that the HD-10 will work as well.

Edit: As for the lack of an announcement regarding Final Cut Pro HD, that one leaves me scratching my head as well. In terms of product cycles, they only recently released their current version, so my guess is that they didn't want to mess with it yet. I suspect that we may see a quiet upgrade for HDV support sometime around the time that Final Cut Express HD is shipped, but that is pure speculation on my part.

Hayden Rivers · January 11th, 2005, 02:29 PM

It's really bizarre that they only announced HDV support for Final Cut Express. It's bizarre that a $300 product would receive support before their flagship $1000 professional product.

Christopher C. Murphy · January 11th, 2005, 03:12 PM

Ok, this ticks me off a little. I bought FCP HD - the full version for $1000. They go and release FCP Express with HDV support before giving it to us for free?? I highly doubt even ONE iMovie user has requested HDV support. We are professionals who spent the extra $ for their Final Cut "Pro" software.....hmm, yeah I'm kinda ticked off right now.

I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt and see if they have free web updates before they ship the FCP Express or iMovie HD out. I mean come on...iMovie does HDV before FCP Pro?!!!!! Insanity if they've spent anytime trolling these boards.

The good news is that the FCP HD Express page on Apple's site has "HDV and DV" as it's top feature. It's all over the pages, so FCP HD most definately should have it soon...I just don't think we should have to wait since they've obviously got their sh*t together with HDV.

Heath McKnight · January 11th, 2005, 03:41 PM

I agree with Kyle, I too am speculating that we'll see a "quiet" and free upgrade to FCP HD for HDV support.

Then again, NAB is in 3 + months, so maybe they're waiting for then to announce it as FCP 5 or something. But it still doesn't make sense, because they're gonna anger people like us. It's really weird!

In the meantime, I wouldn't mind getting iLife 2005, and the $79 pricetag isn't bad. I really like GarageBand, so that's cool by me. But, I can see why others wouldn't want to shell out $79 after spending $$ on FCP. For me, I've had all upgrades and the original FCP 1.0, so I've spent nearly $2000 total, so I guess on the other hand, $79 is ridiculous to spend after forking out so much money on FCP and upgrades.

So, in conclusion, I'm speculating and a little curious (confused) as to why this is happening...Then again, everything announced today, except FCP Express HD, is consumer-based.

heath

Rhett Allen · January 11th, 2005, 04:24 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Heath McKnight : ...Then again, everything announced today, except FCP Express HD, is consumer-based.

heath -->>>

FCExpress IS a consumer-based product. It's a very high end consumer, but it is still their consumer version (hence the lack of the word "PRO"). iMovie is their, for lack of better term, idiot proof application, like iDVD.
HDV was designed as a consumer format. Both of the cameras currently out are considered consumer cameras so it made sense that Apple readied the consumer application first.
I have word from a few Apple contacts that the update for FCP is coming soon so fear not. It kind of irritated me as well but the logic is, as a "professional", most production houses are not using HDV and to potentially update or upgrade their software unnecessarily would not fare well for many users. I can see the point, I mean, I have no plans to use HDV in the near future so why would I want to download an update to support a camera I can't even buy yet (HVR-Z1) and risk upsetting my beautifully stable system.
I was impressed they decided to bundle LiveType and SoundTrack with Express though. Those are both great applications and adds heavily to the value of Express but it makes me wonder... what have they got planned for FCP5? Bundle it with Shake?! I would wet myself! That is such a great program! I know they aren't doing that though. My sources won't tell me what they are doing but that it's nice.

Christopher C. Murphy · January 11th, 2005, 05:32 PM

I guess this is one of the huge benefits of being an active member of these boards...you learn something new everyday!

Rhett, you make sense when you say that FCP HD getting an HDV upgrade right now would upset some "Pro" users that might not need it..yet. (Z1 ain't out yet) Even though I consider myself a "Pro" user - the HDV cameras are in actuallity "consumer". Therefore, I guess that FCP HD's main users are probably not HDV'ers yet....more standard DV users by far and "film" users.

It kinda makes sense I guess...although, we're all $1000 buyers here like everyone else, so us complaining shouldn't be frowned upon!

