DVinfo interested in subforum about scriptwriting?

Brendan Marnell · November 14th, 2006, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Hocking

The more time I spend working with film and television, the more I realise that it's all about story, story, story! Having a whole lot of fancy and expensive toys, the latest version of some super-dooper NLE and a whole lot of cool visual effects just doesn't cut it. You need a good idea - a good story to tell. I would love a forum dedicated to the story side of moviemaking. I concider myself a techie - but I'm starting to realise that making movies is so much more than technology. Count me in!

To confirm that "good ideas" are made and not born, see Musk Ox series of short stories on Per Johan Naesje's website http://www.video-film.no/snutter/muskox5.html or see all 5 recent Musk Ox videos on the Under Water, Over Land thread on this Forum. Question: How much footage from how many hours shooting over how many weekends did he delete to put together these stories from nature ... and they are all non-verbal, not a word is said!

Glenn Ford was good at non-verbals, Spencer Tracey was even better because, when he wanted to mix the verbals with non-verbals, he could speak distinctly and his timing was keen ... gave great impact to his moves, his eyebrows were particularly eloquent when they were rarely used ...

Darrius Hodges · November 30th, 2006, 12:29 PM

I think this is a great idea I'm new to screen writing and I would love to have someone to talk to. Just the idea of creating a subforum for this is one of the reasons I like hanging out on this site. Keep up the good ideas guys you rock!

Brendan Marnell · November 30th, 2006, 06:22 PM

Darrius
I have no experience of screenwriting. I Googled "Screen Writers" and found:-

http://www.screenwriter.com/insider/news.html

They're at it professionally. Another link offered screenwriting courses and I'm sure you know how it goes.

What I have experience of is being around for 67 years and "observing human behaviour". That's no use of course unless I'm prepared to learn about behaviour and not take it for granted, like, So what's new?. And that's little use unless I'm prepared to examine my own behaviour too; I used to find that embarrsssing when I first suspected that my first and second opinions were not necessarily right. But I got used to that. The second surprise was to discover that while everybody talks a bit or a lot, most people don't say what they mean. Then I learned that some people did that deliberately and some did it carelessly and some did it by mistake. Then at age 45 or so I came across the phrase "hidden agenda". This may be old hat to you but I have found it increasingly useful for my imagination when practising "observing human behaviour" to keep in the front of my mind the idea/possibility that the speaker (or passer-by or check-out attendant or family member or whoever) has a hidden agenda in mind while saying something quite different. In story-telling (at which I have some experience) the story emerges as a good story only if the beginning does not give away the ending. The trap/difficulty here is that I may be clumsy or boring or in some way lose my audience while trying to hide the ending. That's when the term "editing" arises. I must practice editing. I must cut my script just right. It's not cutting it to the bone; it's getting it just tight enough that the listener wants to listen. This is a considerable intellectual challenge. Some people start very young practising this. (My grandson aged 26 months has a better command of english than I had at age 4 because his parents have consistently talked intelligently to him.) Many of us swagger along to the grave without ever becoming aware of it.

It should do no harm and may do you some good to sit in a public space now and again and practise ...

- discreetly observing 2 people in your view having a conservation
- visualise/imagine from their manners/behaviour/dress what their hidden agendas might be at that time, for 5 minutes
- turn away from them and jot down in a notebook what you think they might have been saying to each other (not the script, just the message/content)

It does not matter whether you get it right or wrong (and you've no way of checking, usually). What you do get out of this exercise, if you repeat it often enough, is practice and skill at imagining and visualising "hidden agendas" and practice and skill at editing your thoughts on paper as you become more critical of your writing. For variety, try visualising what's going through the mind of someone sitting on his/her own ... but do scribble it down or you miss out on the editing bit ... and you may sleep better at night after pushing your brain-power up a gear.

And if you think I must be joking that's ok by me but you've misread my hidden agenda. Good luck and let us know your findings.

Jesse Redman · December 1st, 2006, 04:02 PM

Brendan,

Great information and personal insight and the link you gave looks great.

What I believe that a new forum here would provide, that seems to be missing elsewhere, is a place to ask questions about the mechanics (and possibly art) or screenwriting from a peer group. Most of the other sites are informative but don't seem to have an interaction with peers to share knowledge, only a one way path of knowledge, from the site to the viewer.

Just like the other forums here, when I want some information about any subject where my experience is lacking, I could ask. Whether it is what tools to use, where else to go for specifics, or opinions on how to approach a specific task, a new forum would fill a gap that I think is not being met by other resources on the net.

Darrius Hodges · December 5th, 2006, 11:55 AM

Brendan thank you that's all I needed, but did you see my hidden agenda. If we did not create our little forum to discuss it I would never have found out how much of a master mind you are. Your name will be in my Oscar speech. Thank you.

