Confused about HD to SD Downconversion for DVDSP at DVinfo.net

Mike Petrucco · June 13th, 2009, 10:11 PM

My source media is 1080p30 from a Panasonic HMC150, with all my editing, titling, motion, etc. done in ProRes 422. I exported from FCP using compressor, and used it's best default SD DVD preset, and got pretty good results, but I have two problems:

One of my titling pieces really stinks in the down convert. It is a series of scrolling white text on a black background, and on DVD, it has a rainbow coloring to the edges, and I am not sure how that artifact is getting into it.

Also, I am having a really hard time figuring out the right workflow to export a clip of it for a DVD first play, and a menu background. I have searched a lot on this, and have found a lot of info, but none so far that fits right in with my circumstances here and the issues I am running into.

Any thoughts, ideas, or even questions are appreciated to help me sort this out. Thanks.

Christopher Drews · June 13th, 2009, 11:36 PM

Rolling titles always freak in FCP. In fact, this has always been an issue with the title tool - Avid doesn't have this problem, nor motion. The first suggestion is to create a PSD file of your white titles in Photoshop - any version.

If you are cutting in 1920x1080 then you'd multiply the 1080 by say 5. This will give you a canvas in Photoshop of 1920x5400. Make the background black and type your text.

Export as a PNG file. Import into FCP and use basic motion, one keyframe at the start and one at the end. This will give you a super smooth motion that will not have any hints of compression artifacts. This is also how most independent film producers deliver their final credit sequences.

To your second question:
I'm not sure what you are asking but there are plenty of functions in DVDSP that can give you a first play option and background play. The easiest way for background play is just to drag and hold your M2V into the background of the template. A question box will come up asking you if you want to set it to play in the background.

As for first play, just select your M2V and AC3 track, right click on it in the map window and select "first play" then add the post command (also in map) to your Menu.

Hope this helps,
-C

Mitchell Lewis · June 14th, 2009, 10:59 AM

Are you shooting/editing progressive or interlaced? Doing a text crawl (lower third that moves left to right) will only look smooth when editing/rendering interlaced. But if you're going to the web then......hmmmm. :)

Mike Petrucco · June 14th, 2009, 04:03 PM

I think I was half asleep when I posted these questions. Setting up a first play is not actually my issue, that is straightforward. I don't even know why I put that in there other than sleep deprivation.

What I am trying to establish is a good way to get my progressive 1080p30 projects out on SD DVD 16:9 apsect ratio, without creating two sets of lower thirds, titles, etc. So in essence, I am hoping to find the right way to downconvert these assets without redoing them.

Mike Petrucco · June 14th, 2009, 08:52 PM

I just did a test and recreated part of moving text sequence in Motion, but also used a NTSC DV preset and the differnce was huge over what I got out of Livetype. It's crystal clear for all but one word I sent across the screen fairly fast. That one had some motion artifacts, but the slower ones did not. That will get me where I need to go on this, but out of curiosity, I may redo a portion in Livetype at a NTSC DV project setting and see how that compares. I suspect that Motion will still do a nicer job with though.

June 13th, 2009, 10:11 PM	#1
Mike Petrucco Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Syracuse, NY Posts: 98	Confused about HD to SD Downconversion for DVDSP My source media is 1080p30 from a Panasonic HMC150, with all my editing, titling, motion, etc. done in ProRes 422. I exported from FCP using compressor, and used it's best default SD DVD preset, and got pretty good results, but I have two problems: One of my titling pieces really stinks in the down convert. It is a series of scrolling white text on a black background, and on DVD, it has a rainbow coloring to the edges, and I am not sure how that artifact is getting into it. Also, I am having a really hard time figuring out the right workflow to export a clip of it for a DVD first play, and a menu background. I have searched a lot on this, and have found a lot of info, but none so far that fits right in with my circumstances here and the issues I am running into. Any thoughts, ideas, or even questions are appreciated to help me sort this out. Thanks.

June 14th, 2009, 10:59 AM	#3
Mitchell Lewis Trustee Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Kennewick, WA Posts: 1,124	Are you shooting/editing progressive or interlaced? Doing a text crawl (lower third that moves left to right) will only look smooth when editing/rendering interlaced. But if you're going to the web then......hmmmm. :) __________________ Sony EX3, Canon 5D MkII, Chrosziel Matte Box, Sachtler tripod, Steadicam Flyer, Mac Pro, Apple/Adobe software - 20 years as a local videographer/editor

June 13th, 2009, 11:36 PM	#2
Christopher Drews Major Player Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 628	Rolling titles always freak in FCP. In fact, this has always been an issue with the title tool - Avid doesn't have this problem, nor motion. The first suggestion is to create a PSD file of your white titles in Photoshop - any version. If you are cutting in 1920x1080 then you'd multiply the 1080 by say 5. This will give you a canvas in Photoshop of 1920x5400. Make the background black and type your text. Export as a PNG file. Import into FCP and use basic motion, one keyframe at the start and one at the end. This will give you a super smooth motion that will not have any hints of compression artifacts. This is also how most independent film producers deliver their final credit sequences. To your second question: I'm not sure what you are asking but there are plenty of functions in DVDSP that can give you a first play option and background play. The easiest way for background play is just to drag and hold your M2V into the background of the template. A question box will come up asking you if you want to set it to play in the background. As for first play, just select your M2V and AC3 track, right click on it in the map window and select "first play" then add the post command (also in map) to your Menu. Hope this helps, -C

June 14th, 2009, 04:03 PM	#4
Mike Petrucco Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Syracuse, NY Posts: 98	I think I was half asleep when I posted these questions. Setting up a first play is not actually my issue, that is straightforward. I don't even know why I put that in there other than sleep deprivation. What I am trying to establish is a good way to get my progressive 1080p30 projects out on SD DVD 16:9 apsect ratio, without creating two sets of lower thirds, titles, etc. So in essence, I am hoping to find the right way to downconvert these assets without redoing them.

June 14th, 2009, 08:52 PM	#5
Mike Petrucco Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Syracuse, NY Posts: 98	I just did a test and recreated part of moving text sequence in Motion, but also used a NTSC DV preset and the differnce was huge over what I got out of Livetype. It's crystal clear for all but one word I sent across the screen fairly fast. That one had some motion artifacts, but the slower ones did not. That will get me where I need to go on this, but out of curiosity, I may redo a portion in Livetype at a NTSC DV project setting and see how that compares. I suspect that Motion will still do a nicer job with though.