Something of note - we should figure out what the iMovie HD will do for $79. If it captures and converts in real time...isn't that worth the price? If it brings in a long HDV clip and keeps it native, but somehow creates a project file importable to FCP HD?? I have no idea if that is possible, but it makes sense to me that HDV support in iMovie would benefit FCP HD somehow. Is there a new codec??

Heath McKnight · January 11th, 2005, 05:37 PM

Could we capture HDV in iMovie and then import the QuickTime files into Final Cut Pro HD?

also, guys, keep in mind that Avid isn't promising HDV support until mid-2005.

heath

John C. Chu · January 11th, 2005, 05:58 PM

EDIT: for clarity

Oh my God...

I just looked at the Macworld Keynote Expo Keynote rebroadcast from Apple to hear the details of what Jobs said...

What piqued my interest is that Steve Jobs says you can *export* the finished HDV movie back to the Sony camera from iMovie.

This sounds great...use your camera as a deck to play back on HDTV sets...

And the video can later be burned on future HD-DVD recorders( Jobs specifically mentions Blue-Ray as the president of Sony was introduced at the Keynote.)

Of course, in the here and now--one can go directly to iDVD.

Steve also raves about the Sony HDR-FX1---he thinks everyone should get one...

I'm really surprised that iMovie HD is here sooner that I ever expected it to be.

Awesome.

Rhett Allen · January 11th, 2005, 06:37 PM

You know, I've barely used iMovie but it's really a neat little program for the mom and pop and kids who want to make a little home flick so this is really a big step. The automated features should be a warm welcome making it even easier.
There is a difference in the way iMovie and FCP handle video making them slightly incompatible which makes it suck even more. (iMovie uses DV streams .vs FCP's DV) Sometimes I think it would be cool to just launch iMovie to capture a bunch of tape and log it into bins. I like the simple interface and with the new features it would be a cool little app for easy captures. Also, for iMovie to handle ANY format in real-time that FCP does NOT seems a little strange when comparing a $1000 "PRO" application to a free one. (referring to HDV and mpeg-4)
I'm really interested to see where this HDV thing is going because it seems like it's getting much better reception than previously planned. I can't wait to see the new Sony when it comes out too.
I'm one of those $1000 buyers as well and it would chap my butt if they didn't make it a free upgrade but I have faith that when it's needed, it'll be there. I do feel a little ripped that they are including LiveType and SoundTrack with Express (for $300) but since I didn't even know it was included in FCP4 when I bought it I just saw it as a bonus. (I also wish I had waited just a little longer to get the Production Suite instead of everything separately but I needed it all for my new laptop).
Now the whole issue of "Pro" .vs "Consumer" cameras. The line is getting a little fine isn't it? It seems the consumer cameras are catching up quickly and the "PRO" (lower end) are getting a little less PRO.

Joshua Starnes · January 11th, 2005, 07:45 PM

Sometimes I think it would be cool to just launch iMovie to capture a bunch of tape and log it into bins. I like the simple interface and with the new features it would be a cool little app for easy captures.

No it's not, not even with the new features. I went this route for short time when my FCP3 was buggy and it is a pain.

Betsy Moore · January 11th, 2005, 07:52 PM

Now if only Apples weren't more expensive than a classic Mustang...

Rhett Allen · January 11th, 2005, 08:16 PM

They have that new $500 model you could buy. And it will come with iMovieHD and iDVD as well. Not a bad deal and certainly less than a classic Mustang.

January 11th, 2005, 01:16 PM	#1
Kyle Harmon Tourist Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4	Apple announces HDV support via Final Cut Express HD and iMovie HD iMovie will be part of the iLife '05 package and will ship on 1/22/05 for $79. Final Cut Express HD will cost $299 or Final Cut Express version 1 or 2 users can upgrade for $99. It features HDV support and will also include LiveType and Soundtrack, and will Apple store is indicating 3-4 weeks on shipping. Apple has not announced any HDV upgrades for Final Cut Pro HD yet. http://www.apple.com/finalcut/

January 11th, 2005, 01:37 PM	#2
Jason Beaton Tourist Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New York City Posts: 4	YES ! But does it support both the HD-10 and FX-1 or just the FX-1 ? And why no FCP upgrade ?