Barry Gribble · December 5th, 2006, 12:40 PM

Brendan's suggestions on observations are great, thanks. They really help with understanding and creating character, and writing dialog.

There is a huge piece of screenwriting beyond that, however, that is about structure, development and plot. As much as we would like this to come from observations, there are also just a lot of tried and true techniques that work here. They are things that experience and exchanges of information and techniques can really help.

So Chris... how many votes do we need here?

Adam Bray · December 6th, 2006, 06:24 PM

I'd be interested in a screenwriting section.

Nathan Brendan Masters · December 20th, 2006, 09:59 AM

Yes, a DVI screenwriting section would be wonderful. How could it not fit in. Many people buying the 24p cameras particularly for the 24p are filmmakers. Even people using the Sony FX1 are making films. It's definitely something that should be done.

-Nate

Luiz Roberto Meira · January 2nd, 2007, 11:42 PM

I´m interested in share scriptwriting experiences as well.

Alessandro Machi · January 3rd, 2007, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Hocking

The more time I spend working with film and television, the more I realise that it's all about story, story, story! Having a whole lot of fancy and expensive toys, the latest version of some super-dooper NLE and a whole lot of cool visual effects just doesn't cut it. You need a good idea - a good story to tell. I would love a forum dedicated to the story side of moviemaking. I concider myself a techie - but I'm starting to realise that making movies is so much more than technology. Count me in!

What fuels the purchase of most DV gear? I would say it's work for hire, such as weddings, local corporate video, commercials, etc...

So if one actually wanted a script writing forum, it should actually be subdivided, perhaps into a Main forum heading such as....

The Business, and Art of Writing.......

Sub forum-1
Entertainment Screenwriting, (from short story to episodics to feature films)

Sub forum-2
Writing for a Client

One type of script writing forum is primarily about storytelling, the other is about collaborating with a client and their requirements.

Both would probably attract enough attention and be a success since this website is already very well attended.

As for the other writing websites thats have already been mentioned, it's quite possible that as these two writing sub-forums grow. other writing websites will be suggested as well for the really serious. These two new writing forums not only help regular DV members here, but hey act as a "feeder" for other writing websites as they get "recommended" by the forum members.

Nathan Brendan Masters · January 3rd, 2007, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alessandro Machi

What fuels the purchase of most DV gear? I would say it's work for hire, such as weddings, local corporate video, commercials, etc...

A lot of Filmmakers buy DV equipment and use it shoot work for hire (to finance those projects and general living). I do it and many others do too so what about people who're doing work for hire and finally decide to go shoot a movie? There's more crossover than many would like to either believe or admit.

-Nate

Alessandro Machi · January 13th, 2007, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan Brendan Masters

A lot of Filmmakers buy DV equipment and use it shoot work for hire (to finance those projects and general living). I do it and many others do too so what about people who're doing work for hire and finally decide to go shoot a movie? There's more crossover than many would like to either believe or admit.

-Nate

There can even be crossover in terms of shooting a movie or a scripted corporate video. Clients sometimes get confused over what needs to be shown visually and what can be easily explained and when it's necessary to do both.

Jesse Redman · May 6th, 2007, 04:50 PM

Chris,

Is this issue dead or is it a possibility?

Thanks,

Andrew McDowell · May 8th, 2007, 08:48 PM

I would be very interested.

this is about writing for dv. So basically members could discuss how to write for a no budget shoot. compromises that someone has made.etc

tips and tricks like the rest of dvinfo

Chris Hurd · May 10th, 2007, 04:48 AM

Thanks a bunch for the feedback fellows... and yes this is still under consideration.

November 30th, 2006, 12:29 PM	#32
Darrius Hodges Tourist Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: chicago IL Posts: 4	screening writing forum I think this is a great idea I'm new to screen writing and I would love to have someone to talk to. Just the idea of creating a subforum for this is one of the reasons I like hanging out on this site. Keep up the good ideas guys you rock!

December 1st, 2006, 04:02 PM	#34
Jesse Redman Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Cedar Park, Texas Posts: 182	Brendan, Great information and personal insight and the link you gave looks great. What I believe that a new forum here would provide, that seems to be missing elsewhere, is a place to ask questions about the mechanics (and possibly art) or screenwriting from a peer group. Most of the other sites are informative but don't seem to have an interaction with peers to share knowledge, only a one way path of knowledge, from the site to the viewer. Just like the other forums here, when I want some information about any subject where my experience is lacking, I could ask. Whether it is what tools to use, where else to go for specifics, or opinions on how to approach a specific task, a new forum would fill a gap that I think is not being met by other resources on the net. __________________ - Jesse XL2 - Vegas - DVDA - Sound Forge - Acid Pro - Cubase SX 3

December 5th, 2006, 11:55 AM	#35
Darrius Hodges Tourist Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: chicago IL Posts: 4	U R the greatest Brendan thank you that's all I needed, but did you see my hidden agenda. If we did not create our little forum to discuss it I would never have found out how much of a master mind you are. Your name will be in my Oscar speech. Thank you.

