DVC16 - Oranges are Oranges

Clint Harmon · May 6th, 2009, 06:28 PM

This being my first entry into one of the challenges, I chose to aim high in my first outing. Oranges are Oranges was actually the third story I came up with for this project. I actually started the writing process with the initial idea of doing a split screen movie. Although in most cases this is never a good idea, I went with it in attempts to stand out and test my skill. I later learned that it was more of a test for my computer to render dual AVCHD files simultaneously. By the way, did not turn out well. You can notice jumps in several clips from rendering errors. Boring story short, I had to chop video into 10 sec clips and export individually to then reimport and render as a whole.

Many original locations canceled that resulted in many rewrites. Originally going to be a completely silent movie, but the lack of key locations to tell the story voice overs where written in.

I am currently editing an outtake reel which I almost thought to enter it into the competition. All footage was captured using Panasonic HDC-HS100s and Azden smx-10 and lavaliers. Foley work was done with the shotguns (smx-10).

I will give more incite as time prevails but until then, enjoy Oranges are Oranges

YouTube - Oranges are Oranges

Oranges are Oranges on Vimeo

Chris Barcellos · May 6th, 2009, 06:56 PM

Split screen affects are neat. Imagery is great. Had a 24 type feel to it as a result. I got to say though, I had a hard time following the story line-- but that may just be me...

Very nice first entry !

Chris Swanberg · May 6th, 2009, 07:42 PM

The technical side of the house was great. I'm anxious to know more about your split screen adventures... I laughed and wondered how many takes it took for "the over the shoulder pop bottle throw" to actually land in the garbage can?

Your edit cuts were wonderful and the imagery had some truly AWWWsome moments.

VO worked well and was well done as was the ADR.

Like Chris B... I admit to a struggle with the story line. Not that I need or want everything spelled out.... and I plan to review it a few times to see what I pick up... although on a gut level I think I may have it already. Maybe that defines a good film in a way.

I think you can teach us all a lot. A very enjoyable film.... maybe in a disturbing sort of way I have yet to decipher. Well done, I look forward to more.

Chris S.

Robert Martens · May 6th, 2009, 08:32 PM

Oof. Ten second clips, rebuilding the film piece by piece, I feel your pain.

The split screen business was great, especially the shots where both actors are crossing paths. Beautiful sky backdrop when the delivery guy first meets with his boss, did you have to wait long for that?

I'm going to be a broken record and reiterate that the story was a bit lost on me. A hitman who delivers oranges as little reminders that someone's about to get whacked? Somebody who uses oranges to take people out? I'm running as many possibilities through my head as I can, but I can't seem to get any of them to fit quite perfectly.

Regardless, however, the water bottle in the garbage can and the last sequence make up for all of that. Seeing a guy get beaned with an orange at twenty yards, I could care less about a story. Hell of a first entry, I can't wait to see what you come up with in the future!

Lorinda Norton · May 6th, 2009, 10:14 PM

What an ambitious film! Lots of work involved, and I'm sorry it had to be such a PITA at the end. (Hey, you called it that in the credits, right?) :)

I got the impression that the bad guy who got fired was the same one who messed up the star pitcher's arm. How the pitcher would know that at the end and take him down with the very orange he stole from him is beyond me, though. But I had to take a stab at it...

At any rate, you packed a lot into the time you had and put in some wonderful gags for us in the process. The bottle in the trash has been mentioned, and I smiled at him tossing the orange so high that he could vault the wall, roll, and take time to remind us that the orange was coming back down--right into his hand. Cool.

Nicely done, Clint!

Clint Harmon · May 6th, 2009, 11:06 PM

as I am about to pass out in my seat from exhaustion, I happened to edit a piece together of my attempts at throwing in the bottle. Did everyone notice that it was a bottle of orange drink that came out of a water machine? Follows the theme of working hard and getting an unexpected result.

orange throw outtake on Vimeo

Lorinda Norton · May 6th, 2009, 11:23 PM

Yep, I did notice the orange drink. Clever.

Your outtake video is hilarious--I laughed out loud at take 3. Even with all the cussing I think you have an incredible amount of patience.

Thanks for piecing this together for our entertainment. Now get some sleep! :)

Chris Barcellos · May 7th, 2009, 01:03 AM

Loved those out takes.. I was actually thinking you did that shot with split screen magic. This was the real thing...

