JVC introduce first Hard Drive Video Camera at DVinfo.net

Chosei Funahara · September 14th, 2004, 02:01 PM

http://www.jvc-victor.co.jp/english/everio/index.html
http://www.jvc-victor.co.jp/dvmain/g...200/index.html

It's a removable Hard drive.

Imran Zaidi · September 14th, 2004, 03:51 PM

Neat thing. One thing I noticed- they mention a noise reduction feature. From the picture they used, it looks like some sort of voodoo magic miracle worker on noise. Why do they use such obviously not-real pics I wonder. It only leads to consumer disappointment.

Rob Lohman · September 15th, 2004, 01:31 AM

Then again this looks to be targeted at consumers and not pro-
sumers or professionals. It records in MPEG2 at a 4 GB microdrive.

So that's brings it to 11 mbits/s (max 1 hour recording).

Rob Easler · September 15th, 2004, 08:24 AM

Aparently you have to be stunningly good looking to use the camera. I guess I don't qualify. The add looks like an eternity perfume commercial.

Chosei Funahara · September 15th, 2004, 09:42 AM

The future of the digital recording are sifting to HDD, memory chips and memory card.

Pany has introduced P2 cam. Apples iPod uses Hitachi 1" HDD; Toshiba introduced quarter size 20 GB HD drive.

JVC always has been innovative for new technologies. This ad looks like a perfume commercial, but it's an experimental trial, we'll see who will follow the next big pro-version, Ikegami has been committed on HDD. Also JVC committed also. JVC will introduce HDV plus removable HDD or no more HDV.
Big cats are already committed. Check!

http://www.thomsongrassvalley.com/products/cameras/viper/
4:4:4, that's the way should be.

Arri will introduce Arri D-20 next year also.
http://www.arri.com/entry/products/d20.htm
It's not a little toy.
Time has been changed or you stayed the same.

Jesse Bekas · September 15th, 2004, 01:14 PM

While the Microdrive itself will probably be expensive enough that you won't buy a few of them, it's defintely cool that it is removable, so that when a bigger sizes get cheaper you can swap one in. Also with the PCMCIA adapter there's no need for wires and you should get a faster transfer.

I liked the Panasonic SV-AV100 MP2 camcorder, but it only came with a 512MB card, its feature set was a little anemic for a video recorder listing at a grand. Assuming you only use the one card, that's like 10 minutes of true DVD quality video.

Obviously this is just a device that can be carried around easily for "in the moment" shooting, and is not really a professional or prosumer tool. I'd love to have something like this to keep on me at all times, assuming they could fabricate it relatively inexpensively.

I'd also like to see swapable Microdrives in other devices.

Although the sensor is 2MP+, it is larger than 1/4". I wonder what low light will really be like. I've heard their 3D noise reduction actually made a big difference in their regular MiniDV line, in low light and full light.

It was also cool to see how they put basically the same exact camera into two cool, very different designs. Aesthetically speaking, that's good engineering.

Chosei Funahara · September 15th, 2004, 05:00 PM

You want to talk about pro-version, it's already damage your pseudo knowledge, I'll tell you the fact: JVC had been introduced HDD cam GY-DV5000 and DR-DV5000. 40GB & 80GB, all swappable and not hot swappable yet. but It made a hisrtory. JVC knows HDD's future. Don't under estimate JVC's tech, JVC's major stock ower is Matsushita that you know. Matsushita supplies Canon's XL1-2's prism.

Jesse Bekas · September 16th, 2004, 11:40 AM

Whose pseudo-knowledge has been damaged?

Chosei Funahara · September 16th, 2004, 12:08 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Jesse Bekas : Whose pseudo-knowledge has been damaged? -->>>Jess, not you, sorry, I mean people that they think HDD is not ready for DV industry. Some people are very stubborn about current style and they don't want to change. And they deny the facts; it cannot be denied that HDD Digital Video is on the increase.

Jesse Bekas · September 16th, 2004, 09:45 PM

I was really just kidding about the pseudo-knowledge line. I totally agree that people are very enthusiastic to see tape go. I think if the the new Firestore sells well (and it should), it'll be a real signal that people are ready for HDD recording (flash maybe at a later [read cheaper] date.

Jesse Bekas · September 16th, 2004, 10:47 PM

I was just reading an article about the two cams at camcorderinfo.com, and it quoted a JVC rep as saying...

"we have big advantages which is the one hour of MiniDV quality"

...what MPEG2 stream recording at 8Mb/sec. could equal the image quality of DV25?

