CF Cards Shown As "Full" On nanoFlash, When Only Part Filled at DVinfo.net

Ronald Jackson · February 10th, 2011, 03:09 AM

I was using my nano this week, attached to my XLH1, as usual. Two CF cards in place, 64GB Transcend 400x.

One card had about 20 minutes of footage, the other was blank. After a few minutes of filming the nanoFlash stopped recording, and the LCD showed both cards as "full" i.e. solid black lines across the top.

The camera was still recording to tape, and a signal was being received by the nanoFlash, and output to my SDI monitor.

I reformatted the "unused" CF card then and there, and the nano started to record as usual.

Once home I played back off the part filled card and found my original 20 minutes of footage still in place plus a bit of the new stuff. I backed up the card to my Nexto, and although according to the nanoFlash this 64GB card was full, the Nexto only downloaded 20GB, corresponding to my "20 minutes" of footage.

Possibly unconnected, but I'm no expert, the nano during my recording session , of its own accord seemingly, kept showing "recording" and then "stopped recording", resulting in a string of tiny files/clips visible on playback.

Any suggestions as to what went wrong?

Ron

ps recording 180mbps "I" Frame and the "thin black line" on the LCD originally corresponded to my 20 minutes usage, so it went suddenly from this to "full"

Dan Keaton · February 10th, 2011, 07:41 AM

Dear Ron,

I feel that you accidently activated "Hot Swapping" by pressing the Record Button twice in succession.

As such, we immediate mark the card as full, and switch to the second card. This allows you to remove the one card and insert another.

This is covered in our 1.6.248 manual. Just search for Hot Swapping.

Ronald Jackson · February 18th, 2011, 10:04 AM

Dan,

It did it again today. I think I had a poor connection via the XLH1 Timecode Out socket, difficult to tighten up with the mounting plate in place, so inadvertently I must have pressed record (on the camera) twice and voila, both CF cards "full".

Given I have no interest whatsoever in Hot Swapping how can I avoid this in future? By reverting to an earlier firmware update?

Ron

Ronald Jackson · February 18th, 2011, 10:05 AM

Dan,

An afterthought, both cards showed as full, the part used one I was recording to and the other "unused" one,

Ron

Dan Keaton · February 18th, 2011, 11:43 AM

Dear Ron,

Yes, you could use our 1.6.29 firmware if you want to disable hot swapping.

I assume that you press Record twice in rapid succession, so we switched to the next card, then you again pressed the Record twice in rapid succession.

Ronald Jackson · February 18th, 2011, 02:29 PM

Thank you Dan as always for your quick response.

Do I just go through the Firmware Update procedure with 1.6.29 ?

Presumably available from the CD website,

Ron

Dan Keaton · February 18th, 2011, 03:16 PM

Dear Ron,

Yes, you can go to our website and download 1.6.29.

http://www.convergent-design.com/Dow...0/Default.aspx (Click on Downloads)

Here is the link to the firmware update procedure.

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/converge...ml#post1612363

Willard Hill · February 18th, 2011, 09:04 PM

The same thing happened to me about three weeks ago, but only one card was affected. This explains why it happened, but I hate to change back to the old firmware as the new completely solved my problem with the unit powering up in cold weather. Now it is scary to think that with two mistakes in punching the record button that I could effectively be put out of business while out in the field filming wildlife.

On the positive side, I have filmed quite a bit since that happened with no further problem.

Dan Keaton · February 18th, 2011, 09:59 PM

Dear Friends,

It is clear that we should consider having an option to enable hot-swapping.

Of course the downsides of having an option would be that someone might only expect to record for a certain amount of time, then it runs over.

I am surprise that people are accidently hitting the record button (twice) while recording.

If one accidently hits it once, no harm is done, it just closes one file and starts another seamlessly, no frames are lost.

Maybe we need a two key sequence.

Billy Steinberg · February 18th, 2011, 10:10 PM

Are we looking at this the wrong way, perhaps?

Unless I'm misunderstanding the discussion, the problem isn't with hot swapping, it's with the "two pushes on the record button means skip to the next card". If you (and others) feel that this is too dangerous without providing a setting to enable and disable it, then the setting should control whether "two pushes" is enabled or disabled, not whether hot swapping is enabled or disabled.

Or am I missing something?

Billy

Dan Keaton · February 18th, 2011, 10:46 PM

Dear Billy,

If I understand you correct, you are suggesting that we just disable the function were the Record Key is pressed twice in succession.

If disabled, as I understand your position, then hot swapping could still work, just that one would have to wait until the card filled up, then the nanoFlash automatically advanced to the next card.

Billy, that is an interesting suggestion.

