Anamorphic / 4:3 mess at DVinfo.net

Kirsten Scully · April 21st, 2004, 01:49 AM

Hi,
I've gotten myself into a mess. I shot a project in 4:3. I created 4 different bins and captured the media in 4:3. When I created 4 different sequences, I must have checked the anamorphic column for one of the sequences. What is displayed in this sequence has the top and sides chopped off. When I unclick the anamorphic column I get an elongated image (full screen vertical) but not full-screen horizontal. Can anyone tell me how I can get back to normal, full-screen so I can put all of my sequences together?
Thankyou,
Kirsten

Boyd Ostroff · April 21st, 2004, 08:38 AM

Don't worry Kirsten, everything will be fine, you just need to set things properly. It doesn't matter what format you used during capture, it's all really just 4:3. Select each clip and make sure its item properties do not have anamorphic checked. Now open each of your sequences and look at the sequence settings to be certain that anamorphic isn't checked on any of them.

The problem you describe occurs when the clip and sequence settings don't match. If you create a 4:3 sequence and drop a 16:9 clip into it then FCP will letterbox the clip inside the 4:3 frame. Or if you create a 16:9 sequence and drop a 4:3 clip into it then FCP will "pillarbox" it within the 16:9 frame (with a black bar to the left and right). But if the clip and sequence settings match then the video will fill the frame.

Now you don't mention which software you're using or what version (I use FCP 3), so there may be some differences in the exact menus you need to access, but the principle of matching settings should still apply.

Kirsten Scully · April 21st, 2004, 09:31 AM

Boyd,
Thanks for your reply and sorry not to have included all info! I'm using FCP 4.
I went to my clip setttings and made sure none of them was checked with anamorphic. I then went to my sequence settings and unchecked anamorphic on the sequence setting that was giving me a problem. Everything should be ok....what do I have to do now? Everything looks the same as before! Nothing has changed.
Kirsten

Boyd Ostroff · April 21st, 2004, 01:04 PM

I think that once you drop the 4:3 clip into a 16:9 sequence (or vice-versa) it gets resized to fit, and changing the sequence after the fact will not undo this. You will probablly have to pull any clips that were already in the sequence and drop them back in.

Alternately, set the canvas view to show the image+wireframe. You will see a "handle" at each corner of the image. You can use the mouse the drag the image outward to fill the frame (or to drag it inward if needed).

Either way, FCP is a non-destructive editor, so nothing iwill change the clips that you captured and once you get the settings to match everything should be fine.

Kirsten Scully · April 22nd, 2004, 01:19 AM

Boyd,
Just to make sure I understand you correctly, I have to drop 500+ clips back into a correctly configured sequence? That is what I was afraid of!

As far as resizing with the wireframe, I tried that and I can make it fit the whole viewing area, but I do lose much of the image both vertically and horizontally...without it totally solving the problem.
Thanks for you help.

Boyd Ostroff · April 22nd, 2004, 10:22 AM

I guess I'm not understanding the problem. When you say you lose image horizontally and vertically that implies that it has been "zoomed" larger than the canvas window. If the anamorphic settings are mis-matched I would expect only ONE of the following to be true:

1. When you resize the image so it's the full width of the frame then the top and bottom are cut off. This is what would happen if you put a 4:3 clip in a 16:9 sequence.

2. When you resize so that it's the full height of the screen then the left and right sides of the image are cut off. This would happen with a 16:9 clip in a 4:3 sequence.

Which is happening, it can't be both. Also, when you talk about all this are you describing the image on your computer monitor (the canvas window) or on an external NTSC monitor or TV? Are the two images different from each other or the same? I really don't have enough information here to understand your problem, sorry.

And finally, if everything looked distorted, WHY did you keep going and drop 500 clips into a sequence?....

Kirsten Scully · April 23rd, 2004, 04:09 AM

When I talk about the horizontal and vertical, I am talking about what is happening in the canvas window on my computer monitor.

Originally, anamorphic was checked in the anamorphic column next to my sequence. This gives me an image which is cut off both horizontally and vertically. I have grey bands at the top and the bottom and black bands at both sides.

