Correct way to convert FS700+O7Q DNG to ProRes UNGRADED at DVinfo.net

Ole Salomonsen · August 21st, 2014, 04:25 AM

Hi,

a little unsure if to post this under post production area (Davinci Resolve) or here under Convergent Designs. As this is very specific to the Odyssey 7Q generated DNG files from the FS700, using SLOG2, and most specific knowledge reg this is setup here, I am thinking this is the right place.

If you think I am wrong and this should be under Davinci Resolve in post production let me know and I will delete / move the thread.

I have a LOT of RAW DNG files now and I want to convert these to ProRes to save space. I am no Resolve expert, and I am not sure I will be doing the grading in resolve, for now I think I will do the grading in Premiere etc. I think Adobe Camera RAW + After Effects does a better job in debayering. But Resolve is A LOT faster previewing and converting. So for large part of my recordings I can live with ProRes from DNG from Resolve.

My question is simple: - What settings do I use in resolve to render out ProRes files that look similar to ProRes video recorded directly from the FS700+O7Q, and that can be graded later on (either in resolve or any other program). I have tried the recommended settings from CD in resolve, and applied SLOG2 LUT under 3D LUT. But no matter what I do the output file looks darker than the same ProRes file recorded directly from the FS700+O7Q (either HD to ProRes, or 4K->HD ProRes). If I apply no LUT at all, and leave Cinema DNG RAW settings to default, the output file is even darker, so I know the recommended settings I apply does have an affect. However, the output file is still darker than ProRes files directly from the O7Q, when recommended settings are applied.

The way I understand it the ProRes (MOV) files coming from the Odyssey 7Q allready has SLOG2 applied to them? They look flat and bright when played back.

I want to make sure I render out the DNG->ProRes file with the correct settings, and preserve best possible DR and editing lattitude, before I go ahead and delete my RAW files.

Ole

Clermond Ferrand · August 21st, 2014, 06:32 AM

I found this a quite good starting point, my credit goes to Paul Curtis at dvxuser.com Sony FS700
View Profile: paulcurtis - DVXuser.com -- The online community for filmmaking

1) Master Project settings - Color Science: ACES
2) Camera RAW: Cinema DNG - Decode Using: Project - White Balance: As Shot - Color Space: BMD Film - Gamma: BMD Film - Highlight Recover: Check
3) Exposure +2.0
4) No LUT
5) No further correction, also no contrast change

you may try also settings of Gene Sung with exposure setting of +2.5 and contrast to 0.8
You can set each clip individually if you switch in camera tab from "project" to "clip"

hth, any feedback is appreciated

Ole Salomonsen · August 21st, 2014, 02:08 PM

Clermond, thank you for your input.

None of the recommended settings brings me close to match the ProRes files from camera/O7Q.

So I start to realize then there is no "correct" or perfect settings for the FS700 DNGs then, and we are left to our self to trial and error. :(

I sort of expected this for the ACR route, but I assumed there was some "Convergent-Design-perfect" Resolve-settings for bringing your RAW into same ProRes as delivered from the O7Q.

I am having serious trouble getting the DNG files look similar as the ProRes files using Resolve.
To me resolve sure is one frustrating program, at least 3 places you can lift shadows. (Master, clip, and color). Not to mention all the ways you can increase exposure.

Makes me wonder about how much lattitude you will have left with the highlights in the rendered ProRes file when increasing the exposure by +2EV on the RAW files in resolve, still does not bring you the same luminance level as the FS700 ProRes file.

I guess I will be stuck with my RAW files still for some time :(

Clermond Ferrand · August 21st, 2014, 04:22 PM

sorry to hear that my suggestion does not hit your needs. Resolve is a great tool with a huge range of possibilities. I am still learning a lot but with each step to make a progress I like it more... From my side I can say the method I shared works perfect. I mixed a lot of 4K2HD slog with 2K HFR and 4K RAW self-made ProRes and it works very well. Maybe you check your exposure setting? I have deleted TB of RAW in the meanwhile..

Ole Salomonsen · August 27th, 2014, 02:53 AM

Yeah I am sure Resolve has great potential. But I think the smartest workflow may be to have videofiles flat and ungraded for start. Instead of being forced to grade them in Resolve before you render out the videofiles. Then I can grade them later in whatever program I choose, Resolve or whatever.

I will post some comparison of the RAW 2 ProRes files and the ProRes files straight from O7Q later.
It may be that they are similar enough to grade to a similar result, but there is definitely a visible difference, which I find frustrating.

BTW! Are there any Adobe Camera RAW presents around that brings the FS700/O7Q DNG's as close to a flat O7Q-ProRes file as possible?

Jacob Scoffield · May 12th, 2015, 11:03 PM

Hey Ole,

I am having a very similar situation than you, recording 240fps on a FS700 to an Odyssey 7Q, and the files look way darker than on the Odyssey when opened on a computer (in any software).

I found this information online: "FS700/FS7 RAW files may appear very dark upon first import. Files need a Gamma 2.2 correction"

Did you find a good workflow to go from the DNG files to a usable prores file and recovering the initial aspect of what you shot?
Thank you!

