Two forums? at DVinfo.net

Bill Davis · July 24th, 2011, 03:19 PM

I don't want to abridge anyone's right to bitch and moan all the like about FCP-X or any other piece of editing software.

But I am really concerned that a LOT of valuable insight into this brand new program is getting BURRIED under all the "sturm and drang" in this forum.

Case in point ... in the "Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X thread, there's a lot of back and forth both supporting and complaining - and then, late in the thread after someone expresses their very rational concern about the perceived lack of a way to do something - a couple of guys pop up and explain EXACTLY how to achieve that in the new interface.

I'm really worried that this valuable learning is getting burried in ambiguous and non-intuitive "I love it/Ihate it" threads.

If this board is going to attract people to learn about FCP-X - as it does about many other editing programs - I think it would be best to have separate places where those who wish to argue about it's utilitiy, relevence, or suitibility can do so freely. and another place where those who want to simply find answers on how to do things with it can concentrate on that.

Maybe FCP-X Users. And FCP-X BattleDrome! ; )

Chris? Moderators? Anyone else want to weigh in on this?

Evan Lloyd · July 24th, 2011, 05:41 PM

I agree. Or keep the "X is crap" posts located in the FCP 7 forum. We do need a productive FCPX forum that does not attract only X haters.

Pete Bauer · July 24th, 2011, 06:37 PM

We'll see what Chris wants to do, but I'm sure without reading this post he can predict my opinion because he knows I'm a lumper rather than a splitter. At this writing, the whole FCP X forum has only 80 threads, with merely 16, including this one, that have been active within the past week. This forum was already split off FCS, and generally forum volume declines after the first couple months, so IMO making another split isn't worth doing.

I think a better solution is to simply start writing the type of constructive, creative and/or educational threads you do want to see. Whatever is keeping people interested is what will stay near the top of the forum and the New Posts list.

Philip Lipetz · July 25th, 2011, 12:20 PM

Perhaps it is not lack of Interest but the fact that you subjected to personal attack the moment you say you are using FCPX. it is almsot as if you are stripped of insignia and drummed out of the club.

It is one of the worst mob reigns of terror that I have seen in the video community. No opposing voice is tolerated.

I have to say that it is better here than on another famous forum, but there is still the same suppression.

People are afraid to post, reputation is everything in a small professional community.

Shaun Roemich · July 25th, 2011, 12:55 PM

Philip and Evan, please ALSO remember there are barbs being thrown at those of us that have chosen not to adopt FCPX and some very personal attacks against me were removed by a Moderator just yesterday. Both sides are guilty here...

Daniel Ridicki · July 27th, 2011, 01:50 AM

It is truth that discussions regarding this software are often too emotional, too much personal. FCP X is good tool for the market it is targeting. FCP was good tool for another market. Some members of these two markets overlaps, they can do either way. But some find the X unacceptable. Often times it has been said here that had FCP X been introduced as a new software, and FCP support and further development and existence has been upheld, there would be no problem: some would adopt the X, some would stay with FCP. To my mind, this is the reason behind this forum bashing.
Personally, I have read here many times how one should be ready to adopt new approach to editing to some extent demanded by FCP X. This has been repeated as it was the Holly Scripture. And in all modesty I ask: why? Why should I have to change the way I am working for last 35 years? I edit on FCP, Avid and PP. Honestly, they are more or less the same, and are definitely developed on the same approach to editing. Now, someone steps in, saying: this is the future of industry, you have to adopt. I have no problem with anyone adopting it, I personally will not. I see no gain. And it is not because I am lazy old timer. I can adopt any new software very fast. I tried FCP X, was not impressed, decided to continue with Avid and Premiere.
So, as very regular reader (not so much participant) of this forum, I would certainly support the motion to free this forum from bashing the FCP X, and leave the floor to the ones who love it and are using it, to exchange lessons learned and further their skills by the way of communicating with the fellow editors. If you do not like it (as I am not) just let it go, what is the point of bashing and bitching around? Switch to Avid or PP or adopt FCP X. Apple will not change its policy, no point to get stuck in time here. Move on.

