nanoFlash for Playout - settings..?

[Andy Mangrum]

Hello Ron,

Unfortunately our Software Engineer who designed the file converter is on Vacation till Tuesday, I will try to track down the -11 Error between now and then.

As for the File being 1/2 the Size unless it has changed from the latest update, all nanoFlash Files when exported out of Final Cut Pro X are rendered as 50Mb XDCAM regardless of the Original bit rate,

We are working with Apple to hopefully have this fixed in the future. since this was not an issue with Final Cut 7,

Also this may be something going on with how Final Cut X Exports files, I will try to do a test in our lab within the next week.

Best Regards

[Ronald Jackson]

Thanks Andy,

My deadline was to have been Wednesday but I've been able to postpone it a week. Hope your man can fix the problem.

A bit deflating to say the least to hear that FCP X only exports at 50Mbps, rather defeats the object of owning a nanoFlash, particularly if used with say a Canon XF 305 which already has native 50Mbps.

I have noticed though that my initial export out of FCP X, a QT .mov sequence, did mirror the size of the original files derived from the nano, which were 100Mbps. Whereas the XDCAM 4:2:2 export was half the size. Does this mean that perhaps 100Mbps has been preserved?

Playing both files size by size on this admittedly small screen 24 inch iMac shows no discernible difference in picture quality.

IF, a big IF, there is this .mov scope for maintaining the original bit rate then can it be made possible to playout .mov on the nanoFlash?

Ron

[Ronald Jackson]

Apologies for currently hogging this forum but I am mistaken in saying that a QT.mov sequence out of FCP X mirrors that on the nanoflash. In fact the exported QT file is larger.
I checked this with a 235 MB clip off the nano which became 129 Mb when exported as XDCAM 4:2:2 but 277 MB when exported as a QT.mov.

Ron

ps a safe and healthy New Year to one and all

[Andy Mangrum]

Hello Ron,

That is very interesting, I will try to do a test or find a work around for you in our lab today.

If you check Movie inspector Properties on the exported file what does it list?

Best Regards

[Ronald Jackson]

May not have time today for a look as my FCP X crashed on me yesterday mid editing and will have to re-do the project via FCP X which appears to be okay, though of course minus that all important edited timeline, if I access it via the "other user" of this iMac.

It is easy enough to replicate what I did, starting off with recording a clip from an XLH1 to a nanoFlash at 1080/25psf (If your H1 has PAL) then importing this to FCP X "Video Properties Set Automatically based on first video clip"

Ron

[Ronald Jackson]

Any progress Andy? Even more of an issue when one realises that it is impossible to burn a 1080/25p Blu -Ray disc and the Western Digital Media Player similarly will only handle a 1080/24p signal.

About time the powers that be, Sony and the like, were reminded of the relative size of the PAL and NTSC markets. A bit like comparing football (association) with baseball,


Ron

[Simon Wood]

Hi Ronald,
Just wondering what you mean when you say no 25p bluray output (don't you usually select 50i as the format and it will still show as progressive)?

[Ronald Jackson]

Not so sure I understand your query Simon. The settings on my XLHI are 25f, and on my nanoFlash , 1080/25psf.

I bring this into FCP X "natively" and FCP X "converts" to Apple Pro-Res 4:2:2 1080/25p.

In the absence of suitable Mac software I bring this footage into Toast Titanium 11. When I then Burn a BD via Toast this results in 720/50p, not quite what I want, to say the least.

Are you saying that I should shoot 1080/50i and that if I do I can burn a BD off this?

The gist of this thread of course is that I, and presumably others, cannot currently use our nanoFlashes to playback edited footage. There is also the ancillary difficulty that FCP X apparently will only output edited footage at 50Mbps maximum, negating, on the face of it, a lot of the reasons to use a nanoFlash.

Ron

[Simon Wood]

Originally Posted by Ronald Jackson

Not so sure I understand your query Simon. The settings on my XLHI are 25f, and on my nanoFlash , 1080/25psf.

I bring this into FCP X "natively" and FCP X "converts" to Apple Pro-Res 4:2:2 1080/25p.

Sorry, I meant that when shooting in 1080 25f I was under the impression that the normal workflow for BluRay delivery would be to export it as 1080 50i (which would essentially be 25p in a 50i wrapper). Leastways that was my understanding when I worked on a project a couple of years back and this was the workflow used by the editor.

[Dan Keaton]

Dear Ron,

I believe you are experiencing the differences between Final Pro Pro and Final Cut Pro X.

With Final Cut Pro you have multiple options.

1. You can edit our nanoFlash files in XDCam 422 CBR 50 Mbps.

Our files will be the bit rate you recorded, which could be greater than 50 Mbps, up until you render them.

If the files are just cut, but not color corrected, cropped or filters applied, then the full-bit rate will be sent out to the rendered file.

2. You can edit our nanoFlash files, in Final Cut Pro 6.0.3 or higher (6 or 7, but not X).

The same condition as I outlined above apply.

You just need to drop our files into the FCP timeline.

3. You can, using FCP 6 or 7 use a HD-SDI or HDMI Interface and record the edited file sequence on your nanoFlash at any bit-rate.

But, Apple did not give advance notice to any of the HD-SDI or HDMI Interface companies when they released FCP X.

Thus, if you are using FCP X, you may have to wait for the hardware to be developed to obtain a HD-SDI or HDMI interface.

Ron, were you using FCP 6 or 7 before?

At this time, I feel that FCP X is very limiting for professional applications.

Note: I am not a full-fledged FCP or FCP X expert. I welcome corrections to any of my above statements.

Also, I have been working with Andy, our Lab Manager, and he is going to run some tests for you.

[Andy Mangrum]

Hello Ronald,

Sorry for the Delayed response,

I was able to run a test today, and with nanoFlash 100Mb footage when exported as XDCAM it is re compressed down to 50Mb,

Granted you can export the same Footage as Pro Res, or DVC PRO, but Final Cut Pro X does not have an to Export without re compression, at this time,

Also it still does not support Capture Cards, as well as other tools that where present in Final Cut Pro 7

Hope That Helps

[Ronald Jackson]

Thanks Dan and Andy. I do have FCP 7, found it rather user hostile which is why I got FCP X. Will have to have a go at getting into 7. X is a doddle to use but then short on so many features including, as you say, for those who are after being able to export in the highest quality, to say nothing of being able to conform 25p into 24p via "Cinema Tools".

Seems Apple have gone off half cock on this one, maybe the control freakery which appeared such a characteristic of Apple Corp in its attitude to its customers will take a back seat now. Their current advertising guff does not inspire a lot of confidence, in me anyway, that their perceived market is other than kids who like to gurn into their iPhones and bods who have just discovered that their DSLR has a video button.


Ron