December 5th, 2006, 12:40 PM	#36
Barry Gribble Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 817	Brendan's suggestions on observations are great, thanks. They really help with understanding and creating character, and writing dialog. There is a huge piece of screenwriting beyond that, however, that is about structure, development and plot. As much as we would like this to come from observations, there are also just a lot of tried and true techniques that work here. They are things that experience and exchanges of information and techniques can really help. So Chris... how many votes do we need here? __________________ Barry Gribble Integral Arts, IMDB

May 6th, 2007, 04:50 PM	#43
Jesse Redman Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Cedar Park, Texas Posts: 182	Chris, Is this issue dead or is it a possibility? Thanks, __________________ - Jesse XL2 - Vegas - DVDA - Sound Forge - Acid Pro - Cubase SX 3

November 30th, 2006, 06:22 PM	#33
Brendan Marnell Major Player Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Dublin, Ireland Posts: 938	Darrius I have no experience of screenwriting. I Googled "Screen Writers" and found:- http://www.screenwriter.com/insider/news.html They're at it professionally. Another link offered screenwriting courses and I'm sure you know how it goes. What I have experience of is being around for 67 years and "observing human behaviour". That's no use of course unless I'm prepared to learn about behaviour and not take it for granted, like, So what's new?. And that's little use unless I'm prepared to examine my own behaviour too; I used to find that embarrsssing when I first suspected that my first and second opinions were not necessarily right. But I got used to that. The second surprise was to discover that while everybody talks a bit or a lot, most people don't say what they mean. Then I learned that some people did that deliberately and some did it carelessly and some did it by mistake. Then at age 45 or so I came across the phrase "hidden agenda". This may be old hat to you but I have found it increasingly useful for my imagination when practising "observing human behaviour" to keep in the front of my mind the idea/possibility that the speaker (or passer-by or check-out attendant or family member or whoever) has a hidden agenda in mind while saying something quite different. In story-telling (at which I have some experience) the story emerges as a good story only if the beginning does not give away the ending. The trap/difficulty here is that I may be clumsy or boring or in some way lose my audience while trying to hide the ending. That's when the term "editing" arises. I must practice editing. I must cut my script just right. It's not cutting it to the bone; it's getting it just tight enough that the listener wants to listen. This is a considerable intellectual challenge. Some people start very young practising this. (My grandson aged 26 months has a better command of english than I had at age 4 because his parents have consistently talked intelligently to him.) Many of us swagger along to the grave without ever becoming aware of it. It should do no harm and may do you some good to sit in a public space now and again and practise ... - discreetly observing 2 people in your view having a conservation - visualise/imagine from their manners/behaviour/dress what their hidden agendas might be at that time, for 5 minutes - turn away from them and jot down in a notebook what you think they might have been saying to each other (not the script, just the message/content) It does not matter whether you get it right or wrong (and you've no way of checking, usually). What you do get out of this exercise, if you repeat it often enough, is practice and skill at imagining and visualising "hidden agendas" and practice and skill at editing your thoughts on paper as you become more critical of your writing. For variety, try visualising what's going through the mind of someone sitting on his/her own ... but do scribble it down or you miss out on the editing bit ... and you may sleep better at night after pushing your brain-power up a gear. And if you think I must be joking that's ok by me but you've misread my hidden agenda. Good luck and let us know your findings.

December 6th, 2006, 06:24 PM	#37
Adam Bray Major Player Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Houston/Austin Posts: 394	I'd be interested in a screenwriting section.

December 20th, 2006, 09:59 AM	#38
Nathan Brendan Masters Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, Il. Posts: 85	Yes, a DVI screenwriting section would be wonderful. How could it not fit in. Many people buying the 24p cameras particularly for the 24p are filmmakers. Even people using the Sony FX1 are making films. It's definitely something that should be done. -Nate

January 2nd, 2007, 11:42 PM	#39
Luiz Roberto Meira Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Brazil Posts: 29	I´m interested in share scriptwriting experiences as well.

May 8th, 2007, 08:48 PM	#44
Andrew McDowell Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Toronto Canada Posts: 27	I would be very interested. this is about writing for dv. So basically members could discuss how to write for a no budget shoot. compromises that someone has made.etc tips and tricks like the rest of dvinfo __________________ XH-A1

May 10th, 2007, 04:48 AM	#45
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,369 Images: 513	Thanks a bunch for the feedback fellows... and yes this is still under consideration. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!