Using the nanoFlash for software tutorials

Adam Stanislav · February 21st, 2010, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Keaton

We await your results using the ATI card.

I ordered the HDMI - mini HDMI cable from B&H this morning. It is expected to arrive on Friday. Assuming it does, I will be testing it either on Friday or Saturday. And I will post my results as soon as I finish.

Dave Chalmers · February 22nd, 2010, 06:08 AM

Hi all,

Just to mention that another approach to this issue is to buy the Blackmagic Design DVI extender unit, which acts as a monitor and requests the correct resolution from the graphics card. It then outputs HDSDI which can be recorded by the nF.

Blackmagic Design: DVI Extender

OK, it's another $395, but it may let you use the nF with a wider range of graphics cards.

Dave

Mario Vermunt · February 22nd, 2010, 07:16 AM

Wy bother to try to connect the nanoFlash to your computer? There are a lot of free 'screenrecorders' available (softwaretool) that does a great job in capturing what's going on on your screen (p.e. camstudio).

Dan Keaton · February 22nd, 2010, 07:30 AM

Dear Dave,

Did this work for you?

If so, what graphics card were you using?

It would also be nice to know the resolution and frame rate settings.

Adam Stanislav · February 22nd, 2010, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Chalmers

Just to mention that another approach to this issue is to buy the Blackmagic Design DVI extender unit, which acts as a monitor and requests the correct resolution from the graphics card. It then outputs HDSDI which can be recorded by the nF.

Hi, Dave,

Very interesting. I have almost ordered it but then I noticed it uses 3GB/s SDI. I do not believe that the nF could work with that. If it could, this would be the perfect answer to my needs.

Maybe Dan can confirm (or deny) it would work.

Adam Stanislav · February 22nd, 2010, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mario Vermunt

Wy bother to try to connect the nanoFlash to your computer?

Because the software tools you are mentioning (and which I mentioned in the original post of this thread) are not as great as you may think.

Take a look at this video. In it, I was playing a midi composition of mine. The computer was displaying each note as it was playing it. I was capturing it with that software. Now, at the beginning of the capture the video and the sound are perfectly synchronized, but toward the end the video is lagging behind the sound.

Of course, on my computer the video and the audio were in perfect sync from start to finish. But in the capture they were not. And in some other compositions I have done the synchronization was even worse.

Now, that may be fine for a YouTube video (though it bothers me), but it is unacceptable for professional work.

And that is just one of the reasons.

Dan Keaton · February 22nd, 2010, 12:55 PM

Dear Adam,

3G HD-SDI devices almost always work with the much more common 1.485 Gigabit per second flavor of HD-SDI.

I have not tested the device, so I do not know if it will work or not.

Also, the nanoFlash was special circuitry to handshake with the device sending the HDMI signal.

If this has been tested and actually solves the problem, then great. I do not see why it would be necessary.

However, it could be that the Blackmagic unit is more tolerant of an out-of-spec signal from your computer.

Adam Stanislav · February 22nd, 2010, 02:29 PM

Thanks, Dan.

Then it should work. According to their documentation, the DVI Extender should work with nVidia cards. Note that they work with DVI, not HDMI.

Also, I have updated the driver for my GeForce 6200 TurboCache. It now lists 1080p and 1080i, both 60 Hz as possible modes. I will wait till my mini HDMI adapters arrive to test both my desktop and laptop via HDMI.

Nevertheless, the DVI Extender seems like a very useful device to have even if it turns out I can use my nF directly with my computer.

Adam Stanislav · February 22nd, 2010, 03:55 PM

I see the same company also offers an HDMI to SDI "mini" converter. I wonder which would be more more useful in the long run, the DVI Extender or the HDMI converter.

Adam Stanislav · February 26th, 2010, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Keaton

We await your results using the ATI card.

I have tested it and am uploading the results to YouTube. Alas, I seem to have a very slow connection, as it is saying it will be uploaded in three and a half hours. And since it is midnight, I am just going to leave my laptop on and am going to bed.

But, presumably, the test results should be available within a few hours of this post on my YouTube channel. The name of the video is nanoFlash Test 1.

Adam Stanislav · February 26th, 2010, 08:50 AM

Here are the results of the nanoFlash with ATI test. Best viewed at 720p HD and in full screen.

Adam Stanislav · February 26th, 2010, 03:45 PM

And here is my nVidia test.

Adam Stanislav · February 26th, 2010, 09:06 PM

Hmmm... No reaction to my tests from Dan???

