Laser-driven DLP televisions from Mitsubishi

[Ervin Farkas]

After announcing the first ever laser-based DLP television (projected for late 2007) back in April of this year, their 2007 year models are now shipping. I had the opportunity to watch one of them and all I have to say is one word: unbelievable! True 1080p (meaning 1080p all the way from input to the DMD chip - earlier models had to convert 1080p to 1080i and then back to 1080p in the digital circuitry) and a ton of picture-improving technologies are packed in the high-end models. 4D video noise reduction, PerfectColor, PerfecTint, ClearThought Easy Connect (the set will recognize via a microswitch a newly connected source and run the setup utility), are just a few of the improvements compared to last year's products.

Of course, they are running their sets off of a rare 1080p proprietary source... hopefully the emerging 1080p DVD players will measure up to that source (not by upconverting but delivering real 1080p video) so everyone can enjoy that incredible picture!

Disclaimer: I DO WORK for Mitsubishi Digital Electronics in factory service. I am posting this as pure news without any other intent.

[Dan Keaton]

This is very interesting.

Do they use multiple lasers, one for each color?

I assume that the laser or lasers are the light sources for the dlp chips.

[Ervin Farkas]

Howdy my Georgia neighbor (I'm further up north, in the north-east Metro area)...

Yes, three lasers will replace the current light source, the light bulb. This will reduce power consumprion, eliminate all the heat related issues, the color-separtion prism, the color wheel, and will considerably reduce the depth of rear-projection sets. It will also improve black level, since lasers can be easily turned off (as opposed to light bulbs).

Here's the link for the official announcement: http://www.mitsubishielectric.com/ne...ser%20HDTV.htm.

[Dan Keaton]

This sounds great.

Do you know the model numbers?

[Ervin Farkas]

Go to http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/ for the latest models (although not all of them are posted yet). This stuff just started shipping, so if you go back in a few days, probably all of the models will be there.

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Er... That's odd. I thought the laser model shown in April was a first-edition prototype and while it had stunning reds (actually too intense), nice greens and sucky blues, all three laser components exhibited "laser sparkles". According to the information presented at Mitsubishi's line show, the laser DLP model would not ship any earlier than late '07. But wait, you just mentioned the laser model and didn't actually say anything about them other than being announced. Talk about misleading... You should at least clarify and be honest that the currently shipping '07 models are still using the same 960x1080 wobulated DMD and a rotating color wheel - no lasers. Currently on the Mits site, there is only WD-xx731 series with the 57" and 65" models. One other thing I found truoubling over the new Mitsubishi offerings is the two 73" models... Neither one use the new 6-color wheel technology and apparently still use the same light engine design used in the WD-73x27 '05 models. These two models aren't listed on the site yet.

[Ervin Farkas]

Jeff,

There is absolutely nothing misleading in my post. I am talking about “announced models” and “shipping models”. Clearly, the announced models are prototypes, and I clearly said that they are projected to come out NEXT year. We both know that any given year’s models are coming out usually half a year earlier, so the 2007 models are shipping now, while the model coming out late 2007 will be probably the 2008 model year.

So here we go – for those reading too fast: the 2007 models (few in stores, most of them on trucks, shipping as we speak) are the “classic” DLP rear projection models with a bulb as light source. In the next generation DLP projected to hit the stores late 2007, this bulb will be replaced by lasers. I hope this is enough clarification.

On to the models shipping now – you’re wrong Jeff, in the 731 series the light engine is new, and the resolution is not 1080x960 but 1920x1080 (see http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/common/getfile.asp?uuid={D81FBA30-5421-47C8-B47F-AFACCE2B74A3} for the tech specs PDF)! But you’re right with the 73” models, for some reason those will carry the old engine. The lower end 531 series have a 720p LCD engine. I have the tech specs for all of the models in front of me. Now if what you see in the stores is different from what’s on this paper, we have a problem – my info is not from the stores…

The posting is not targeting anyone in particular; since no one posted anything about the laser DLPs, I just thought I mention it as industry news for the DV community of people interested in new technologies. It’s coming from a DV enthusiast and not from a Mitsu employee… I could have left out the disclaimer, but I didn’t – so questioning my honesty is plain rude! No hard feelings on my side though... let's keep it on the friendly side!

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Originally Posted by Ervin Farkas

So here we go – for those reading too fast: the 2007 models (few in stores, most of them on trucks, shipping as we speak) are the “classic” DLP rear projection models with a bulb as light source. In the next generation DLP projected to hit the stores late 2007, this bulb will be replaced by lasers. I hope this is enough clarification.

Yes, that clarifies nicely for those who read the original too fast... :)

On to the models shipping now – you’re wrong Jeff, in the 731 series the light engine is new, and the resolution is not 1080x960 but 1920x1080 (see http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/common/getfile.asp?uuid={D81FBA30-5421-47C8-B47F-AFACCE2B74A3} for the tech specs PDF)!

