dual layer compatibility? at DVinfo.net

Anthony Mooney · August 12th, 2006, 09:38 PM

Hello everybody

I still deliver my work to clients with one layer DVD 4.7 g.
Does any one delivers dual layer? Do these disck have the same compatibility rate in domestic DVD-players like the proven one layer DVD-R/+R?

Thanks in advance.
Anthony

Zach Mull · August 16th, 2006, 04:02 PM

My experience with writable double layer discs has been horrible. I bought a reputable burner and reputable media, and the compatibility was still horrible. I think one out of 5 discs I burned over the time I tried it would play without problems, and maybe 1 of 3 would play with serious delays. On some projects, I could never burn a successful copy.

My own experience and the research I did later led me to abandon writable double layer. My work projects all end up replicated anyway, so I just make low-quality encodes to preview the discs as single layer. But I understand that wouldn't be a good solution for you because you're talking about final delivery. My advice is, if you can stick with single layer, do so because the writable double layer technology just isn't that good.

Anthony Mooney · August 16th, 2006, 08:01 PM

Thank you Zach

Oh, man. I suposse thats why I don't hear much but double layer! Thanks, that was very useful.

Regards
Anthony

Nick Weeks · August 16th, 2006, 08:09 PM

Every dual-layer I've burned, both on my PC and Mac, with different media has only worked on my Sony DVD player that says "DVD+R DL" in the spec sheet. I haven't gotten it to work on any other player yet (besides PC DVD-ROMS, most will play them ok)

Every now-and-then when it comes time to switch layers on my Sony, the movie just stops playing, and I have to start it over... where of course it starts from the beginning again.

So, I agree... stay away until they can come out with something more reliable/compatiable

Zach Mull · August 16th, 2006, 11:17 PM

Anthony, did you see this thread: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=72482? I noticed it just after yours. David Tames has apparently put together a system reliable enough to make replication masters on DL discs. He used a Plextor DVD writer, and I've read before that Plextors are top-of-the-line drives. Perhaps that would make a difference.

Anthony Mooney · August 16th, 2006, 11:29 PM

Thanks Zach

I will try to burn one and then replicate on my Lacie one to five copier. If I have good results I will let you know.

Thanks again.

Just makes me wonder,,why they sell the DL drives, and why we buy them:)

Scott Jaco · August 26th, 2006, 03:09 PM

Strange that you are having soo many issues.

I did 2 seminars that were 3 hrs long, so I had to use DL DVD's.

I burned them w/ DVD Studio Pro 4.0. The only trick was picking a correct layer break point. It's best to choose the break point at around 1hr 25min or so.

I burned 8 DL DVD's in total and they all worked. I tested them all on 3 different consumer DVD players and they read both layers without problems.

This was all done using the Superdrive on my Imac.

p.s. I did have an issue where a disk crashed during the burning process. I had to chuck it, however, any DVD that passed the burning stage with the message "Format Complete" worked just fine.

Scott

Gints Klimanis · August 31st, 2006, 01:29 AM

I just started writing double layer DVD+R discs today. With a BenQ DW1655, I had no trouble using either Nero 7.5 or 1ClickDVDCopy (not Pro edition) to write 6-8 GByte files to a DVD video. They played with no trouble on an old Vialta DVD player as well as a Sony NC-6655P DVD Player. I'm not sure where the burning programs placed the split points, but I'm 5 for 5 right now.
The BenQ sets the booktype to DVD-ROM, so I don't know if that has anything to do with it. I'm using Verbatim 2.4x DVD+R disks that were advertised as going to 8x, but only burned at 2.4x .

I'm still looking for a faster DVD+RW dual layer for when I have to mess around with my own material. Anyone seen such a disk ? It's easliy worth it to me in the $10-15 price range.

Nick Weeks · August 31st, 2006, 06:32 AM

The ones I had trouble were the same discs I believe, it was Verbatim 8x, mine only burned at 4x and had a lot of trouble with layer switching. I think it's the media... I haven't tried since, but it did the same thing burned from eithe rmy PC or Mac.

I haven't even seen any DVD+RW dual layers... Where are you finding these?