Jeremy Doyle · May 7th, 2009, 12:16 PM

I liked the split screen editing. It's particularly fun one the characters cross paths and were the boxes change shape to focus the viewers attention. Did storyboard before the shoot or did you just figure it out in post?

I too was lost a little in the story, but figured the guy was who hurt him as a youth. It's fun to watch though.

Dick Mays · May 7th, 2009, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Barcellos

Loved those out takes.. I was actually thinking you did that shot with split screen magic. This was the real thing...

Yeah, me too. I thought it was photoshop magic, putting the can where the bottle landed. But it was fun watching your WIN when you finally nailed it. The other stunt, leaping over the wall, looked dangerous. I noticed in your film, you edited it together in such a way that we see him come over the wall, but not the entire jump. I'm thinking there is a way to plan your shoot to get incredibly realistic action without jeapordizing the actors. There probably is a way to do this, but when you are rushed for time, I just ask the actor to "really slap that girl" just to make sure it comes out realistic. ;)

I really liked the split screen stuff at the top, but it seemed a bit much when it continued in the story, and I didn't know which screen to watch and felt like I was missing something. That may be why several of us had difficulty with the story. But the urgency, and the great camera work made it very watchable. Love to see you do some more DVC entries and watch how you evolve as a director.

Keith Heyward · May 7th, 2009, 12:35 PM

I really liked the split screen. It looked very slick and professional. My only comment would be that I wouldn't ever overlap the panels. Most of the time you had them very well spaced so that the composition looked neat and thought out. This made the times when the two panels overlapped or didn't really have a direction more obvious.

The outtakes are HILARIOUS. Nice work overall!

Joseph Tran · May 7th, 2009, 02:57 PM

A great first entry, Clint! Some sweet editing skills you showed there. And yes, I noticed you put PITA CS4, lol. I used that for DVC14, returned it right after, and immediately went back to CS3.

I think a big part of this challege is to overcome the obstacles we encounter, all in such a short amount of time. You definitely stepped up to the plate with your rewrites and rerendering, and never gave up. You should be applauded for that, alone!

This story was quite an undertaking, for sure. A lot of people already mentioned the story was hard to follow, and I think it stems from the confusion of who these characters are. What are they doing? Why do they do what they do? Tell me if you agree with this or not, but I believe that the audience needs to latch onto and make some sort of connection with a character. At the start, you introduce one guy with the voice over, but perhaps you introduced the other guy (in the gray) too soon. We never fully figure out who these guys are and never connect with either of them. Consequently, we spend the remainder of the film figuring out who these guys are instead of getting into the storyline.

It's a great story, regardless. Perhaps you can give more time, individually, to establishing the two characters at the start of the piece? Maybe not introduce the split screen til a little further in? In "24", before they start the split screen, they always give each character they're establishing their own shot.

Something to think about. Great to see you here. Hope to see more of your projects in the near future!

Mike Horrigan · May 7th, 2009, 05:44 PM

Great editing.

I thought the guy remarking about his injury aloud was a little much. Just showing him rubbing his shoulder followed by the flashback would have been plenty.

I felt that you may have tried to tell a little too much within the allotted time. Either that or I just didn't get some of it.

I did like it though and it held my attention. Nice work.

Mike

Clint Harmon · May 8th, 2009, 07:30 AM

The biggest error in this project was not having it screened by anyone now already knowing the script. I spent too much time editing (kinda put myself in that situation) and didn't realize the complexities. Let me try and help with the story.

Yes the first guy (in red) is delivering oranges. But if you payed really close attention to the last clip on the flashback you will see money in the bag with the oranges. In addition the title and when this character says "oranges are oranges" is a metaphore or "money is money." I was going to have a clip of the bag of money and the character putting the oranges on top, but I thought it was too obvious. So basically we think he is a nice guy delivering oranges but in reality hes a lacky for the mob boss and delivering money and possible drugs.

Originally I was to have this character reminisce of this "hit" he did at the same time the other character was thinking about the injury to time them together in the flashback. But since I used someone that has never been in front of a camera, and having to rewrite for a change in location I did not get to establish this. After the flash back, planned was for police to show up and go after the mob boss and this character. My police/fbi agents were a no show, and improvised to have the boss just call a hit on him (not unheard of).

