Sony at CES? at DVinfo.net

Dave Blackhurst · January 7th, 2009, 03:24 PM

After Canon hit the street with some cool new toys, was expecting SOMETHING from Sony... anyone at the show seen anything interesting? Google brings up a site, with the "Z7" being the only camera shown, and that's old news...

Was sort of expecting a refresh at least to the SR11/12.

Michael Murie · January 7th, 2009, 03:55 PM

I think they are supposed to make their announcements tomorrow...http://www.sony.com/ces/schedule/. I'm waiting to see if anything interesting appears too.

Henry Olonga · January 7th, 2009, 07:08 PM

And it sure looks amazing actually looking at the specs.Wow....

Sony Europe Press Centre

I have read elsewhere 12 megapixel sensor for stills on the high end model.Six blade aperture.No more diamond shaped bokeh he he .We are heading into serious territory as far as resolution goes.Low light sensitivity seems like it will be excellent.Bring it on - after seeing what Canon announced I was going to jump ship but this has convinced me to stay.Can't wait.....when I attach this to an intensity will I even want to consider anything more expensive? I wonder........must clear credit card for March.....

General summary of press release....

Incredible images with super-sensitive new Exmor R CMOS sensor
High Definition Handycam®
o Exmor R CMOS sensor gives 2x increase in sensitivity*1 for brilliant low-noise images, even in low light
o Premium Sony G Lens for class-leading optical performance
o Longest ever Full HD shooting time (up to 101 hrs) on 240GB HDD (XR520VE)
o Optical SteadyShot with new ‘Active’ mode gives up to ten times improved anti-shake performance
o GPS enhances your memories with geotagging and map display

Standard Definition Handycam®
o Light, easy to carry new Memory Stick™ models in eye-catching colours
o Highest-ever 60x optical zoom
o Fastest ever Quick start for near-instant shooting from standby

Dave Blackhurst · January 7th, 2009, 11:53 PM

Looks like they got the new "reversed" EXMOR sensor out... that should prove quite interesting in low light.

Guess I'll hold onto all those Sony accessories while more info hits. Looks like they should have some winners in this batch.

Can't fathom what I'd do with a huge HDD like that though...

Casey Krugman · January 8th, 2009, 11:19 AM

Wow... now you can get real close to little jimmy playing baseball... of course every shot will look like you're going through withdrawl... but hey... thats fun too...

Henry Olonga · January 8th, 2009, 12:19 PM

This is with reference to the respective high end consumer cams from both companies.
The specs are in and I just discovered that the sony is actually upressing the digital stills as in the SR11 so I think that I may well be jumping ship after all. The Canon seems hard to beat although I am sure the Sony will be very good.

Bill Koehler · January 8th, 2009, 01:12 PM

HDR-XR520V | HDR-XR520V 240GB High Definition Handycam® Camcorder | Sony | SonyStyle USA

Dave Blackhurst · January 9th, 2009, 02:17 AM

Aside from the bionz R sensor (and the low light ratings don't look that much better, have to wonder what the real world results will be), I think Sonys engineers took the year off...

The resolution increase might be worth the difference, but the SR11/12 look mighty good as it stands.

Bloody 'ell, I could practically stick a new sensor block in on my repair bench, and who needs a GPS in a camera?!?!

Canon may be eating Sonys lunch in the high end "consumer" space AGAIN... now if only they'd put the old LANC jack back on somewhere... that HF-S looks pretty tempting!