January 11th, 2005, 01:45 PM	#3
Robert Mann Z. Skyonic New York Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NYC Posts: 614	Re: YES ! <<<-- Originally posted by Jason Beaton : But does it support both the HD-10 and FX-1 or just the FX-1 ? And why no FCP upgrade ? -->>> both

January 11th, 2005, 03:12 PM	#6
Christopher C. Murphy Trustee Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 1,707	Ok, this ticks me off a little. I bought FCP HD - the full version for $1000. They go and release FCP Express with HDV support before giving it to us for free?? I highly doubt even ONE iMovie user has requested HDV support. We are professionals who spent the extra $ for their Final Cut "Pro" software.....hmm, yeah I'm kinda ticked off right now. I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt and see if they have free web updates before they ship the FCP Express or iMovie HD out. I mean come on...iMovie does HDV before FCP Pro?!!!!! Insanity if they've spent anytime trolling these boards. The good news is that the FCP HD Express page on Apple's site has "HDV and DV" as it's top feature. It's all over the pages, so FCP HD most definately should have it soon...I just don't think we should have to wait since they've obviously got their sh*t together with HDV. __________________ Christopher C. Murphy Director, Producer, Writer

January 11th, 2005, 03:41 PM	#7
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	I agree with Kyle, I too am speculating that we'll see a "quiet" and free upgrade to FCP HD for HDV support. Then again, NAB is in 3 + months, so maybe they're waiting for then to announce it as FCP 5 or something. But it still doesn't make sense, because they're gonna anger people like us. It's really weird! In the meantime, I wouldn't mind getting iLife 2005, and the $79 pricetag isn't bad. I really like GarageBand, so that's cool by me. But, I can see why others wouldn't want to shell out $79 after spending $$ on FCP. For me, I've had all upgrades and the original FCP 1.0, so I've spent nearly $2000 total, so I guess on the other hand, $79 is ridiculous to spend after forking out so much money on FCP and upgrades. So, in conclusion, I'm speculating and a little curious (confused) as to why this is happening...Then again, everything announced today, except FCP Express HD, is consumer-based. heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

January 11th, 2005, 01:46 PM	#4
Kyle Harmon Tourist Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4	During his keynote, Steve Jobs demo'd it using the HDR-FX1 with the president of Sony on stage. He indicated support for both 1080i and 720p HDV, so I would assume that the HD-10 will work as well. Edit: As for the lack of an announcement regarding Final Cut Pro HD, that one leaves me scratching my head as well. In terms of product cycles, they only recently released their current version, so my guess is that they didn't want to mess with it yet. I suspect that we may see a quiet upgrade for HDV support sometime around the time that Final Cut Express HD is shipped, but that is pure speculation on my part.

January 11th, 2005, 02:29 PM	#5
Hayden Rivers Regular Crew Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 53	It's really bizarre that they only announced HDV support for Final Cut Express. It's bizarre that a $300 product would receive support before their flagship $1000 professional product.

January 11th, 2005, 04:24 PM	#8
Rhett Allen Major Player Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Plano, TX Posts: 607	<<<-- Originally posted by Heath McKnight : ...Then again, everything announced today, except FCP Express HD, is consumer-based. heath -->>> FCExpress IS a consumer-based product. It's a very high end consumer, but it is still their consumer version (hence the lack of the word "PRO"). iMovie is their, for lack of better term, idiot proof application, like iDVD. HDV was designed as a consumer format. Both of the cameras currently out are considered consumer cameras so it made sense that Apple readied the consumer application first. I have word from a few Apple contacts that the update for FCP is coming soon so fear not. It kind of irritated me as well but the logic is, as a "professional", most production houses are not using HDV and to potentially update or upgrade their software unnecessarily would not fare well for many users. I can see the point, I mean, I have no plans to use HDV in the near future so why would I want to download an update to support a camera I can't even buy yet (HVR-Z1) and risk upsetting my beautifully stable system. I was impressed they decided to bundle LiveType and SoundTrack with Express though. Those are both great applications and adds heavily to the value of Express but it makes me wonder... what have they got planned for FCP5? Bundle it with Shake?! I would wet myself! That is such a great program! I know they aren't doing that though. My sources won't tell me what they are doing but that it's nice.