The other character (in grey) is an ex baseball player that is now surviving the only way he knows how. As he goes through the movie he is only stealing petty items and never doing anything too wrong. But I was hoping the audience to grow a little dislike or distrust with this character. Which I was hoping for everyone to then associate themselves with the original character in red. The scene where this character steals the tip off the table and goes into his wallet, we see a picture of his family. This is where he takes off running because he has to meet his exwife and son at the baseball field so he can play ball with him. There was going to be a confrontation where the exwife was giving the guy a hard time for being late. And the boy was going to ask the dad the throw his special pitch. That was the original trigger for the flashback. Unfortunately they too where unable to act, but I was able to film the boy playing baseball. And filmed reactions to the boy playing baseball in the middle of the day when no one was there. Sadly I was could not tie him any better to the boy.

Near the end when the guy in red runs into the other guy, we go back to full screen and the guy in grey throws the orange. Again there were supposed to be cops/fbi agents chasing but I used the excuse that he just ran into him and the guy in grey cant just let that happen. Perhaps I could have had the guy in red be a lot more aggressive in the collision.

Now that you know the story the question I have for you is what is the meaning of the ending during the credits?

Clint Harmon · May 8th, 2009, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith Heyward

I really liked the split screen. It looked very slick and professional. My only comment would be that I wouldn't ever overlap the panels. Most of the time you had them very well spaced so that the composition looked neat and thought out. This made the times when the two panels overlapped or didn't really have a direction more obvious.

The outtakes are HILARIOUS. Nice work overall!

Aggreed. The overlaps were a mixture of 2 things, lack of time, and trying to do too much is limited screen size.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph Tran

A great first entry, Clint! Some sweet editing skills you showed there. And yes, I noticed you put PITA CS4, lol. I used that for DVC14, returned it right after, and immediately went back to CS3.

I think a big part of this challege is to overcome the obstacles we encounter, all in such a short amount of time. You definitely stepped up to the plate with your rewrites and rerendering, and never gave up. You should be applauded for that, alone!

This story was quite an undertaking, for sure. A lot of people already mentioned the story was hard to follow, and I think it stems from the confusion of who these characters are. What are they doing? Why do they do what they do? Tell me if you agree with this or not, but I believe that the audience needs to latch onto and make some sort of connection with a character. At the start, you introduce one guy with the voice over, but perhaps you introduced the other guy (in the gray) too soon. We never fully figure out who these guys are and never connect with either of them. Consequently, we spend the remainder of the film figuring out who these guys are instead of getting into the storyline.

It's a great story, regardless. Perhaps you can give more time, individually, to establishing the two characters at the start of the piece? Maybe not introduce the split screen til a little further in? In "24", before they start the split screen, they always give each character they're establishing their own shot.

Something to think about. Great to see you here. Hope to see more of your projects in the near future!

In my storyboard I had the first 30 seconds for just the guy in red. But had to cut because I was so over the 8 minute mark. To me it still made sense but I already knew the story. Lesson learned and need to screen it first.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Horrigan

Great editing.

I thought the guy remarking about his injury aloud was a little much. Just showing him rubbing his shoulder followed by the flashback would have been plenty.

I felt that you may have tried to tell a little too much within the allotted time. Either that or I just didn't get some of it.

I did like it though and it held my attention. Nice work.

Mike

Yeah it was a bit much. And yes I admit I did try to tell too much. When I signed up for this challenge I challenged myself to tell a 10minute story in 5.

May 6th, 2009, 06:28 PM	#1
Clint Harmon Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Port Charlotte, Florida Posts: 104	DVC16 - Oranges are Oranges - Clint Harmon This being my first entry into one of the challenges, I chose to aim high in my first outing. Oranges are Oranges was actually the third story I came up with for this project. I actually started the writing process with the initial idea of doing a split screen movie. Although in most cases this is never a good idea, I went with it in attempts to stand out and test my skill. I later learned that it was more of a test for my computer to render dual AVCHD files simultaneously. By the way, did not turn out well. You can notice jumps in several clips from rendering errors. Boring story short, I had to chop video into 10 sec clips and export individually to then reimport and render as a whole. Many original locations canceled that resulted in many rewrites. Originally going to be a completely silent movie, but the lack of key locations to tell the story voice overs where written in. I am currently editing an outtake reel which I almost thought to enter it into the competition. All footage was captured using Panasonic HDC-HS100s and Azden smx-10 and lavaliers. Foley work was done with the shotguns (smx-10). I will give more incite as time prevails but until then, enjoy Oranges are Oranges YouTube - Oranges are Oranges Oranges are Oranges on Vimeo