Ron Evans · January 9th, 2009, 06:33 AM

I think the issue we are all having is that we are evaluating these new cameras against the camera we would really like which would be halfway between these consumer cameras and the 3 chips like the FX1000, XHA1 etc a category that has disappeared. There used to be the TRV900 etc that had the manual controls I would like, a viewfinder LANC etc in a 1 chip format that complemented my 3 chip camera. I would like a camera priced closer to the 3chip units that had these features and could act as a more usable family camera. I now have a SR11 that I am happy with and none of these new cameras have anything that would make me change. The video and stills from the SR11 are more than adequate as a family camera. The stills viewed on my 42" plasma are stunning so I am not sure why I would need any more resolution unless I was foolishly thinking that I could print full plate high quality stills from a video camera that cost just over a $1000.
I will wait in hope of getting this intermediate camera some day!!!!
If was young again(!!!!) the Sony would be great as a camera for a young family. Big hard drive( leave everything on it for years), face recognition to get the kids in focus, GPS to know where I was for that shot, in-camera editing and output to DVD unit no computer needed. No I don't think the engineers took the year off they are just aiming at a different market to us enthusiasts and may have got it right.
Ron Evans

John Wiley · January 9th, 2009, 07:15 AM

Yeah definitely looks like they have aimed for a different market. Most exciting announcement for me was that they will keep the HC9 in 2009... MiniDV is not dead yet!!!

Bill Koehler · January 9th, 2009, 08:38 AM

I think Sony's target with the large hard drives is going on vacation, shooting a ton of footage, and not having to even think about offloading footage until you get back home. So there is no need to be hauling around a laptop+external hard drives+power adapters, ad infinitum, ad nauseum. So I think I understand what they are doing. I still think they are missing the boat with respect to not having a flash based update with their latest and greatest sensor.

I know whenever it is I update to my next camcorder, one theme will be eliminating as much mechanical tomfoolery (tape, hard drives) as possible. There are still issues of shock, temperature, and altitude - hard drives don't like thin air.

Given the respective product announcements, I think there is great potential for Canon to eat Sony's lunch.

Michael Murie · January 9th, 2009, 01:42 PM

I'm really curious to see a comparison of the low light performance of the HDR-XR500V/520V vs. the Canon HF S10/S100. Both companies seem to be claiming significantly improved performance for their model lines.

Ron Evans · January 9th, 2009, 04:08 PM

My wife and I had a holiday in New Zealand and Australia this fall and took my SR11 and my wifes Sony point and shoot still. I took just over 5 hours video on the trip and would have loved to have had the latest GPS version. Twice I set the time wrong by 12 hours so now all the day data is wrong too for a few days until I found my error !!!! Yes I think these new Sony's will be great family cams keeping the date and time correct is marvelous feature with bonus of where you were. I know it sounds like a gimmick but with the capability to record many years of family video it may become important. My daughter has my SR7 when I got the SR11 and she records about 25G a year of her kids. At 240G the camera will get changed before there is need to remove anything, which means all family video is available to show anyone if they have the camera with them. Our month long holiday was about 40G so one could go on month long holidays of the same type for 6 years before running out of hard drive space or removing anything. Just backing up files for safety. A flash based camcorder cannot compete with this convenience.

Ron Evans

Scott Brickert · January 9th, 2009, 08:30 PM

Boo, still no 24P in the consumer range from Sony! I wanted an HC7 with 24P...

re GPS, here in the mountains mine hardly picks up 3 birds in order to get a bead on itself. Kindof a joke. 'Course, maybe in NZ the valleys all run north and south, so the satellites would be easier to spot...

Ron Evans · January 9th, 2009, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Brickert

Boo, still no 24P in the consumer range from Sony! I wanted an HC7 with 24P...

re GPS, here in the mountains mine hardly picks up 3 birds in order to get a bead on itself. Kindof a joke. 'Course, maybe in NZ the valleys all run north and south, so the satellites would be easier to spot...

Why would a consumer want 24p? The only sensible reason for 24p is to transfer to film to show at film festival. Unless one has a very specify set of playback and display equipment the true film motion gets destroyed in adapting to the transport mechanism and display. 24 doesn't divide into 50 or 60 so frames have to be dropped or repeated, interpolated etc. Secondly unless the camera person is skilled in film style shooting the output is a juddering mess due to too much camera movement or poor composition. I see no reason to have 24p on a consumer camera. IF one wants to shoot progressive shoot 30p or better yet 60p as the normal consumer is not going hold camera steady or focus on the background movement in a scene. 30 or 60 also makes a lot more sense for television or PC playback. As far as GPS goes my old Garmin is also useless but my friends wrist mounted unit was quite happy to give us speed, distance, vertical traveled etc while skiing in Colorado!!!