January 11th, 2005, 05:32 PM	#9
Christopher C. Murphy Trustee Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 1,707	I guess this is one of the huge benefits of being an active member of these boards...you learn something new everyday! Rhett, you make sense when you say that FCP HD getting an HDV upgrade right now would upset some "Pro" users that might not need it..yet. (Z1 ain't out yet) Even though I consider myself a "Pro" user - the HDV cameras are in actuallity "consumer". Therefore, I guess that FCP HD's main users are probably not HDV'ers yet....more standard DV users by far and "film" users. It kinda makes sense I guess...although, we're all $1000 buyers here like everyone else, so us complaining shouldn't be frowned upon! Something of note - we should figure out what the iMovie HD will do for $79. If it captures and converts in real time...isn't that worth the price? If it brings in a long HDV clip and keeps it native, but somehow creates a project file importable to FCP HD?? I have no idea if that is possible, but it makes sense to me that HDV support in iMovie would benefit FCP HD somehow. Is there a new codec?? __________________ Christopher C. Murphy Director, Producer, Writer

January 11th, 2005, 05:37 PM	#10
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	Could we capture HDV in iMovie and then import the QuickTime files into Final Cut Pro HD? also, guys, keep in mind that Avid isn't promising HDV support until mid-2005. heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

January 11th, 2005, 05:58 PM	#11
John C. Chu Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Rego Park , NYC Posts: 665	EDIT: for clarity Oh my God... I just looked at the Macworld Keynote Expo Keynote rebroadcast from Apple to hear the details of what Jobs said... What piqued my interest is that Steve Jobs says you can export the finished HDV movie back to the Sony camera from iMovie. This sounds great...use your camera as a deck to play back on HDTV sets... And the video can later be burned on future HD-DVD recorders( Jobs specifically mentions Blue-Ray as the president of Sony was introduced at the Keynote.) Of course, in the here and now--one can go directly to iDVD. Steve also raves about the Sony HDR-FX1---he thinks everyone should get one... I'm really surprised that iMovie HD is here sooner that I ever expected it to be. Awesome.

January 11th, 2005, 06:37 PM	#12
Rhett Allen Major Player Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Plano, TX Posts: 607	You know, I've barely used iMovie but it's really a neat little program for the mom and pop and kids who want to make a little home flick so this is really a big step. The automated features should be a warm welcome making it even easier. There is a difference in the way iMovie and FCP handle video making them slightly incompatible which makes it suck even more. (iMovie uses DV streams .vs FCP's DV) Sometimes I think it would be cool to just launch iMovie to capture a bunch of tape and log it into bins. I like the simple interface and with the new features it would be a cool little app for easy captures. Also, for iMovie to handle ANY format in real-time that FCP does NOT seems a little strange when comparing a $1000 "PRO" application to a free one. (referring to HDV and mpeg-4) I'm really interested to see where this HDV thing is going because it seems like it's getting much better reception than previously planned. I can't wait to see the new Sony when it comes out too. I'm one of those $1000 buyers as well and it would chap my butt if they didn't make it a free upgrade but I have faith that when it's needed, it'll be there. I do feel a little ripped that they are including LiveType and SoundTrack with Express (for $300) but since I didn't even know it was included in FCP4 when I bought it I just saw it as a bonus. (I also wish I had waited just a little longer to get the Production Suite instead of everything separately but I needed it all for my new laptop). Now the whole issue of "Pro" .vs "Consumer" cameras. The line is getting a little fine isn't it? It seems the consumer cameras are catching up quickly and the "PRO" (lower end) are getting a little less PRO.

January 11th, 2005, 07:45 PM	#13
Joshua Starnes Major Player Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 356	Sometimes I think it would be cool to just launch iMovie to capture a bunch of tape and log it into bins. I like the simple interface and with the new features it would be a cool little app for easy captures. No it's not, not even with the new features. I went this route for short time when my FCP3 was buggy and it is a pain.

January 11th, 2005, 07:52 PM	#14
Betsy Moore Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 444	Now if only Apples weren't more expensive than a classic Mustang...

January 11th, 2005, 08:16 PM	#15
Rhett Allen Major Player Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Plano, TX Posts: 607	They have that new $500 model you could buy. And it will come with iMovieHD and iDVD as well. Not a bad deal and certainly less than a classic Mustang.