May 6th, 2009, 06:56 PM	#2
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	Split screen affects are neat. Imagery is great. Had a 24 type feel to it as a result. I got to say though, I had a hard time following the story line-- but that may just be me... Very nice first entry ! __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

May 6th, 2009, 10:14 PM	#5
Lorinda Norton Wrangler Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Southwest Idaho, USA Posts: 3,066	What an ambitious film! Lots of work involved, and I'm sorry it had to be such a PITA at the end. (Hey, you called it that in the credits, right?) :) I got the impression that the bad guy who got fired was the same one who messed up the star pitcher's arm. How the pitcher would know that at the end and take him down with the very orange he stole from him is beyond me, though. But I had to take a stab at it... At any rate, you packed a lot into the time you had and put in some wonderful gags for us in the process. The bottle in the trash has been mentioned, and I smiled at him tossing the orange so high that he could vault the wall, roll, and take time to remind us that the orange was coming back down--right into his hand. Cool. Nicely done, Clint! __________________ Lorinda

May 6th, 2009, 11:23 PM	#7
Lorinda Norton Wrangler Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Southwest Idaho, USA Posts: 3,066	Yep, I did notice the orange drink. Clever. Your outtake video is hilarious--I laughed out loud at take 3. Even with all the cussing I think you have an incredible amount of patience. Thanks for piecing this together for our entertainment. Now get some sleep! :) __________________ Lorinda

May 7th, 2009, 01:03 AM	#8
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	Loved those out takes.. I was actually thinking you did that shot with split screen magic. This was the real thing... __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

May 6th, 2009, 07:42 PM	#3
Chris Swanberg Major Player Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 904	The technical side of the house was great. I'm anxious to know more about your split screen adventures... I laughed and wondered how many takes it took for "the over the shoulder pop bottle throw" to actually land in the garbage can? Your edit cuts were wonderful and the imagery had some truly AWWWsome moments. VO worked well and was well done as was the ADR. Like Chris B... I admit to a struggle with the story line. Not that I need or want everything spelled out.... and I plan to review it a few times to see what I pick up... although on a gut level I think I may have it already. Maybe that defines a good film in a way. I think you can teach us all a lot. A very enjoyable film.... maybe in a disturbing sort of way I have yet to decipher. Well done, I look forward to more. Chris S.

May 6th, 2009, 08:32 PM	#4
Robert Martens Major Player Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Miller Place, NY Posts: 820	Oof. Ten second clips, rebuilding the film piece by piece, I feel your pain. The split screen business was great, especially the shots where both actors are crossing paths. Beautiful sky backdrop when the delivery guy first meets with his boss, did you have to wait long for that? I'm going to be a broken record and reiterate that the story was a bit lost on me. A hitman who delivers oranges as little reminders that someone's about to get whacked? Somebody who uses oranges to take people out? I'm running as many possibilities through my head as I can, but I can't seem to get any of them to fit quite perfectly. Regardless, however, the water bottle in the garbage can and the last sequence make up for all of that. Seeing a guy get beaned with an orange at twenty yards, I could care less about a story. Hell of a first entry, I can't wait to see what you come up with in the future!

May 6th, 2009, 11:06 PM	#6
Clint Harmon Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Port Charlotte, Florida Posts: 104	as I am about to pass out in my seat from exhaustion, I happened to edit a piece together of my attempts at throwing in the bottle. Did everyone notice that it was a bottle of orange drink that came out of a water machine? Follows the theme of working hard and getting an unexpected result. orange throw outtake on Vimeo

May 7th, 2009, 12:16 PM	#9
Jeremy Doyle Major Player Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Brainerd, MN Posts: 287	I liked the split screen editing. It's particularly fun one the characters cross paths and were the boxes change shape to focus the viewers attention. Did storyboard before the shoot or did you just figure it out in post? I too was lost a little in the story, but figured the guy was who hurt him as a youth. It's fun to watch though.