Bill Ravens · September 17th, 2004, 07:10 AM

I guess you guys haven't seen the Charlie White interview with CBS VP, Frank Governale, http://www.dmnforums.com/cgi-bin/viewarticle.cgi?id=28063

CBS just went "full digital" in their newsroom. CBS has also gone with a full commitment to the Sony XDCAM instead of the Panny, for two reasons:
1-storage media is too expensive. Can you imagine having to buy and then carry 30 hard drives for each camera?
2-the data streamrate, when uploading to satellite, takes up too much bandwidth.

It all comes down to $'s, and a hard disk format is way too expensive to use for ENG.

Chosei Funahara · September 17th, 2004, 09:40 AM

Hey Bill,

I knew that Sony licenced Blue Ray Laser Technology(Blue Ray diode: L.E.D.) from Nichia Chemical Industy K.K., just few months ago, I didn't expect to merchandise so soon; its disk price is only $28 to $32 that's incredibly cheap, Nichia paid to an inventor Dr. Shuji Nakamura (Now, he teaches at University of California Santa Barbara) for 160 million US dollar just 3 months ago. Blue ray has advantage but no-one has tried yet. WOW! For ENG, it totally makes sense.

Chosei Funahara · September 19th, 2004, 09:28 AM

Sony, Matsushita, Dell, Hitachi, Samsung,TDK and 200 more companies formed BD(Blue Ray Disc users), BDF(BD Founders:13 companies) and will form BDA(BD association)on October.
Then, Toshiba, Sanyo, NEC and Memorytech formed HD-DVD association.
HD-DVD is much cheaper to produce than BD.

Panny maybe introduce XDCAM like Blue ray backup camera instead PC card backup.

It'll be a war between HD-DVD and BD again (like VHS and Beta).

Jesse Bekas · September 19th, 2004, 05:10 PM

Isn't Micro$oft behind HD-DVD too. They would certainly give it a big push. Does anybody know if HD-DVD is using WM9 codecs?

On a side note, I wish HDV was using a WM9 base. Such high quality can be achieved at such a low bitrate. It would be ashame for the WM9 family of codecs not to go commerical, big time.

September 14th, 2004, 02:01 PM	#1
Chosei Funahara Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: N.Y.C. USA / Kobe, JAPAN / Posts: 49	JVC introduces first Hard Drive (HDD) Video Camera http://www.jvc-victor.co.jp/english/everio/index.html http://www.jvc-victor.co.jp/dvmain/g...200/index.html It's a removable Hard drive.

September 15th, 2004, 01:31 AM	#3
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	Then again this looks to be targeted at consumers and not pro- sumers or professionals. It records in MPEG2 at a 4 GB microdrive. So that's brings it to 11 mbits/s (max 1 hour recording). __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

September 15th, 2004, 09:42 AM	#5
Chosei Funahara Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: N.Y.C. USA / Kobe, JAPAN / Posts: 49	HDD The future of the digital recording are sifting to HDD, memory chips and memory card. Pany has introduced P2 cam. Apples iPod uses Hitachi 1" HDD; Toshiba introduced quarter size 20 GB HD drive. JVC always has been innovative for new technologies. This ad looks like a perfume commercial, but it's an experimental trial, we'll see who will follow the next big pro-version, Ikegami has been committed on HDD. Also JVC committed also. JVC will introduce HDV plus removable HDD or no more HDV. Big cats are already committed. Check! http://www.thomsongrassvalley.com/products/cameras/viper/ 4:4:4, that's the way should be. Arri will introduce Arri D-20 next year also. http://www.arri.com/entry/products/d20.htm It's not a little toy. Time has been changed or you stayed the same.

September 15th, 2004, 05:00 PM	#7
Chosei Funahara Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: N.Y.C. USA / Kobe, JAPAN / Posts: 49	HDD rocks! You want to talk about pro-version, it's already damage your pseudo knowledge, I'll tell you the fact: JVC had been introduced HDD cam GY-DV5000 and DR-DV5000. 40GB & 80GB, all swappable and not hot swappable yet. but It made a hisrtory. JVC knows HDD's future. Don't under estimate JVC's tech, JVC's major stock ower is Matsushita that you know. Matsushita supplies Canon's XL1-2's prism.

September 17th, 2004, 09:40 AM	#13
Chosei Funahara Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: N.Y.C. USA / Kobe, JAPAN / Posts: 49	I was shoked! Hey Bill, I knew that Sony licenced Blue Ray Laser Technology(Blue Ray diode: L.E.D.) from Nichia Chemical Industy K.K., just few months ago, I didn't expect to merchandise so soon; its disk price is only $28 to $32 that's incredibly cheap, Nichia paid to an inventor Dr. Shuji Nakamura (Now, he teaches at University of California Santa Barbara) for 160 million US dollar just 3 months ago. Blue ray has advantage but no-one has tried yet. WOW! For ENG, it totally makes sense.