Gints Klimanis · August 31st, 2006, 06:43 AM

As you've already seen, the Verbatim "8x" DVD+R Dual Layer are labeled as 2.4x on the package, with "up to 8x speed with compatible high speed DVD+R DL drives". I've been misled by the shop4tech.com listing which states these disks are 8x. My BenQ DW1655 is listed as "8X +R DL ", so I don't know why this happens. I just updated the firmware to the latest.

DVD burning is just plain ol weird. The manufacturers just aren't on top of firmware upgrades when they update the specs of their devices. If the devices themselves are different within a model#, then they should change the model#.

Gints Klimanis · August 31st, 2006, 06:45 AM

Oh, I haven't found any rewritable dual layer disks in either +RW or -RW.
I would prefer to have +RW as my BenQ DW1655 sets the booktype to DVD-ROM. If you find any of these disks, please tell.

Emre Safak · August 31st, 2006, 06:54 AM

I do not think it is so much the hardware that is causing the problem as the media itself. Simply put, the manufacturers have not been able to make reliable media yet. The best currently out there is made by Verbatim. I would stick to burning at 2.4x or 4x if you want decent quality.

Nick Weeks · August 31st, 2006, 10:29 AM

I think if the same holds true that DVD-R is more compatiable than DVD+R, once they make a DVD-R dual-layer it might work better

Gints Klimanis · September 1st, 2006, 04:15 PM

>I think if the same holds true that DVD-R is more compatiable than DVD+R, >once they make a DVD-R dual-layer it might work better

DVD+R Dual layer works awesome for me.

As for DVD-R being more compatible than DVD-R, I think that needs to be revised. We're largely quoting a study made over two years ago that there was a modest difference in compatibility. There were definitely some players out there that would reject DVD-RWs while playing DVD-Rs, which I encountered during my random DVD tests at Good Guys and Circuit City.

With DVD+R's booktype setting capability to DVD-ROM, I think the tables have turned in favor of DVD+R .

August 12th, 2006, 09:38 PM	#1
Anthony Mooney Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Long Branch NJ Posts: 69	dual layer compatibility? Hello everybody I still deliver my work to clients with one layer DVD 4.7 g. Does any one delivers dual layer? Do these disck have the same compatibility rate in domestic DVD-players like the proven one layer DVD-R/+R? Thanks in advance. Anthony

August 16th, 2006, 08:01 PM	#3
Anthony Mooney Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Long Branch NJ Posts: 69	Thank you Thank you Zach Oh, man. I suposse thats why I don't hear much but double layer! Thanks, that was very useful. Regards Anthony

August 31st, 2006, 01:29 AM	#8
Gints Klimanis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,222	No problems yet. I just started writing double layer DVD+R discs today. With a BenQ DW1655, I had no trouble using either Nero 7.5 or 1ClickDVDCopy (not Pro edition) to write 6-8 GByte files to a DVD video. They played with no trouble on an old Vialta DVD player as well as a Sony NC-6655P DVD Player. I'm not sure where the burning programs placed the split points, but I'm 5 for 5 right now. The BenQ sets the booktype to DVD-ROM, so I don't know if that has anything to do with it. I'm using Verbatim 2.4x DVD+R disks that were advertised as going to 8x, but only burned at 2.4x . I'm still looking for a faster DVD+RW dual layer for when I have to mess around with my own material. Anyone seen such a disk ? It's easliy worth it to me in the $10-15 price range.

August 31st, 2006, 06:45 AM	#11
Gints Klimanis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,222	DVD rewritable dual layer Oh, I haven't found any rewritable dual layer disks in either +RW or -RW. I would prefer to have +RW as my BenQ DW1655 sets the booktype to DVD-ROM. If you find any of these disks, please tell.

August 16th, 2006, 04:02 PM	#2
Zach Mull Major Player Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 273	My experience with writable double layer discs has been horrible. I bought a reputable burner and reputable media, and the compatibility was still horrible. I think one out of 5 discs I burned over the time I tried it would play without problems, and maybe 1 of 3 would play with serious delays. On some projects, I could never burn a successful copy. My own experience and the research I did later led me to abandon writable double layer. My work projects all end up replicated anyway, so I just make low-quality encodes to preview the discs as single layer. But I understand that wouldn't be a good solution for you because you're talking about final delivery. My advice is, if you can stick with single layer, do so because the writable double layer technology just isn't that good.