May 7th, 2009, 12:35 PM	#11
Keith Heyward Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Providence, RI Posts: 38	I really liked the split screen. It looked very slick and professional. My only comment would be that I wouldn't ever overlap the panels. Most of the time you had them very well spaced so that the composition looked neat and thought out. This made the times when the two panels overlapped or didn't really have a direction more obvious. The outtakes are HILARIOUS. Nice work overall!

May 7th, 2009, 02:57 PM	#12
Joseph Tran Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 177	A great first entry, Clint! Some sweet editing skills you showed there. And yes, I noticed you put PITA CS4, lol. I used that for DVC14, returned it right after, and immediately went back to CS3. I think a big part of this challege is to overcome the obstacles we encounter, all in such a short amount of time. You definitely stepped up to the plate with your rewrites and rerendering, and never gave up. You should be applauded for that, alone! This story was quite an undertaking, for sure. A lot of people already mentioned the story was hard to follow, and I think it stems from the confusion of who these characters are. What are they doing? Why do they do what they do? Tell me if you agree with this or not, but I believe that the audience needs to latch onto and make some sort of connection with a character. At the start, you introduce one guy with the voice over, but perhaps you introduced the other guy (in the gray) too soon. We never fully figure out who these guys are and never connect with either of them. Consequently, we spend the remainder of the film figuring out who these guys are instead of getting into the storyline. It's a great story, regardless. Perhaps you can give more time, individually, to establishing the two characters at the start of the piece? Maybe not introduce the split screen til a little further in? In "24", before they start the split screen, they always give each character they're establishing their own shot. Something to think about. Great to see you here. Hope to see more of your projects in the near future!

May 7th, 2009, 05:44 PM	#13
Mike Horrigan Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Ottawa Canada Posts: 755	Great editing. I thought the guy remarking about his injury aloud was a little much. Just showing him rubbing his shoulder followed by the flashback would have been plenty. I felt that you may have tried to tell a little too much within the allotted time. Either that or I just didn't get some of it. I did like it though and it held my attention. Nice work. Mike __________________ My short films... The Interview & Calls From The Führerbunker

May 8th, 2009, 07:30 AM	#14
Clint Harmon Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Port Charlotte, Florida Posts: 104	The biggest error in this project was not having it screened by anyone now already knowing the script. I spent too much time editing (kinda put myself in that situation) and didn't realize the complexities. Let me try and help with the story. Yes the first guy (in red) is delivering oranges. But if you payed really close attention to the last clip on the flashback you will see money in the bag with the oranges. In addition the title and when this character says "oranges are oranges" is a metaphore or "money is money." I was going to have a clip of the bag of money and the character putting the oranges on top, but I thought it was too obvious. So basically we think he is a nice guy delivering oranges but in reality hes a lacky for the mob boss and delivering money and possible drugs. Originally I was to have this character reminisce of this "hit" he did at the same time the other character was thinking about the injury to time them together in the flashback. But since I used someone that has never been in front of a camera, and having to rewrite for a change in location I did not get to establish this. After the flash back, planned was for police to show up and go after the mob boss and this character. My police/fbi agents were a no show, and improvised to have the boss just call a hit on him (not unheard of). The other character (in grey) is an ex baseball player that is now surviving the only way he knows how. As he goes through the movie he is only stealing petty items and never doing anything too wrong. But I was hoping the audience to grow a little dislike or distrust with this character. Which I was hoping for everyone to then associate themselves with the original character in red. The scene where this character steals the tip off the table and goes into his wallet, we see a picture of his family. This is where he takes off running because he has to meet his exwife and son at the baseball field so he can play ball with him. There was going to be a confrontation where the exwife was giving the guy a hard time for being late. And the boy was going to ask the dad the throw his special pitch. That was the original trigger for the flashback. Unfortunately they too where unable to act, but I was able to film the boy playing baseball. And filmed reactions to the boy playing baseball in the middle of the day when no one was there. Sadly I was could not tie him any better to the boy. Near the end when the guy in red runs into the other guy, we go back to full screen and the guy in grey throws the orange. Again there were supposed to be cops/fbi agents chasing but I used the excuse that he just ran into him and the guy in grey cant just let that happen. Perhaps I could have had the guy in red be a lot more aggressive in the collision. Now that you know the story the question I have for you is what is the meaning of the ending during the credits?