August 21st, 2014, 04:25 AM	#1
Ole Salomonsen Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Tromsø, Norway Posts: 33	Correct way to convert FS700+O7Q DNG to ProRes UNGRADED Hi, a little unsure if to post this under post production area (Davinci Resolve) or here under Convergent Designs. As this is very specific to the Odyssey 7Q generated DNG files from the FS700, using SLOG2, and most specific knowledge reg this is setup here, I am thinking this is the right place. If you think I am wrong and this should be under Davinci Resolve in post production let me know and I will delete / move the thread. I have a LOT of RAW DNG files now and I want to convert these to ProRes to save space. I am no Resolve expert, and I am not sure I will be doing the grading in resolve, for now I think I will do the grading in Premiere etc. I think Adobe Camera RAW + After Effects does a better job in debayering. But Resolve is A LOT faster previewing and converting. So for large part of my recordings I can live with ProRes from DNG from Resolve. My question is simple: - What settings do I use in resolve to render out ProRes files that look similar to ProRes video recorded directly from the FS700+O7Q, and that can be graded later on (either in resolve or any other program). I have tried the recommended settings from CD in resolve, and applied SLOG2 LUT under 3D LUT. But no matter what I do the output file looks darker than the same ProRes file recorded directly from the FS700+O7Q (either HD to ProRes, or 4K->HD ProRes). If I apply no LUT at all, and leave Cinema DNG RAW settings to default, the output file is even darker, so I know the recommended settings I apply does have an affect. However, the output file is still darker than ProRes files directly from the O7Q, when recommended settings are applied. The way I understand it the ProRes (MOV) files coming from the Odyssey 7Q allready has SLOG2 applied to them? They look flat and bright when played back. I want to make sure I render out the DNG->ProRes file with the correct settings, and preserve best possible DR and editing lattitude, before I go ahead and delete my RAW files. Ole

August 21st, 2014, 06:32 AM	#2
Clermond Ferrand New Boot Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Frankfurt GER Posts: 14	Re: Correct way to convert FS700+O7Q DNG to ProRes UNGRADED I found this a quite good starting point, my credit goes to Paul Curtis at dvxuser.com Sony FS700 View Profile: paulcurtis - DVXuser.com -- The online community for filmmaking 1) Master Project settings - Color Science: ACES 2) Camera RAW: Cinema DNG - Decode Using: Project - White Balance: As Shot - Color Space: BMD Film - Gamma: BMD Film - Highlight Recover: Check 3) Exposure +2.0 4) No LUT 5) No further correction, also no contrast change you may try also settings of Gene Sung with exposure setting of +2.5 and contrast to 0.8 You can set each clip individually if you switch in camera tab from "project" to "clip" hth, any feedback is appreciated

August 21st, 2014, 02:08 PM	#3
Ole Salomonsen Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Tromsø, Norway Posts: 33	Re: Correct way to convert FS700+O7Q DNG to ProRes UNGRADED Clermond, thank you for your input. None of the recommended settings brings me close to match the ProRes files from camera/O7Q. So I start to realize then there is no "correct" or perfect settings for the FS700 DNGs then, and we are left to our self to trial and error. :( I sort of expected this for the ACR route, but I assumed there was some "Convergent-Design-perfect" Resolve-settings for bringing your RAW into same ProRes as delivered from the O7Q. I am having serious trouble getting the DNG files look similar as the ProRes files using Resolve. To me resolve sure is one frustrating program, at least 3 places you can lift shadows. (Master, clip, and color). Not to mention all the ways you can increase exposure. Makes me wonder about how much lattitude you will have left with the highlights in the rendered ProRes file when increasing the exposure by +2EV on the RAW files in resolve, still does not bring you the same luminance level as the FS700 ProRes file. I guess I will be stuck with my RAW files still for some time :(

August 21st, 2014, 04:22 PM	#4
Clermond Ferrand New Boot Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Frankfurt GER Posts: 14	Re: Correct way to convert FS700+O7Q DNG to ProRes UNGRADED sorry to hear that my suggestion does not hit your needs. Resolve is a great tool with a huge range of possibilities. I am still learning a lot but with each step to make a progress I like it more... From my side I can say the method I shared works perfect. I mixed a lot of 4K2HD slog with 2K HFR and 4K RAW self-made ProRes and it works very well. Maybe you check your exposure setting? I have deleted TB of RAW in the meanwhile..

August 27th, 2014, 02:53 AM	#5
Ole Salomonsen Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Tromsø, Norway Posts: 33	Re: Correct way to convert FS700+O7Q DNG to ProRes UNGRADED Yeah I am sure Resolve has great potential. But I think the smartest workflow may be to have videofiles flat and ungraded for start. Instead of being forced to grade them in Resolve before you render out the videofiles. Then I can grade them later in whatever program I choose, Resolve or whatever. I will post some comparison of the RAW 2 ProRes files and the ProRes files straight from O7Q later. It may be that they are similar enough to grade to a similar result, but there is definitely a visible difference, which I find frustrating. BTW! Are there any Adobe Camera RAW presents around that brings the FS700/O7Q DNG's as close to a flat O7Q-ProRes file as possible?

May 12th, 2015, 11:03 PM	#6
Jacob Scoffield Tourist Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 3	Re: Correct way to convert FS700+O7Q DNG to ProRes UNGRADED Hey Ole, I am having a very similar situation than you, recording 240fps on a FS700 to an Odyssey 7Q, and the files look way darker than on the Odyssey when opened on a computer (in any software). I found this information online: "FS700/FS7 RAW files may appear very dark upon first import. Files need a Gamma 2.2 correction" Did you find a good workflow to go from the DNG files to a usable prores file and recovering the initial aspect of what you shot? Thank you!