August 16th, 2006, 08:09 PM	#4
Nick Weeks Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Birmingham, AL USA Posts: 722	Every dual-layer I've burned, both on my PC and Mac, with different media has only worked on my Sony DVD player that says "DVD+R DL" in the spec sheet. I haven't gotten it to work on any other player yet (besides PC DVD-ROMS, most will play them ok) Every now-and-then when it comes time to switch layers on my Sony, the movie just stops playing, and I have to start it over... where of course it starts from the beginning again. So, I agree... stay away until they can come out with something more reliable/compatiable

August 16th, 2006, 11:17 PM	#5
Zach Mull Major Player Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 273	Anthony, did you see this thread: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=72482? I noticed it just after yours. David Tames has apparently put together a system reliable enough to make replication masters on DL discs. He used a Plextor DVD writer, and I've read before that Plextors are top-of-the-line drives. Perhaps that would make a difference.

August 16th, 2006, 11:29 PM	#6
Anthony Mooney Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Long Branch NJ Posts: 69	Thanks Zach I will try to burn one and then replicate on my Lacie one to five copier. If I have good results I will let you know. Thanks again. Just makes me wonder,,why they sell the DL drives, and why we buy them:)

August 26th, 2006, 03:09 PM	#7
Scott Jaco Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Sherman Oaks, CA Posts: 471	Strange that you are having soo many issues. I did 2 seminars that were 3 hrs long, so I had to use DL DVD's. I burned them w/ DVD Studio Pro 4.0. The only trick was picking a correct layer break point. It's best to choose the break point at around 1hr 25min or so. I burned 8 DL DVD's in total and they all worked. I tested them all on 3 different consumer DVD players and they read both layers without problems. This was all done using the Superdrive on my Imac. p.s. I did have an issue where a disk crashed during the burning process. I had to chuck it, however, any DVD that passed the burning stage with the message "Format Complete" worked just fine. Scott

August 31st, 2006, 06:32 AM	#9
Nick Weeks Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Birmingham, AL USA Posts: 722	The ones I had trouble were the same discs I believe, it was Verbatim 8x, mine only burned at 4x and had a lot of trouble with layer switching. I think it's the media... I haven't tried since, but it did the same thing burned from eithe rmy PC or Mac. I haven't even seen any DVD+RW dual layers... Where are you finding these?

August 31st, 2006, 06:43 AM	#10
Gints Klimanis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,222	As you've already seen, the Verbatim "8x" DVD+R Dual Layer are labeled as 2.4x on the package, with "up to 8x speed with compatible high speed DVD+R DL drives". I've been misled by the shop4tech.com listing which states these disks are 8x. My BenQ DW1655 is listed as "8X +R DL ", so I don't know why this happens. I just updated the firmware to the latest. DVD burning is just plain ol weird. The manufacturers just aren't on top of firmware upgrades when they update the specs of their devices. If the devices themselves are different within a model#, then they should change the model#.

August 31st, 2006, 06:54 AM	#12
Emre Safak Trustee Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Brookline, MA Posts: 1,447	I do not think it is so much the hardware that is causing the problem as the media itself. Simply put, the manufacturers have not been able to make reliable media yet. The best currently out there is made by Verbatim. I would stick to burning at 2.4x or 4x if you want decent quality.

August 31st, 2006, 10:29 AM	#13
Nick Weeks Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Birmingham, AL USA Posts: 722	I think if the same holds true that DVD-R is more compatiable than DVD+R, once they make a DVD-R dual-layer it might work better

September 1st, 2006, 04:15 PM	#14
Gints Klimanis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,222	>I think if the same holds true that DVD-R is more compatiable than DVD+R, >once they make a DVD-R dual-layer it might work better DVD+R Dual layer works awesome for me. As for DVD-R being more compatible than DVD-R, I think that needs to be revised. We're largely quoting a study made over two years ago that there was a modest difference in compatibility. There were definitely some players out there that would reject DVD-RWs while playing DVD-Rs, which I encountered during my random DVD tests at Good Guys and Circuit City. With DVD+R's booktype setting capability to DVD-ROM, I think the tables have turned in favor of DVD+R .