Bizarre phenomenon with fades & transitions... at DVinfo.net

Steve Lewis · August 16th, 2009, 03:08 PM

When I have a fade or transition and I export a quicktime out of FCP, the resulting quicktime will have odd color flashes or flickering during the transitions or fades. For example:
Woodies at the Beach By Stephen Lewis On ExposureRoom

In the first 2 seconds of this video (a fade in), you can see the frame flash RED for a split second. Why is this happening!?! I only see it in the exported QT and NOT in FCP.
Thanks,
-Steve

Paul E. Coleman · August 16th, 2009, 09:10 PM

There might be a mismatch between the codec you chose and the render choice selected. It's under the menu selection: Sequence > Sequence Settings > Video Processing tab. Depending on the codec you're using "Always Render in RGB" or "Render in 8-bit YUV" could eliminate the problem. I've left mine in YUV and have had no problems, but that doesn't mean it's the solution.

Robert Lane · August 17th, 2009, 09:35 AM

Steve,

Paul's suggestion is spot-on; check your sequence settings. Also, make sure your motion estimation is at "best". This won't have anything to do with the color splash issue but will help all the panning motion be smoother on output. (see pics) Don't try using "high precision YUV", it won't matter for the content/codec you've shot and will only raise render times by a factor of 5x - or more.

A creative suggestion: The vignette filter's edges are too obvious and harsh; it looks like the vid was shot through a tube. Widen and feather-out the filter a bit more then it will look more natural as if it was caused by natural lens vignetting which will add to the nostalgic feel of the clip.

Steve Lewis · August 20th, 2009, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Lane

Steve,

Paul's suggestion is spot-on; check your sequence settings. Also, make sure your motion estimation is at "best". This won't have anything to do with the color splash issue but will help all the panning motion be smoother on output. (see pics)

It was already set at 8 bit YUV. Any other possibilities?

Michael Lafleur · August 20th, 2009, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Lewis

It was already set at 8 bit YUV. Any other possibilities?

Steve (and Robert),

I have encountered exactly the same thing recently while exporting my current doc project using QT Conversion, but with more random degradation of transitions (flashes during certain dissolves, interlaced lines appearing in key-framed moving jpegs, etc. – see my sequence setting particulars listed at the end of this post).

After reading some other threads on this forum, I experimented with copying and pasting my timeline to new sequences, saving and closing and rebooting my MacBook Pro, and without any rhyme or reason, I was able to overcome NEARLY every glitch. I must have created dozens of new sequences to test and ‘repair’ the offending portion 15 second portion, re-rendering as needed, saving and then exporting it to QT to see if it came out cleanly. I then cut and pasted my entire 24 min project, rendered as needed and then exported it. Often that seemed to work for most of the glitches, but I finally was stumped by one stubborn segment that I have NOT yet been able to remedy.

Steve, I would suggest creating a new sequence (check your settings carefully), copying, pasting and re-rendering to see if that cleans up some of your issues. But I would welcome any further suggestions from Robert or anyone if they know what’s causing this and can provide a more reliable workaround than my new-sequence ‘witchcraft’ approach (i.e. I really don’t know what is causing or partially fixing these issues).

[FYI: my original footage was filmed on the new JVC HM100 as “XDCAM EX 1080i60” with my FCS2 Render Control set to “Apple ProRes 422 (HDV,XDCAM HD/EX only)" codex with “best quality” and others just as Robert has already affirmed. My QT Conversion export settings are ‘H.264’ – ‘Best’ – ‘Key frame 24’ – ‘yes’ – ‘multi-pass’ – ‘1280x720’]

Robert Lane · August 20th, 2009, 11:32 PM

Steve & Michael,

This seems like something very simple is going on in the software environment.

I may have you both send me your clips via FTP to my server so I can dive into this directly. As it turns out I have quite a bit of downtime before my gig at the end of this month so I may be able to help you both get this sorted out.

I'm still researching potential causes and will get back to you tomorrow. In the meantime, prepare your sequences to be sent via FTP, either by using Media Manager to create a standalone copy of your project or, simply output a movie from the timeline as a standalone FCP movie - NOT using Quicktime conversion.

We'll get this sorted out.

Michael Lafleur · August 21st, 2009, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Lane

Steve & Michael,

This seems like something very simple is going on in the software environment.