Ron Evans

January 7th, 2009, 03:24 PM	#1
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Sony at CES? After Canon hit the street with some cool new toys, was expecting SOMETHING from Sony... anyone at the show seen anything interesting? Google brings up a site, with the "Z7" being the only camera shown, and that's old news... Was sort of expecting a refresh at least to the SR11/12.

January 7th, 2009, 07:08 PM	#3
Henry Olonga Major Player Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: London Posts: 201	Sony have joined the party.... And it sure looks amazing actually looking at the specs.Wow.... Sony Europe Press Centre I have read elsewhere 12 megapixel sensor for stills on the high end model.Six blade aperture.No more diamond shaped bokeh he he .We are heading into serious territory as far as resolution goes.Low light sensitivity seems like it will be excellent.Bring it on - after seeing what Canon announced I was going to jump ship but this has convinced me to stay.Can't wait.....when I attach this to an intensity will I even want to consider anything more expensive? I wonder........must clear credit card for March..... General summary of press release.... Incredible images with super-sensitive new Exmor R CMOS sensor High Definition Handycam® o Exmor R CMOS sensor gives 2x increase in sensitivity*1 for brilliant low-noise images, even in low light o Premium Sony G Lens for class-leading optical performance o Longest ever Full HD shooting time (up to 101 hrs) on 240GB HDD (XR520VE) o Optical SteadyShot with new ‘Active’ mode gives up to ten times improved anti-shake performance o GPS enhances your memories with geotagging and map display Standard Definition Handycam® o Light, easy to carry new Memory Stick™ models in eye-catching colours o Highest-ever 60x optical zoom o Fastest ever Quick start for near-instant shooting from standby

January 8th, 2009, 11:19 AM	#5
Casey Krugman Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 135	60x zoom... on a handycam? Wow... now you can get real close to little jimmy playing baseball... of course every shot will look like you're going through withdrawl... but hey... thats fun too...

January 8th, 2009, 12:19 PM	#6
Henry Olonga Major Player Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: London Posts: 201	Spoke too soon This is with reference to the respective high end consumer cams from both companies. The specs are in and I just discovered that the sony is actually upressing the digital stills as in the SR11 so I think that I may well be jumping ship after all. The Canon seems hard to beat although I am sure the Sony will be very good.

January 8th, 2009, 01:12 PM	#7
Bill Koehler Major Player Join Date: May 2007 Location: Alpharetta, Georgia, USA Posts: 760	Sonys putting up the info at SonyStyle already HDR-XR520V \| HDR-XR520V 240GB High Definition Handycam® Camcorder \| Sony \| SonyStyle USA

January 7th, 2009, 03:55 PM	#2
Michael Murie Major Player Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 205	I think they are supposed to make their announcements tomorrow...http://www.sony.com/ces/schedule/. I'm waiting to see if anything interesting appears too.

January 7th, 2009, 11:53 PM	#4
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Looks like they got the new "reversed" EXMOR sensor out... that should prove quite interesting in low light. Guess I'll hold onto all those Sony accessories while more info hits. Looks like they should have some winners in this batch. Can't fathom what I'd do with a huge HDD like that though...

January 9th, 2009, 02:17 AM	#8
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Aside from the bionz R sensor (and the low light ratings don't look that much better, have to wonder what the real world results will be), I think Sonys engineers took the year off... The resolution increase might be worth the difference, but the SR11/12 look mighty good as it stands. Bloody 'ell, I could practically stick a new sensor block in on my repair bench, and who needs a GPS in a camera?!?! Canon may be eating Sonys lunch in the high end "consumer" space AGAIN... now if only they'd put the old LANC jack back on somewhere... that HF-S looks pretty tempting!