July 24th, 2011, 03:19 PM	#1
Bill Davis Trustee Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Scottsdale, AZ 85260 Posts: 1,538	Two forums? I don't want to abridge anyone's right to bitch and moan all the like about FCP-X or any other piece of editing software. But I am really concerned that a LOT of valuable insight into this brand new program is getting BURRIED under all the "sturm and drang" in this forum. Case in point ... in the "Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X thread, there's a lot of back and forth both supporting and complaining - and then, late in the thread after someone expresses their very rational concern about the perceived lack of a way to do something - a couple of guys pop up and explain EXACTLY how to achieve that in the new interface. I'm really worried that this valuable learning is getting burried in ambiguous and non-intuitive "I love it/Ihate it" threads. If this board is going to attract people to learn about FCP-X - as it does about many other editing programs - I think it would be best to have separate places where those who wish to argue about it's utilitiy, relevence, or suitibility can do so freely. and another place where those who want to simply find answers on how to do things with it can concentrate on that. Maybe FCP-X Users. And FCP-X BattleDrome! ; ) Chris? Moderators? Anyone else want to weigh in on this? __________________ Classroom editing instructor? Check out www.starteditingnow.com Turnkey editor training content including licensed training footage for classroom use.

July 24th, 2011, 05:41 PM	#2
Evan Lloyd Regular Crew Join Date: May 2008 Location: Fresno Posts: 111	Re: Two forums? I agree. Or keep the "X is crap" posts located in the FCP 7 forum. We do need a productive FCPX forum that does not attract only X haters.

July 24th, 2011, 06:37 PM	#3
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	Re: Two forums? We'll see what Chris wants to do, but I'm sure without reading this post he can predict my opinion because he knows I'm a lumper rather than a splitter. At this writing, the whole FCP X forum has only 80 threads, with merely 16, including this one, that have been active within the past week. This forum was already split off FCS, and generally forum volume declines after the first couple months, so IMO making another split isn't worth doing. I think a better solution is to simply start writing the type of constructive, creative and/or educational threads you do want to see. Whatever is keeping people interested is what will stay near the top of the forum and the New Posts list. __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

July 25th, 2011, 12:20 PM	#4
Philip Lipetz Major Player Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 273	Re: Two forums? Perhaps it is not lack of Interest but the fact that you subjected to personal attack the moment you say you are using FCPX. it is almsot as if you are stripped of insignia and drummed out of the club. It is one of the worst mob reigns of terror that I have seen in the video community. No opposing voice is tolerated. I have to say that it is better here than on another famous forum, but there is still the same suppression. People are afraid to post, reputation is everything in a small professional community. Last edited by Philip Lipetz; July 25th, 2011 at 01:51 PM.

July 25th, 2011, 12:55 PM	#5
Shaun Roemich Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada Posts: 4,088	Re: Two forums? Philip and Evan, please ALSO remember there are barbs being thrown at those of us that have chosen not to adopt FCPX and some very personal attacks against me were removed by a Moderator just yesterday. Both sides are guilty here... __________________ Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/

July 27th, 2011, 01:50 AM	#6
Daniel Ridicki Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Zagreb, Croatia Posts: 124	Re: Two forums? It is truth that discussions regarding this software are often too emotional, too much personal. FCP X is good tool for the market it is targeting. FCP was good tool for another market. Some members of these two markets overlaps, they can do either way. But some find the X unacceptable. Often times it has been said here that had FCP X been introduced as a new software, and FCP support and further development and existence has been upheld, there would be no problem: some would adopt the X, some would stay with FCP. To my mind, this is the reason behind this forum bashing. Personally, I have read here many times how one should be ready to adopt new approach to editing to some extent demanded by FCP X. This has been repeated as it was the Holly Scripture. And in all modesty I ask: why? Why should I have to change the way I am working for last 35 years? I edit on FCP, Avid and PP. Honestly, they are more or less the same, and are definitely developed on the same approach to editing. Now, someone steps in, saying: this is the future of industry, you have to adopt. I have no problem with anyone adopting it, I personally will not. I see no gain. And it is not because I am lazy old timer. I can adopt any new software very fast. I tried FCP X, was not impressed, decided to continue with Avid and Premiere. So, as very regular reader (not so much participant) of this forum, I would certainly support the motion to free this forum from bashing the FCP X, and leave the floor to the ones who love it and are using it, to exchange lessons learned and further their skills by the way of communicating with the fellow editors. If you do not like it (as I am not) just let it go, what is the point of bashing and bitching around? Switch to Avid or PP or adopt FCP X. Apple will not change its policy, no point to get stuck in time here. Move on.