I may have you both send me your clips via FTP to my server so I can dive into this directly. As it turns out I have quite a bit of downtime before my gig at the end of this month so I may be able to help you both get this sorted out...

We'll get this sorted out.

Robert, your offer is very generous and any help would be most welcome! I’ve never tried to prep and pack a project before using Media Manager, especially one as l large as this that draws on over 1.2 TB of original HD footage. But I will start experimenting with outputting the offending 30 second segment as a ‘standalone FCP movie’ and see if I can get it to be read successfully on another Mac in my studio. Feel free to coach me on how to do any of this properly/efficiently to allow for it to be uploaded (I’m assuming you have an FTP site/address that you would like us to use – you can contact me at michaellafleur@cogeco.ca if need be).

[One Additional Observation that may be of interest: A “Preparing video for Display” progress window keeps popping up on screen, some 6-8 times before the actual export and save window finally opens to allow you to select your QT movie settings, etc., and there are RED unrendered lines that then appear on short portions of my sequence timeline behind the save/options window when it finally appears. That may be perfectly normal, but I’m not sure I noticed that while doing preliminary QT conversion tests on earlier/shorter versions of my doc project.]

Robert Lane · August 21st, 2009, 12:43 PM

Michael,

Make sure you have the latest updates from Apple on everything: QT, FCS etc. Also, make sure you have the latest codec/import plug-in from JVC. It could be that what you're seeing is nothing more than the long-GOP format being conformed to the timeline for viewing.

Take a look at your Real-Time playback settings in FCP; if they're on unlimited this may be why. Your system may not have all the resources required to playback XDCAM-EX footage smoothly (not enough RAM, slower CPU etc.)

I'm still researching ADC for this issue, please post your system configuration so I know what we're dealing with - and so others can view the config also in case more are suffering from this problem.

Steve Lewis · September 2nd, 2009, 07:01 PM

Still having this very obscure but annoying problem. It always seems to be a single red frame near the end of a fade and it happens in multiple projects. Maybe its specific to my QT conversion settings, although they haven't changed since before this problem arose!

-Steve

Michael Lafleur · September 2nd, 2009, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Lewis

Still having this very obscure but annoying problem. It always seems to be a single red frame near the end of a fade and it happens in multiple projects. Maybe its specific to my QT conversion settings, although they haven't changed since before this problem arose!

-Steve

Steve,

I may have recently found something that could help. As noted above, I also encountered similar ‘bizarre’ flashes and lines showing through my key-framed jpegs, etc. on my current project which was filmed on the new JVC HM100 as “XDCAM EX 1080i60”. I followed Robert's instruction above but it did NOT resolve the problem.

But then I considered that everything I’ve shot and edited over the past 4 years has been progressive rather than interlaced so I suspected it might have something to do with interlacing issues. I checked my sequence settings and experimented with changing the “Field Dominance” setting from its default choice of “Upper” and changed it to “None”. I then recompressed one of my problem sections and, what do you know, IT TURNED OUT PERFECTLY!! I repeated the test on various other glitchy sections and they too came out beautifully. Not only that but my 25 minute sequence compressed in half the time it previously took.

An editor friend offered another suggestion today that might help if the above doesn’t work for you: convert all your jpegs to non-interlaced PNG image files and re-insert them into your timeline.

I’m sure others more experienced in the seeming vagaries of codex and interlaced/non-interlaced footage can explain why these solutions have apparently worked. I’m just happy I’ve got consistently clean compression and great output after a mystifying week of poor results.

I hope this helps.

Cheers,

Michael

P.S. Kudos to Robert for your help, suggestions and willingness to delve deeper to find a solution for us. It is really appreciated!!

Michael Lafleur · September 2nd, 2009, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Lane

Michael,

Make sure you have the latest updates from Apple on everything: QT, FCS etc. Also, make sure you have the latest codec/import plug-in from JVC. It could be that what you're seeing is nothing more than the long-GOP format being conformed to the timeline for viewing.

Take a look at your Real-Time playback settings in FCP; if they're on unlimited this may be why. Your system may not have all the resources required to playback XDCAM-EX footage smoothly (not enough RAM, slower CPU etc.)

I'm still researching ADC for this issue, please post your system configuration so I know what we're dealing with - and so others can view the config also in case more are suffering from this problem.