Dan Keaton · February 27th, 2010, 03:11 AM

Dear Adam,

I am sorry it took me so long to respond.

I was swamped working on a special project yesterday.

I watched both videos. I was very pleased that you found a Graphics card that worked with the nanoFlash.

On the second video, there was an audio problem, I heard the audio multiple times.

I did not comment since I thought you would detect the problem then repost the clip.

Are you going out via HDMI or DVI. If you are using DVI, then there is no audio, and you have to get audio in via the analog audio inputs. Even so, the audio appeared to me to be a computer setup issue, not something that the nanoFlash would normally cause.

(But, this is too early to tell the cause of the audio problem.)

Did you hear an audio problem was it just me?

Adam Stanislav · February 27th, 2010, 10:07 AM

An audio problem? I will have to re-listen to it, but I added the audio in Vegas. The nanoFlash did not pick any audio in either test. It seems my laptop is rather finicky about passing the audio via HDMI: I finally managed to let the audio through last night but did not want to upload that one to YouTube for privacy issues. I will find another source and post that. And yes, the laptop has an HDMI port built in.

The one from my desktop (the nVidia) had no audio because it was coming from a DVI port with an adapter cable.

I still need to figure out how to convince my laptop to go all the way to 1080p or at least 1080i. It forces 720p at 60 fps. Yesterday I also received the Blackmagic HDMI to SDI adapter. That one seems to get 720p at 30 fps but no sound yet. All in all, it seems I do not really need the Blackmagic adapter. I am actually quite annoyed at Blackmagic. It is http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/620830-REG/Blackmagic_Design_CONVMBHS_Mini_Converter_HDMI_to.html yet it does not come with any docs, software, or a USB cable: I had to download the docs and the software from their web site and use a USB cable I already had. And the software did nothing. The docs were about how to use the software but not the device itself.

Anyway, I will perform further tests, but both nVidia and ATI worked with the nanoFlash.

The first time I was working with the ATI (where I was playing the card game), it was recording nicely but it kept flashing a message about an "intermittent source". After that, I downloaded the latest ATI driver, rebooted the computer and did the second part of the ATI test (going to YouTube and recording a video of the browser) and this time, the nF did not flash the message.

The nVidia card has the most recent driver as well. I just installed it last week. This driver has added the support for 1080 "TV" and, as the test showed, it works. So, I still have to wonder if all those nVidia cards you mentioned did not work would work now with the latest driver software.

I also found that when I nearly filled up my card (SanDisk Extreme 60 MB/s, 32 GB), the nF would say there was no card. I moved about 9 GB from the card to my computer, but the nF still thought the card was full. I did not have enough space on my hard drive for it all, so I burned some files to a DVD 9, deleted them from the card, then moved the rest of the files to my hard drive. Even then I had trouble formatting the card in the nF, which kept saying something about an unrecognized card (I do not remember the exact words, it was late and I was ready for bed). I had to take the card out and stick it in several times until it finally agreed to format it. This worries me as it is not always possible to prevent applications from modifying the contents of the card (Vegas in particular likes to write to the card when you place something on its timeline directly from the card).

P.S. I just went to YouTube and I did not hear the audio multiple times. Is it possible you had the second video open in several browser windows at the same time? Then you would only see it once in whatever window was active, but you would hear the audio from each of them, overlapping. That is a common YouTube quirk.

February 22nd, 2010, 06:08 AM	#32
Dave Chalmers Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: GLASGOW, UK Posts: 71	Could try BMD DVI extender?? Hi all, Just to mention that another approach to this issue is to buy the Blackmagic Design DVI extender unit, which acts as a monitor and requests the correct resolution from the graphics card. It then outputs HDSDI which can be recorded by the nF. Blackmagic Design: DVI Extender OK, it's another $395, but it may let you use the nF with a wider range of graphics cards. Dave