Using your suggestion, people who need to edit quickly, while still recording, could enable it, and others could disable it. An example would be camera operators covering breaking news.

Ronald Jackson · February 19th, 2011, 02:36 AM

Relieved to know that it wasn't just me having this problem. Like Willard I film wildlife (birds generally over here) which means an enormous amount of "record/pause" as the subjects continually move in and out of focus, and I think it is this that causes the problem. Typical clips may be only 10 seconds long, and no, I don't even think about naming each and every one!

I'll re install 1.6.29 pending I hope a further version with the option of enabling/disabling the "two push" scenario.

Power down is a handy option so sorry to lose that albeit hopefully not for long.

Ron

Dan Keaton · February 19th, 2011, 08:08 AM

Dear Ron,

For your application, if you want to start and stop so often, it would appear that one of our wired remote controls would be very helpful.

Do you already have one?

I believe that the switching to the next CompactFlash card signal can only be done via the nanoFlash's record button, not via the remote control (I have not personally tested this yet).

If this is true, then if you are not pressing the actual record button on the nanoFlash, then there is no possiblity of accidently activiating a "Hot Swap" request.

Other wildlife videographers tell me that this remote control is very helpful.

Also, with the remote control we have a mode that is even more useful for you type of shooting: frequent short sequences.

The nanoFlash System|Trigger|Remote Level opton, if used, will cause the nanoFlash to record when the remote control switch is held down. When released, the nanoFlash stops recording.

Thus, if you choose this option, you just hold the remote control switch down to record, release to stop, which would appear to be much easier for you type of shooting.

Willard Hill · February 19th, 2011, 10:39 AM

I was using the wired remote. I have a clip to mount it beside my Canon ZR-1000 on the tripod handle. This was during a heavy snow shower and I had draped a cover over the nanoFlash and most of the camera, so I don't know if I inadvertently hit the record button on the nanoFlash itself (along with punching the remote button) or not, but I was using the remote to fire the camera. I had not reported the problem yet as I thought it was possibly a one time glitch. I will test it when I have time to see if I can duplicate the problem.

Dan Keaton · February 19th, 2011, 10:41 AM

Dear Willard,

Thank you, I look forward to your test results.

February 10th, 2011, 03:09 AM	#1
Ronald Jackson Major Player Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Southport, United Kingdom Posts: 723	CF Cards Shown As "Full" On nanoFlash, When Only Part Filled I was using my nano this week, attached to my XLH1, as usual. Two CF cards in place, 64GB Transcend 400x. One card had about 20 minutes of footage, the other was blank. After a few minutes of filming the nanoFlash stopped recording, and the LCD showed both cards as "full" i.e. solid black lines across the top. The camera was still recording to tape, and a signal was being received by the nanoFlash, and output to my SDI monitor. I reformatted the "unused" CF card then and there, and the nano started to record as usual. Once home I played back off the part filled card and found my original 20 minutes of footage still in place plus a bit of the new stuff. I backed up the card to my Nexto, and although according to the nanoFlash this 64GB card was full, the Nexto only downloaded 20GB, corresponding to my "20 minutes" of footage. Possibly unconnected, but I'm no expert, the nano during my recording session , of its own accord seemingly, kept showing "recording" and then "stopped recording", resulting in a string of tiny files/clips visible on playback. Any suggestions as to what went wrong? Ron ps recording 180mbps "I" Frame and the "thin black line" on the LCD originally corresponded to my 20 minutes usage, so it went suddenly from this to "full" Last edited by Ronald Jackson; February 10th, 2011 at 03:12 AM. Reason: additional info.

February 10th, 2011, 07:41 AM	#2
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Ron, I feel that you accidently activated "Hot Swapping" by pressing the Record Button twice in succession. As such, we immediate mark the card as full, and switch to the second card. This allows you to remove the one card and insert another. This is covered in our 1.6.248 manual. Just search for Hot Swapping. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 18th, 2011, 11:43 AM	#5
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Ron, Yes, you could use our 1.6.29 firmware if you want to disable hot swapping. I assume that you press Record twice in rapid succession, so we switched to the next card, then you again pressed the Record twice in rapid succession. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 18th, 2011, 03:16 PM	#7
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Ron, Yes, you can go to our website and download 1.6.29. http://www.convergent-design.com/Dow...0/Default.aspx (Click on Downloads) Here is the link to the firmware update procedure. http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/converge...ml#post1612363 __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 18th, 2011, 09:04 PM	#8
Willard Hill Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 191	The same thing happened to me about three weeks ago, but only one card was affected. This explains why it happened, but I hate to change back to the old firmware as the new completely solved my problem with the unit powering up in cold weather. Now it is scary to think that with two mistakes in punching the record button that I could effectively be put out of business while out in the field filming wildlife. On the positive side, I have filmed quite a bit since that happened with no further problem. __________________ Willard http://pawildlifephotographer.blogspot.com/