When I resize the image in the viewer using the wireframes the image reaches the edges of the viewer horizontally. However, I still have grey bands at the top and the bottom.

When I resize the image so that anamorphic is NOT checked in the browser settings, the image is full length vertical with the sides chopped off. I imagine that this all happened because I had my sequence settings for this particular sequence set to anamorphic.

I made another sequence with the correct settings and copied the clips from the old sequence in the timeline to the new sequence. The result is a squeezed image with the sides cut off.

I hope that I have explained this clearly.

The fact that I built a whole sequence without realizing that the settings were wrong must be put down to inexperience.

Boyd Ostroff · April 23rd, 2004, 02:49 PM

Sorry, I think this is going to be hard for me to comprehend at a distance in the limited time that I have, but here are a couple thoughts:

1. If you have "grey bands", that sounds like what you get when you make the canvas window a different proportion from the actual video. It's just a grey border around the image and has no significance in the actual video.

2. The black bands to the left and right are sometimes called "pillarboxing" and are the result of putting 4:3 clips in a 16:9 sequence. This tells me that your sequence is still set for 16:9. Now you said that you copied the clips from your timeline and dropped them into a new sequence. I don't think that will work since you would be copying the clips with incorrect proportions, just like the old sequence. I think you will need to take the original clips from the browser and drop them in the new sequence. But I really haven't tried myself, so maybe someone else knows a workaround.

Sorry you're having a rough time with this.

Boyd Ostroff · May 2nd, 2004, 08:01 PM

Kirsten, a similar question came up in another thread, so I just opened FCP and had a look at this problem again. There is a way to fix 4:3 clips that are pillarboxed in your 16:9 sequence, but I think it still needs to be done individually to each clip on the timeline. Try this: double click the desired clip in the timeline to open in the viewer. Go to the distort property on the viewer's motion tab and note that the aspect ratio is .33. Change this value to 0 and the clip will be properly stretched horizontally. It should now fill the full 16:9 frame and be correctly proportioned.

Kirsten Scully · May 3rd, 2004, 12:41 AM

Thankyou Boyd,
I think that you have found the answer.

April 21st, 2004, 01:49 AM	#1
Kirsten Scully New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Jerez, Spain Posts: 19	Anamorphic / 4:3 mess Hi, I've gotten myself into a mess. I shot a project in 4:3. I created 4 different bins and captured the media in 4:3. When I created 4 different sequences, I must have checked the anamorphic column for one of the sequences. What is displayed in this sequence has the top and sides chopped off. When I unclick the anamorphic column I get an elongated image (full screen vertical) but not full-screen horizontal. Can anyone tell me how I can get back to normal, full-screen so I can put all of my sequences together? Thankyou, Kirsten

April 21st, 2004, 08:38 AM	#2
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	Don't worry Kirsten, everything will be fine, you just need to set things properly. It doesn't matter what format you used during capture, it's all really just 4:3. Select each clip and make sure its item properties do not have anamorphic checked. Now open each of your sequences and look at the sequence settings to be certain that anamorphic isn't checked on any of them. The problem you describe occurs when the clip and sequence settings don't match. If you create a 4:3 sequence and drop a 16:9 clip into it then FCP will letterbox the clip inside the 4:3 frame. Or if you create a 16:9 sequence and drop a 4:3 clip into it then FCP will "pillarbox" it within the 16:9 frame (with a black bar to the left and right). But if the clip and sequence settings match then the video will fill the frame. Now you don't mention which software you're using or what version (I use FCP 3), so there may be some differences in the exact menus you need to access, but the principle of matching settings should still apply.

April 21st, 2004, 09:31 AM	#3
Kirsten Scully New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Jerez, Spain Posts: 19	Boyd, Thanks for your reply and sorry not to have included all info! I'm using FCP 4. I went to my clip setttings and made sure none of them was checked with anamorphic. I then went to my sequence settings and unchecked anamorphic on the sequence setting that was giving me a problem. Everything should be ok....what do I have to do now? Everything looks the same as before! Nothing has changed. Kirsten

April 21st, 2004, 01:04 PM	#4
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	I think that once you drop the 4:3 clip into a 16:9 sequence (or vice-versa) it gets resized to fit, and changing the sequence after the fact will not undo this. You will probablly have to pull any clips that were already in the sequence and drop them back in. Alternately, set the canvas view to show the image+wireframe. You will see a "handle" at each corner of the image. You can use the mouse the drag the image outward to fill the frame (or to drag it inward if needed). Either way, FCP is a non-destructive editor, so nothing iwill change the clips that you captured and once you get the settings to match everything should be fine.

April 22nd, 2004, 01:19 AM	#5
Kirsten Scully New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Jerez, Spain Posts: 19	Boyd, Just to make sure I understand you correctly, I have to drop 500+ clips back into a correctly configured sequence? That is what I was afraid of! As far as resizing with the wireframe, I tried that and I can make it fit the whole viewing area, but I do lose much of the image both vertically and horizontally...without it totally solving the problem. Thanks for you help.

April 22nd, 2004, 10:22 AM	#6
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	I guess I'm not understanding the problem. When you say you lose image horizontally and vertically that implies that it has been "zoomed" larger than the canvas window. If the anamorphic settings are mis-matched I would expect only ONE of the following to be true: 1. When you resize the image so it's the full width of the frame then the top and bottom are cut off. This is what would happen if you put a 4:3 clip in a 16:9 sequence. 2. When you resize so that it's the full height of the screen then the left and right sides of the image are cut off. This would happen with a 16:9 clip in a 4:3 sequence. Which is happening, it can't be both. Also, when you talk about all this are you describing the image on your computer monitor (the canvas window) or on an external NTSC monitor or TV? Are the two images different from each other or the same? I really don't have enough information here to understand your problem, sorry. And finally, if everything looked distorted, WHY did you keep going and drop 500 clips into a sequence?....

April 23rd, 2004, 04:09 AM	#7
Kirsten Scully New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Jerez, Spain Posts: 19	When I talk about the horizontal and vertical, I am talking about what is happening in the canvas window on my computer monitor. Originally, anamorphic was checked in the anamorphic column next to my sequence. This gives me an image which is cut off both horizontally and vertically. I have grey bands at the top and the bottom and black bands at both sides. When I resize the image in the viewer using the wireframes the image reaches the edges of the viewer horizontally. However, I still have grey bands at the top and the bottom. When I resize the image so that anamorphic is NOT checked in the browser settings, the image is full length vertical with the sides chopped off. I imagine that this all happened because I had my sequence settings for this particular sequence set to anamorphic. I made another sequence with the correct settings and copied the clips from the old sequence in the timeline to the new sequence. The result is a squeezed image with the sides cut off. I hope that I have explained this clearly. The fact that I built a whole sequence without realizing that the settings were wrong must be put down to inexperience.

April 23rd, 2004, 02:49 PM	#8
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	Sorry, I think this is going to be hard for me to comprehend at a distance in the limited time that I have, but here are a couple thoughts: 1. If you have "grey bands", that sounds like what you get when you make the canvas window a different proportion from the actual video. It's just a grey border around the image and has no significance in the actual video. 2. The black bands to the left and right are sometimes called "pillarboxing" and are the result of putting 4:3 clips in a 16:9 sequence. This tells me that your sequence is still set for 16:9. Now you said that you copied the clips from your timeline and dropped them into a new sequence. I don't think that will work since you would be copying the clips with incorrect proportions, just like the old sequence. I think you will need to take the original clips from the browser and drop them in the new sequence. But I really haven't tried myself, so maybe someone else knows a workaround. Sorry you're having a rough time with this.

May 2nd, 2004, 08:01 PM	#9
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	Kirsten, a similar question came up in another thread, so I just opened FCP and had a look at this problem again. There is a way to fix 4:3 clips that are pillarboxed in your 16:9 sequence, but I think it still needs to be done individually to each clip on the timeline. Try this: double click the desired clip in the timeline to open in the viewer. Go to the distort property on the viewer's motion tab and note that the aspect ratio is .33. Change this value to 0 and the clip will be properly stretched horizontally. It should now fill the full 16:9 frame and be correctly proportioned.

May 3rd, 2004, 12:41 AM	#10
Kirsten Scully New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Jerez, Spain Posts: 19	Thankyou Boyd, I think that you have found the answer.