February 22nd, 2010, 07:30 AM	#34
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Dave, Did this work for you? If so, what graphics card were you using? It would also be nice to know the resolution and frame rate settings. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 22nd, 2010, 12:55 PM	#37
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Adam, 3G HD-SDI devices almost always work with the much more common 1.485 Gigabit per second flavor of HD-SDI. I have not tested the device, so I do not know if it will work or not. Also, the nanoFlash was special circuitry to handshake with the device sending the HDMI signal. If this has been tested and actually solves the problem, then great. I do not see why it would be necessary. However, it could be that the Blackmagic unit is more tolerant of an out-of-spec signal from your computer. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 27th, 2010, 03:11 AM	#44
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Adam, I am sorry it took me so long to respond. I was swamped working on a special project yesterday. I watched both videos. I was very pleased that you found a Graphics card that worked with the nanoFlash. On the second video, there was an audio problem, I heard the audio multiple times. I did not comment since I thought you would detect the problem then repost the clip. Are you going out via HDMI or DVI. If you are using DVI, then there is no audio, and you have to get audio in via the analog audio inputs. Even so, the audio appeared to me to be a computer setup issue, not something that the nanoFlash would normally cause. (But, this is too early to tell the cause of the audio problem.) Did you hear an audio problem was it just me? __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 22nd, 2010, 07:16 AM	#33
Mario Vermunt Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Rotterdam, the Netherlands Posts: 77	Wy bother to try to connect the nanoFlash to your computer? There are a lot of free 'screenrecorders' available (softwaretool) that does a great job in capturing what's going on on your screen (p.e. camstudio).

February 22nd, 2010, 02:29 PM	#38
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	Thanks, Dan. Then it should work. According to their documentation, the DVI Extender should work with nVidia cards. Note that they work with DVI, not HDMI. Also, I have updated the driver for my GeForce 6200 TurboCache. It now lists 1080p and 1080i, both 60 Hz as possible modes. I will wait till my mini HDMI adapters arrive to test both my desktop and laptop via HDMI. Nevertheless, the DVI Extender seems like a very useful device to have even if it turns out I can use my nF directly with my computer.

February 22nd, 2010, 03:55 PM	#39
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	I see the same company also offers an HDMI to SDI "mini" converter. I wonder which would be more more useful in the long run, the DVI Extender or the HDMI converter.

February 26th, 2010, 08:50 AM	#41
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	Here are the results of the nanoFlash with ATI test. Best viewed at 720p HD and in full screen.

February 26th, 2010, 03:45 PM	#42
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	And here is my nVidia test.

February 26th, 2010, 09:06 PM	#43
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	Hmmm... No reaction to my tests from Dan???

February 27th, 2010, 10:07 AM	#45
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	An audio problem? I will have to re-listen to it, but I added the audio in Vegas. The nanoFlash did not pick any audio in either test. It seems my laptop is rather finicky about passing the audio via HDMI: I finally managed to let the audio through last night but did not want to upload that one to YouTube for privacy issues. I will find another source and post that. And yes, the laptop has an HDMI port built in. The one from my desktop (the nVidia) had no audio because it was coming from a DVI port with an adapter cable. I still need to figure out how to convince my laptop to go all the way to 1080p or at least 1080i. It forces 720p at 60 fps. Yesterday I also received the Blackmagic HDMI to SDI adapter. That one seems to get 720p at 30 fps but no sound yet. All in all, it seems I do not really need the Blackmagic adapter. I am actually quite annoyed at Blackmagic. It is http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/620830-REG/Blackmagic_Design_CONVMBHS_Mini_Converter_HDMI_to.html yet it does not come with any docs, software, or a USB cable: I had to download the docs and the software from their web site and use a USB cable I already had. And the software did nothing. The docs were about how to use the software but not the device itself. Anyway, I will perform further tests, but both nVidia and ATI worked with the nanoFlash. The first time I was working with the ATI (where I was playing the card game), it was recording nicely but it kept flashing a message about an "intermittent source". After that, I downloaded the latest ATI driver, rebooted the computer and did the second part of the ATI test (going to YouTube and recording a video of the browser) and this time, the nF did not flash the message. The nVidia card has the most recent driver as well. I just installed it last week. This driver has added the support for 1080 "TV" and, as the test showed, it works. So, I still have to wonder if all those nVidia cards you mentioned did not work would work now with the latest driver software. I also found that when I nearly filled up my card (SanDisk Extreme 60 MB/s, 32 GB), the nF would say there was no card. I moved about 9 GB from the card to my computer, but the nF still thought the card was full. I did not have enough space on my hard drive for it all, so I burned some files to a DVD 9, deleted them from the card, then moved the rest of the files to my hard drive. Even then I had trouble formatting the card in the nF, which kept saying something about an unrecognized card (I do not remember the exact words, it was late and I was ready for bed). I had to take the card out and stick it in several times until it finally agreed to format it. This worries me as it is not always possible to prevent applications from modifying the contents of the card (Vegas in particular likes to write to the card when you place something on its timeline directly from the card). P.S. I just went to YouTube and I did not hear the audio multiple times. Is it possible you had the second video open in several browser windows at the same time? Then you would only see it once in whatever window was active, but you would hear the audio from each of them, overlapping. That is a common YouTube quirk.