Whoa there... You need to brush up on your DLP DMD series and specs. Currently, all single-DMD DLP devices from TI (and TI is the only manufacturer, BTW) are available in only two flavors. The first is the 1280x720, which the latest revision is the TI-DMD3. The second is the 960x1080 TI-DMD6. The TI-DMD7 is a full 1920x1080 DMD set consisting of three DMDs at 1920x1080 each and is specifically designed to NOT be used with a color wheel. Only LED, LASER or other proper RGB source as all three DMDs operate in parallel and will not work with a color wheel. So, currently, if a 1080p DLP HDTV uses a color wheel, then it has a 960x1080 DMD. The full 1920x1080 display resolution is achieved through wobulation. Don't worry, this isn't a bad thing... All 1920x1080 pixels are there and addressible in resolution charts or for using the TVs as a computer display with 1:1 pixel mapping. ...Or at least they're all there as far as the human eye is concerned. The wobulation is far less perceptable than DLP "rainbows".. In fact, most people who are well versed in DLP specs actually believe that wobulation is here to stay, even once all projection TVs move to the full 1920x1080 DMD devices. The wobulation helps further smooth the image, eliminating visible pixel structures (also known as the Screen Door Effect or SDE) and this is why many people feel that the latest DLP TVs provide a more film-like picture than other technologies like Sony's SXRD. Currently, 3-chip DMD/DLP systems are used mostly in front-projection applications. To the best of my knowledge, there are currently no rear projection consumer level displays that use these. However, Samsung has announced that their larger screen LED TVs next year will use the 3-DMD on some models. IIRC, Mitsubishi said at their line show that the 3-DMD will most likely be used for their upcoming LASER models.

It's true that the new '07 models (with the exception of the 73") have the new light engine with the 6-color wheel, but they're still limited by TI's DMD technology in terms of how those colors are reflected back toward the screen for viewing.

[/QUOTE]But you’re right with the 73” models, for some reason those will carry the old engine. The lower end 531 series have a 720p LCD engine. I have the tech specs for all of the models in front of me. Now if what you see in the stores is different from what’s on this paper, we have a problem – my info is not from the stores…[/QUOTE]

My info is not from stores, but from the official Mits press releases and coverage from their 2006 line show back in April. Your spec sheet you posted a link to is just the basic PDF that's on their public site. It talks about 1080p and the new 6-color wheel, etc.. That's fine, I was simply saying that these TVs still use the same wobulated DMD that every other 1080p DLP TV on the market does.

Anyway, I'm not trying to start a fight or anything like that... I'm just picking nits. :-)

[Larry Price]

Originally Posted by Jeff Kilgroe

...many people feel that the latest DLP TVs provide a more film-like picture than other technologies like Sony's SXRD.

Thanks Jeff...just when I was looking at the Sony 60" SXRD to replace my 6 year old Mitsubishi WS-55805! I was going to wait until the 2nd generation SXRD models hit the stores this fall and decide then. Now, maybe I should try to keep my current TV alive until the Mitsu LASERs arrive next year. I guess that'll hinge on whether I can get the driver for the green CRT replaced economically. The green turns on and off randomly, more off than on as time wears on.

Anyway, very interesting discussion. Thanks Jeff and Ervin! :)

Aloha,

Larry Price

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Originally Posted by Larry Price

Thanks Jeff...just when I was looking at the Sony 60" SXRD to replace my 6 year old Mitsubishi WS-55805! I was going to wait until the 2nd generation SXRD models hit the stores this fall and decide then. Now, maybe I should try to keep my current TV alive until the Mitsu LASERs arrive next year. I guess that'll hinge on whether I can get the driver for the green CRT replaced economically. The green turns on and off randomly, more off than on as time wears on.

Anyway, very interesting discussion. Thanks Jeff and Ervin! :)

Aloha,

Larry Price

Either way, waiting may be to your advantage right now with the rate HDTV prices are falling and new features keep showing up. The new SXRD sets that will be out later this fall will accept full 1080p input (the current ones do not) and we'll see LASER and LED based DLP from various manufacturers over the next year or two. The color wheel is [finally] on it's way out for DLP.

[Ervin Farkas]

About a year late, the laser-driven large screens are now in stores. The poor blue issues and laser sparkle bugs have all been worked out; the final model has a much better picture compared to prototypes. See more here: Mitsubishi Electric LaserVue™ - Beyond Flat TV, Experience True Dimension™

For next year we will have an 80" model - yes, I still work for the company.

[Ethan Cooper]

I have seen the future and it is heavy & expensive.

$7,000 for a 150lb tv, both are large numbers.

I'm hoping that these laser sets follow the trend of plasmas and reduce dramatically in price in 5 years or so. I remember years ago hearing about plasma tv's and they cost around $10,000 at the time, we bought ours last Christmas for around $1,200. When laser tv's get down into this range I'll take another look. Unless you have lots of spare change to throw around on toys, why jump on the bleeding edge of consumer electronics? Wait till the technology is mainstream to buy, you'll have a more refined product for far less money. Who knows, maybe it'll be a bit lighter as well.