January 9th, 2009, 06:33 AM	#9
Ron Evans Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 4,220	I think the issue we are all having is that we are evaluating these new cameras against the camera we would really like which would be halfway between these consumer cameras and the 3 chips like the FX1000, XHA1 etc a category that has disappeared. There used to be the TRV900 etc that had the manual controls I would like, a viewfinder LANC etc in a 1 chip format that complemented my 3 chip camera. I would like a camera priced closer to the 3chip units that had these features and could act as a more usable family camera. I now have a SR11 that I am happy with and none of these new cameras have anything that would make me change. The video and stills from the SR11 are more than adequate as a family camera. The stills viewed on my 42" plasma are stunning so I am not sure why I would need any more resolution unless I was foolishly thinking that I could print full plate high quality stills from a video camera that cost just over a $1000. I will wait in hope of getting this intermediate camera some day!!!! If was young again(!!!!) the Sony would be great as a camera for a young family. Big hard drive( leave everything on it for years), face recognition to get the kids in focus, GPS to know where I was for that shot, in-camera editing and output to DVD unit no computer needed. No I don't think the engineers took the year off they are just aiming at a different market to us enthusiasts and may have got it right. Ron Evans

January 9th, 2009, 07:15 AM	#10
John Wiley Trustee Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Byron Bay, Australia Posts: 1,155	Yeah definitely looks like they have aimed for a different market. Most exciting announcement for me was that they will keep the HC9 in 2009... MiniDV is not dead yet!!!

January 9th, 2009, 08:38 AM	#11
Bill Koehler Major Player Join Date: May 2007 Location: Alpharetta, Georgia, USA Posts: 760	I think Sony's target with the large hard drives is going on vacation, shooting a ton of footage, and not having to even think about offloading footage until you get back home. So there is no need to be hauling around a laptop+external hard drives+power adapters, ad infinitum, ad nauseum. So I think I understand what they are doing. I still think they are missing the boat with respect to not having a flash based update with their latest and greatest sensor. I know whenever it is I update to my next camcorder, one theme will be eliminating as much mechanical tomfoolery (tape, hard drives) as possible. There are still issues of shock, temperature, and altitude - hard drives don't like thin air. Given the respective product announcements, I think there is great potential for Canon to eat Sony's lunch.

January 9th, 2009, 01:42 PM	#12
Michael Murie Major Player Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 205	I'm really curious to see a comparison of the low light performance of the HDR-XR500V/520V vs. the Canon HF S10/S100. Both companies seem to be claiming significantly improved performance for their model lines.

January 9th, 2009, 04:08 PM	#13
Ron Evans Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 4,220	My wife and I had a holiday in New Zealand and Australia this fall and took my SR11 and my wifes Sony point and shoot still. I took just over 5 hours video on the trip and would have loved to have had the latest GPS version. Twice I set the time wrong by 12 hours so now all the day data is wrong too for a few days until I found my error !!!! Yes I think these new Sony's will be great family cams keeping the date and time correct is marvelous feature with bonus of where you were. I know it sounds like a gimmick but with the capability to record many years of family video it may become important. My daughter has my SR7 when I got the SR11 and she records about 25G a year of her kids. At 240G the camera will get changed before there is need to remove anything, which means all family video is available to show anyone if they have the camera with them. Our month long holiday was about 40G so one could go on month long holidays of the same type for 6 years before running out of hard drive space or removing anything. Just backing up files for safety. A flash based camcorder cannot compete with this convenience. Ron Evans

January 9th, 2009, 08:30 PM	#14
Scott Brickert Major Player Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Crested Butte, CO Posts: 576	Boo, still no 24P in the consumer range from Sony! I wanted an HC7 with 24P... re GPS, here in the mountains mine hardly picks up 3 birds in order to get a bead on itself. Kindof a joke. 'Course, maybe in NZ the valleys all run north and south, so the satellites would be easier to spot... __________________ Scott Shot-By-Scott