September 14th, 2004, 03:51 PM	#2
Imran Zaidi Trustee Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 1,315	Neat thing. One thing I noticed- they mention a noise reduction feature. From the picture they used, it looks like some sort of voodoo magic miracle worker on noise. Why do they use such obviously not-real pics I wonder. It only leads to consumer disappointment.

September 15th, 2004, 08:24 AM	#4
Rob Easler Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Naperville, IL Posts: 219	Aparently you have to be stunningly good looking to use the camera. I guess I don't qualify. The add looks like an eternity perfume commercial.

September 15th, 2004, 01:14 PM	#6
Jesse Bekas Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ridgefield Park, New Jersey, USA Posts: 572	While the Microdrive itself will probably be expensive enough that you won't buy a few of them, it's defintely cool that it is removable, so that when a bigger sizes get cheaper you can swap one in. Also with the PCMCIA adapter there's no need for wires and you should get a faster transfer. I liked the Panasonic SV-AV100 MP2 camcorder, but it only came with a 512MB card, its feature set was a little anemic for a video recorder listing at a grand. Assuming you only use the one card, that's like 10 minutes of true DVD quality video. Obviously this is just a device that can be carried around easily for "in the moment" shooting, and is not really a professional or prosumer tool. I'd love to have something like this to keep on me at all times, assuming they could fabricate it relatively inexpensively. I'd also like to see swapable Microdrives in other devices. Although the sensor is 2MP+, it is larger than 1/4". I wonder what low light will really be like. I've heard their 3D noise reduction actually made a big difference in their regular MiniDV line, in low light and full light. It was also cool to see how they put basically the same exact camera into two cool, very different designs. Aesthetically speaking, that's good engineering.

September 16th, 2004, 11:40 AM	#8
Jesse Bekas Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ridgefield Park, New Jersey, USA Posts: 572	Whose pseudo-knowledge has been damaged?

September 16th, 2004, 12:08 PM	#9
Chosei Funahara Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: N.Y.C. USA / Kobe, JAPAN / Posts: 49	<<<-- Originally posted by Jesse Bekas : Whose pseudo-knowledge has been damaged? -->>>Jess, not you, sorry, I mean people that they think HDD is not ready for DV industry. Some people are very stubborn about current style and they don't want to change. And they deny the facts; it cannot be denied that HDD Digital Video is on the increase.

September 16th, 2004, 09:45 PM	#10
Jesse Bekas Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ridgefield Park, New Jersey, USA Posts: 572	I was really just kidding about the pseudo-knowledge line. I totally agree that people are very enthusiastic to see tape go. I think if the the new Firestore sells well (and it should), it'll be a real signal that people are ready for HDD recording (flash maybe at a later [read cheaper] date.

September 16th, 2004, 10:47 PM	#11
Jesse Bekas Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ridgefield Park, New Jersey, USA Posts: 572	I was just reading an article about the two cams at camcorderinfo.com, and it quoted a JVC rep as saying... "we have big advantages which is the one hour of MiniDV quality" ...what MPEG2 stream recording at 8Mb/sec. could equal the image quality of DV25?

September 17th, 2004, 07:10 AM	#12
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	I guess you guys haven't seen the Charlie White interview with CBS VP, Frank Governale, http://www.dmnforums.com/cgi-bin/viewarticle.cgi?id=28063 CBS just went "full digital" in their newsroom. CBS has also gone with a full commitment to the Sony XDCAM instead of the Panny, for two reasons: 1-storage media is too expensive. Can you imagine having to buy and then carry 30 hard drives for each camera? 2-the data streamrate, when uploading to satellite, takes up too much bandwidth. It all comes down to $'s, and a hard disk format is way too expensive to use for ENG.

September 19th, 2004, 09:28 AM	#14
Chosei Funahara Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: N.Y.C. USA / Kobe, JAPAN / Posts: 49	Blue ray Sony, Matsushita, Dell, Hitachi, Samsung,TDK and 200 more companies formed BD(Blue Ray Disc users), BDF(BD Founders:13 companies) and will form BDA(BD association)on October. Then, Toshiba, Sanyo, NEC and Memorytech formed HD-DVD association. HD-DVD is much cheaper to produce than BD. Panny maybe introduce XDCAM like Blue ray backup camera instead PC card backup. It'll be a war between HD-DVD and BD again (like VHS and Beta).

September 19th, 2004, 05:10 PM	#15
Jesse Bekas Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ridgefield Park, New Jersey, USA Posts: 572	Isn't Micro$oft behind HD-DVD too. They would certainly give it a big push. Does anybody know if HD-DVD is using WM9 codecs? On a side note, I wish HDV was using a WM9 base. Such high quality can be achieved at such a low bitrate. It would be ashame for the WM9 family of codecs not to go commerical, big time.