Robert,

I realized I did NOT provide the information you requested so here it is in case that helps to more definitively identify what has been going. Thanks again for taking the time to help out:

Hardware Overview:

Model Name: MacBook Pro 17"
Model Identifier: MacBookPro2,1
Processor Name: Intel Core 2 Duo
Processor Speed: 2.33 GHz
Number Of Processors: 1
Total Number Of Cores: 2
L2 Cache: 4 MB
Memory: 2 GB
Bus Speed: 667 MHz
Boot ROM Version: MBP21.00A5.B08
SMC Version (system): 1.14f5

Mac OS: 10.5.8 Final Cut Pro: 6.0.6 QT Player: Version 7.6.2 (518)

August 16th, 2009, 03:08 PM	#1
Steve Lewis Major Player Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Goleta, CA Posts: 233	Bizarre phenomenon with fades & transitions... When I have a fade or transition and I export a quicktime out of FCP, the resulting quicktime will have odd color flashes or flickering during the transitions or fades. For example: Woodies at the Beach By Stephen Lewis On ExposureRoom In the first 2 seconds of this video (a fade in), you can see the frame flash RED for a split second. Why is this happening!?! I only see it in the exported QT and NOT in FCP. Thanks, -Steve __________________ www.spreefilms.com - Give me a museum and I'll fill it!

August 16th, 2009, 09:10 PM	#2
Paul E. Coleman Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: 42º 12' N, 72º 32' W Posts: 88	Check your Video Processing settings... There might be a mismatch between the codec you chose and the render choice selected. It's under the menu selection: Sequence > Sequence Settings > Video Processing tab. Depending on the codec you're using "Always Render in RGB" or "Render in 8-bit YUV" could eliminate the problem. I've left mine in YUV and have had no problems, but that doesn't mean it's the solution.

August 17th, 2009, 09:35 AM	#3
Robert Lane Go Go Godzilla Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Scottsdale, AZ USA Posts: 2,823 Images: 15	Steve, Paul's suggestion is spot-on; check your sequence settings. Also, make sure your motion estimation is at "best". This won't have anything to do with the color splash issue but will help all the panning motion be smoother on output. (see pics) Don't try using "high precision YUV", it won't matter for the content/codec you've shot and will only raise render times by a factor of 5x - or more. A creative suggestion: The vignette filter's edges are too obvious and harsh; it looks like the vid was shot through a tube. Widen and feather-out the filter a bit more then it will look more natural as if it was caused by natural lens vignetting which will add to the nostalgic feel of the clip. Attached Thumbnails

September 2nd, 2009, 07:01 PM	#9
Steve Lewis Major Player Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Goleta, CA Posts: 233	Still having this very obscure but annoying problem. It always seems to be a single red frame near the end of a fade and it happens in multiple projects. Maybe its specific to my QT conversion settings, although they haven't changed since before this problem arose! -Steve __________________ www.spreefilms.com - Give me a museum and I'll fill it!

August 20th, 2009, 11:32 PM	#6
Robert Lane Go Go Godzilla Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Scottsdale, AZ USA Posts: 2,823 Images: 15	Steve & Michael, This seems like something very simple is going on in the software environment. I may have you both send me your clips via FTP to my server so I can dive into this directly. As it turns out I have quite a bit of downtime before my gig at the end of this month so I may be able to help you both get this sorted out. I'm still researching potential causes and will get back to you tomorrow. In the meantime, prepare your sequences to be sent via FTP, either by using Media Manager to create a standalone copy of your project or, simply output a movie from the timeline as a standalone FCP movie - NOT using Quicktime conversion. We'll get this sorted out.

August 21st, 2009, 12:43 PM	#8
Robert Lane Go Go Godzilla Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Scottsdale, AZ USA Posts: 2,823 Images: 15	Michael, Make sure you have the latest updates from Apple on everything: QT, FCS etc. Also, make sure you have the latest codec/import plug-in from JVC. It could be that what you're seeing is nothing more than the long-GOP format being conformed to the timeline for viewing. Take a look at your Real-Time playback settings in FCP; if they're on unlimited this may be why. Your system may not have all the resources required to playback XDCAM-EX footage smoothly (not enough RAM, slower CPU etc.) I'm still researching ADC for this issue, please post your system configuration so I know what we're dealing with - and so others can view the config also in case more are suffering from this problem.