February 18th, 2011, 10:04 AM	#3
Ronald Jackson Major Player Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Southport, United Kingdom Posts: 723	Dan, It did it again today. I think I had a poor connection via the XLH1 Timecode Out socket, difficult to tighten up with the mounting plate in place, so inadvertently I must have pressed record (on the camera) twice and voila, both CF cards "full". Given I have no interest whatsoever in Hot Swapping how can I avoid this in future? By reverting to an earlier firmware update? Ron

February 18th, 2011, 10:05 AM	#4
Ronald Jackson Major Player Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Southport, United Kingdom Posts: 723	Dan, An afterthought, both cards showed as full, the part used one I was recording to and the other "unused" one, Ron

February 18th, 2011, 02:29 PM	#6
Ronald Jackson Major Player Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Southport, United Kingdom Posts: 723	Thank you Dan as always for your quick response. Do I just go through the Firmware Update procedure with 1.6.29 ? Presumably available from the CD website, Ron

February 18th, 2011, 09:59 PM	#9
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Friends, It is clear that we should consider having an option to enable hot-swapping. Of course the downsides of having an option would be that someone might only expect to record for a certain amount of time, then it runs over. I am surprise that people are accidently hitting the record button (twice) while recording. If one accidently hits it once, no harm is done, it just closes one file and starts another seamlessly, no frames are lost. Maybe we need a two key sequence. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 18th, 2011, 10:10 PM	#10
Billy Steinberg Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: NYC Posts: 122	Are we looking at this the wrong way, perhaps? Unless I'm misunderstanding the discussion, the problem isn't with hot swapping, it's with the "two pushes on the record button means skip to the next card". If you (and others) feel that this is too dangerous without providing a setting to enable and disable it, then the setting should control whether "two pushes" is enabled or disabled, not whether hot swapping is enabled or disabled. Or am I missing something? Billy

February 18th, 2011, 10:46 PM	#11
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Billy, If I understand you correct, you are suggesting that we just disable the function were the Record Key is pressed twice in succession. If disabled, as I understand your position, then hot swapping could still work, just that one would have to wait until the card filled up, then the nanoFlash automatically advanced to the next card. Billy, that is an interesting suggestion. Using your suggestion, people who need to edit quickly, while still recording, could enable it, and others could disable it. An example would be camera operators covering breaking news. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 19th, 2011, 02:36 AM	#12
Ronald Jackson Major Player Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Southport, United Kingdom Posts: 723	Relieved to know that it wasn't just me having this problem. Like Willard I film wildlife (birds generally over here) which means an enormous amount of "record/pause" as the subjects continually move in and out of focus, and I think it is this that causes the problem. Typical clips may be only 10 seconds long, and no, I don't even think about naming each and every one! I'll re install 1.6.29 pending I hope a further version with the option of enabling/disabling the "two push" scenario. Power down is a handy option so sorry to lose that albeit hopefully not for long. Ron

February 19th, 2011, 08:08 AM	#13
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Ron, For your application, if you want to start and stop so often, it would appear that one of our wired remote controls would be very helpful. Do you already have one? I believe that the switching to the next CompactFlash card signal can only be done via the nanoFlash's record button, not via the remote control (I have not personally tested this yet). If this is true, then if you are not pressing the actual record button on the nanoFlash, then there is no possiblity of accidently activiating a "Hot Swap" request. Other wildlife videographers tell me that this remote control is very helpful. Also, with the remote control we have a mode that is even more useful for you type of shooting: frequent short sequences. The nanoFlash System\|Trigger\|Remote Level opton, if used, will cause the nanoFlash to record when the remote control switch is held down. When released, the nanoFlash stops recording. Thus, if you choose this option, you just hold the remote control switch down to record, release to stop, which would appear to be much easier for you type of shooting. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 19th, 2011, 10:39 AM	#14
Willard Hill Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 191	I was using the wired remote. I have a clip to mount it beside my Canon ZR-1000 on the tripod handle. This was during a heavy snow shower and I had draped a cover over the nanoFlash and most of the camera, so I don't know if I inadvertently hit the record button on the nanoFlash itself (along with punching the remote button) or not, but I was using the remote to fire the camera. I had not reported the problem yet as I thought it was possibly a one time glitch. I will test it when I have time to see if I can duplicate the problem. __________________ Willard http://pawildlifephotographer.blogspot.com/

February 19th, 2011, 10:41 AM	#15
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Willard, Thank you, I look forward to your test results. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia